New nurses wanted.

We need new nurses. We need people with strength of character, intelligence, and drive. So who says they're being driven away? Nurses General Nursing Article

I have just read a post in a Nursing Specialties forum on Staff Development that makes reference to the need to recognize and nurture new nurses because the nursing-eat-their-young attitude is so widespread. I went to respond to that but realized it might see more eyes here.

As a clarification, it is critically important to know that someone who has a bad experience is likely to tell the story 25 times, while someone with a good one is likely to tell that story only 5 times. If therefore you apply this algorithm to the posts complaining of wretched treatment at the hands of old meanies who don't remember what it is to have a dreeeeaaaammmmm and passsssssiooonnnn, then you come out with a more realistic picture.

Language is also critically important. Using words like, "It has been a chronic problem that has driven new nurses to leave nursing areas they had aspired to work in, and oftentimes caused new nurses to leave the nursing field entirely. No one knows how many talented people have been driven from the field of nursing, but it seems to be a widespread problem if all the articles and discussion in nursing forums is representative of most nursing environments" makes assumptions on facts not in evidence. "Seem(ing) to be a widespread problem" only works if you believe that "all the articles and discussion is representative of most nursing environments." (emphasis added here and below). Data, please. What's the source of that information?

There are many threads and posts on AN that describe awesome experiences and workplaces, yet this assertion of "all the articles and discussion" clearly ignores them. There is ample evidence of older nurses here and at work supporting, teaching, and mentoring younger ones, on their own time, for free, late at night when they ought to be in bed, precisely because they want to nurture new nurses. We know they are our future, and we want them to be good. At the same time, there are multiple posts from new nurses that can bitterly dishearten the seasoned thoughtful practitioner, posts that indicate low levels of preparation, high levels of neediness and entitlement, unrealistic expectations of the realities of bedside work, and inability to adapt to the labor market.

Those older, seasoned, and experienced practitioners express their dismay at these attitudes in many ways, from light-hearted banter to bitter and heartbroken rant. The resulting wails are instructive-- and demonstrative of a problem that has generally nothing whatsoever to do with young-eating. Perhaps some of those "many talented people" (in whose estimation? their own?) are "oftentimes" "driven" away by other factors than this seriously-overused and incredible (in the definition of the word, meaning, "not believable," not "rad, totally awesome, duuude") sound bite. Beware the shallow thinker who prefers sound bites to thoughtful analysis; do not be that person. We need better critical thinking in nursing. It can start here.

Those of us older and more seasoned nurses know better than to discourage all new nurses from practice. We, better than they, have a clearer vision of being in those beds rather than beside them; we, better than they, have a larger perspective on the world of nursing care. We have already been new nurses. We have already been managers. We have already taken the responsibility of being charge nurses. We have been years at bedsides. We have already seen and participated in disasters, codes, deaths, family tragedies, fights, and labor actions. We know what it takes. We know we need more of us, as we age and leave because we are not able to do it anymore.

We can be pardoned for being scared to death of those soi-disant (this means, in translation, self-described) "talented people" who are unable to (for lack of a better word) hack it at the bedside and do not understand, or try to understand, from whence we come. The perennially-aggrieved give us heartburn; we have no patience with them, we don't have time. We are scared of what will happen to us and our loved ones when the self-esteem movement leaves us with caregivers that need more validation from their patients than they have the fortitude to learn to give them.

We welcome whole-heartedly, unreservedly, new nurses who are willing to put their education in its proper place, planning and providing competent care. We love the one who doesn't come in and say, "I'm just working here for a year so I can go to ICU and then go to CRNA / NP school." We want good nurses; we are willing to help new nurses who want to work wherever there is a need even if it's not their dreeeeaammmm job, and work hard, to grow. We want to work with people who don't have such a twitchy trigger finger, ready to go off with a bang over the least perceived slight. We want colleagues who believe this: Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. (~Ralph Waldo Emerson)

Anyone who wants to be a nurse who has the strength of character to do that, we're ready for you. Are you ready for us? We are already here.

Specializes in Nephrology, Cardiology, ER, ICU.

In this day and age, threatening people as in "snitches end up in ditches" and "you can have a flat tire for three months" will land you in jail in my state. And...that will effectively end your clinical experience too.

wow. icu, ld, er ..... my dream job was to be a pop star!

I (edited the word) . . . . dislike ....pop music ;)............. . ..my dream job would be to sing rock and roll and play a guitar like Eric Clapton. :cool:

In this day and age, threatening people as in "snitches end up in ditches" and "you can have a flat tire for three months" will land you in jail in my state. And...that will effectively end your clinical experience too.

Agree! That made the hairs on the back of my neck stand up.

While I know and have experienced truly rude co-workers, there are ways to never put up with it but you must be professional or you lose all credibility.

I've noticed recently people venting on a very public place like FB about issues at work or school. One friend of mine who is a nurse vented about a teacher in very unflattering phrases, some bordering on violent. This was seen by folks at the hospital and she was reprimanded there for being unprofessional as she was a leader at our workplace and in our small community.

Violent threats are taken rather seriously these days.

Are you kidding me? A Nicki Minaj quote? That is awful haha. But in all seriousness I think the older ******* nurses only discourage the new ones because it makes them feel better. If they are still on the floor at age whatever 50 or 60. They have probably applied and not gotten a few management positions. Those are my thoughts after 5 months in as a new grad on a med surg floor.[/quote']

That is the most redonculous thing I have ever read...first of all, I think you're completely generalizing and lumping "older" nurses into one category by saying that they discourage new nurses. This is simply not the case since I have had exemplary mentors who had 20+ years experience guiding me when I first started and Jo have mentored countless new nurses throughout the years. They definitely didn't coddle or hand hold but rather were strong people who not only possessed great skill but knew how to handle doctors when something came up that warranted their attention.

Secondly, all of these experience nurses have absolutely no interest in pushing paper and entering management but choose to stay at the bedside because they simply want to! There is no hidden agenda with these nurses. Everytime I work with a few of the them on the same shift, I always know that I'm going to learn something valuable from them that day. Granted, not all are like this but generally speaking, a few shouldn't dictate what the group is like as a whole.

After nursing for only five months, it would be a good idea to be more open minded and see what you can learn from them...your practice will benefit from it

We welcome whole-heartedly, unreservedly, new nurses who are willing to put their education in its proper place, planning and providing competent care. We love the one who doesn't come in and say, "I'm just working here for a year so I can go to ICU and then go to CRNA / NP school." We want good nurses; we are willing to help new nurses who want to work wherever there is a need even if it's not their dreeeeaammmm job, and work hard, to grow. We want to work with people who don't have such a twitchy trigger finger, ready to go off with a bang over the least perceived slight. We want colleagues who believe this: Let me never fall into the vulgar mistake of dreaming that I am persecuted whenever I am contradicted. (~Ralph Waldo Emerson)

Anyone who wants to be a nurse who has the strength of character to do that, we're ready for you. Are you ready for us? We are already here.

During my first year, we lost a few nurses since they had found positions they were really interested in which is good for them...but my problem was when they would say things like "this place isn't challenging for me", "who would stay here for more than five years" or "I only took this job for financial reasons" IN FRONT of people who have worked there the majority of their careers, I take issue with that...even if I am fairly new myself since that it flat out disrespectful.

The area might not have been challenging for them since they were not assigned the highly sick patients because they demonstrated behaviors that even made the NM nervous. Some were flat out cocky and didn't ask questions...what is wrong with you?!? When in doubt, ask...don't just do!

Anyways, GrnTea...lovely post!

I am 40 years old and no one will speak to me in that demaenor with out conseqences..and the response has been what are you gonna do run and snitch on me and my response is ohh no snitches end up in ditches but it would be a shame for you care to have a flat for the next 3 months of my training..with a nice bright smile..lol..

i know not nice or tastefull but that surely made the nurse think and redirect her negative energy to more positive criticism..lol

ACY

Really, threats??? Is that supposed to help the situation? In my book, that's significantly worse (and less professional) behavior than that shown by the nurse(s) you are suppposedly confronting. If I were on the receiving end of anything like that from a coworker, I'd be "redirecting my negative energy" to contacting the police.

Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
THe article is interesting but being a new nurse or how ever you want to term it..i have expereinced the dismay, negative attitude, judgemental and overly critical seasoned nurses. I have seen first had, have experienced and have even made it a point to speak my mind when this behaviour happens. Obviously it is not every where and every floor but there are seasoned nurses and I am not necessarily speaking of nurses who have been 10+ years; i have seen it experienced it from nurses who have only been on the job 1+ year..

It is disgusting cause no one no matter what stage of your career deserves to be treated with such disgust..

Seasoned nurses often forget what it is to be a new nurse and only knowing how the school instructed you whcih is usally outdated.

I refused to be belittled by a nurse no matter how seasoned they are. I am here to elarn from you, take constructive criticism and yes i will make mistakes, and will be slower and will hold the progress up and at times i do understand you asking em to step aside cause there is a time crunch but i refuse to accept the negative and ****** attitude.

I exepreinced this as a new nurses as well as when i was doing my clinical rotations at the hospital...I had several seasonced nurses during my clinical rotaiton who simply told me they do not have time for me and asked me to simply sit at the nurses station cause they were tired of training..but in front of there supervisor or nurses manager their who demeanor changes and as soon as they exit they revert back to the disguisting individual they are.

I know this happens every where and every industry to a point it just seems more prevalent in the nursing industry.

So before everyone chimes in on how this is just an urban legend it is not..those nurses that behave this way know who they are.

I personally had to call a seasoned nurse out not during work hours but after a shift and we are walking to the car i have stopped the nruse and in the most polite way have expressed my dismay and some apologize and some have simply told me this is not a career for the weak. and my response has been if you are going to dish out negativity and expect me because i am a new nurse to take it as a rite of passage you have mistaken me for an 18 year old..I am 40 years old and no one will speak to me in that demaenor with out conseqences..and the response has been what are you gonna do run and snitch on me and my response is ohh no snitches end up in ditches but it would be a shame for you care to have a flat for the next 3 months of my training..with a nice bright smile..lol..

i know not nice or tastefull but that surely made the nurse think and redirect her negative energy to more positive criticism..lol

ACY

I'm not sure where you're getting your data that "seasoned nurses often forget what it is to be a new nurse." I can assure you that after more than three decades, I have not forgotten. I have very vivid memories of my first days as a brand new nurse. New nurses, however, have no idea what it's like to be a seasoned nurse tasked with orienting a new grad and keeping up with a patient assignment that may or may not consider the new nurse's need to be walked through the steps of many of the procedures we'll do that day.

I'm also unsure where you've gotten the data that seasoned nurses don't know anything except how their school instructed them, and that their information is usually updated. Most of the seasoned nurses I know take advantage of the myriad opportunities for continuing education which are available and are very up-to-date in our specialty.

Your post evokes an attitude of disrespect for the experienced nurses -- to the point of threatening behavior. I sincerely hope that you didn't seriously threaten that nurse with damage to her tires. That is beyond a refusal to tolerate negative behavior -- threats should not be tolerated.

Specializes in ICU/CCU/CVICU.
THe article is interesting but being a new nurse or how ever you want to term it..i have expereinced the dismay, negative attitude, judgemental and overly critical seasoned nurses. I have seen first had, have experienced and have even made it a point to speak my mind when this behaviour happens. Obviously it is not every where and every floor but there are seasoned nurses and I am not necessarily speaking of nurses who have been 10+ years; i have seen it experienced it from nurses who have only been on the job 1+ year..

It is disgusting cause no one no matter what stage of your career deserves to be treated with such disgust..

Seasoned nurses often forget what it is to be a new nurse and only knowing how the school instructed you whcih is usally outdated.

I refused to be belittled by a nurse no matter how seasoned they are. I am here to elarn from you, take constructive criticism and yes i will make mistakes, and will be slower and will hold the progress up and at times i do understand you asking em to step aside cause there is a time crunch but i refuse to accept the negative and ****** attitude.

I exepreinced this as a new nurses as well as when i was doing my clinical rotations at the hospital...I had several seasonced nurses during my clinical rotaiton who simply told me they do not have time for me and asked me to simply sit at the nurses station cause they were tired of training..but in front of there supervisor or nurses manager their who demeanor changes and as soon as they exit they revert back to the disguisting individual they are.

I know this happens every where and every industry to a point it just seems more prevalent in the nursing industry.

So before everyone chimes in on how this is just an urban legend it is not..those nurses that behave this way know who they are.

I personally had to call a seasoned nurse out not during work hours but after a shift and we are walking to the car i have stopped the nruse and in the most polite way have expressed my dismay and some apologize and some have simply told me this is not a career for the weak. and my response has been if you are going to dish out negativity and expect me because i am a new nurse to take it as a rite of passage you have mistaken me for an 18 year old..I am 40 years old and no one will speak to me in that demaenor with out conseqences..and the response has been what are you gonna do run and snitch on me and my response is ohh no snitches end up in ditches but it would be a shame for you care to have a flat for the next 3 months of my training..with a nice bright smile..lol..

i know not nice or tastefull but that surely made the nurse think and redirect her negative energy to more positive criticism..lol

ACY

This is by far the most unprofessional statement I have read on this site.

Specializes in Nursing Education, CVICU, Float Pool.

Sometimes I just smh at some of these posts and posters. It's so hard to believe some people on here are functioning adults. However there are some good points that were brought out in the article and by some of the other posters. I think there is often a gap between newer nurses and experienced ones that can make them working together difficult. It can come from both ways honestly.

Specializes in ICU.

I don't mind helping new nurses as long as they put their cell phone up while at work. It is very disheartening to be speaking to a new nurse and they actually ANSWER their cell phone while you are in mid-sentence! And note I did not say "young nurse," I said "new nurse." I have this cell phone problem with all ages. I hate the constant peck peck peck of texting, and the constant vibrating of a call or new message. If I am in the middle of trying to teach you something, please put the phone away and listen to me. If I approach you and want to discuss something work related, please at least look up from your phone and acknowledge me. If you are pecking away at your phone, or smiling/laughing at something on your phone, then no, I probably won't try to talk to you because I feel put-off. Also, please learn THIS job, not the one you hope to have someday. And lastly, I do bedside nursing because I want to, not because I couldn't get a "management job." I have a business degree, too, and have been in management. My first degree was accounting and business administration, for Pete's sake!

Specializes in Med-Surg, NICU.

While I agree with some of this post, from my personal experience, the most bitter and callous nurses I have come across are the same ones most removed from nursing school. That is not to say that all seasoned nurses are this way, but I have found that I have had more positive relationships with younger nurses than older ones for this particular reason. I think this can be said in MANY fields, so this isn't just directed to nurses (though it is probably a bigger issue in a field where people feel undervalued and unappreciated).

Also...

"I'm just working here for a year so I can go to ICU and then go to CRNA / NP school."

There is nothing wrong with people wanting to advance themselves in their practice and education. In fact, in this economy where there is a glut of new nurses and the bedside wages are stagnant, it is probably a smart move to further one's education; it opens up more doors and a higher income and more flexibility in the job market. I would like to start grad school as soon as possible because I want to be finished with school prior to starting a family.

That being said, I see what you are saying.

We, better than they, have a clearer vision of being in those beds rather than beside them;

I disagree with this on so many levels. I'm not even a nurse (yet), but I have been in those beds multiple times, once with a urinary catheter, potassium levels at a dangerously low level, hair falling out, charcoal in the stomach and in utter despair after trying to take my life. You don't need to have dozens of years of experience at the bedside to know what it is like to be a patient.

Specializes in Pediatrics, Emergency, Trauma.
I'm not even a nurse (yet), but I have been in those beds multiple times, once with a urinary catheter, potassium levels at a dangerously low level, hair falling out, charcoal in the stomach and in utter despair after trying to take my life. You don't need to have dozens of years of experience at the bedside to know what it is like to be a patient.

^..."And this is what makes for a better nurse"

-my nursing instructor (20+ years experience), when I wrote my essay about my near death experience when I was a LPN...;)

EXPERIENCE makes for a better nurse. :)

Specializes in ICU.
The trainwrecks are everywhere. and we have many new grads. they are split up. i dealt with it fine as have others. if i am to get them all now and still be expected to be at newer nurses beck and call i should be paid more. cant do your job then quit. they dont give the new attendings only easy pts...... you are a nurse , done with orientation, you get the same type of assignments as everyone else or should. we dont dump all the trainwrecks on the new grads or float nurses or any other paranoid victim memtality group. i can see that being the case for some, but on our floor you get what you get.

I see your point and I don't have problems with trainwrecks even while being an orientee. I thrive under pressure and genuinely enjoy being busy. I prefer to work independently and don't require hand-holding so much as occasional clarification.......And although I really have no specific aspirations, my nurse manager recently told me that she would expect to see me in critical care in the not so distant future. I'm not entirely sure what that says about me as a new nurse, but I did find it interesting when I heard it. I also know that I am the exception and not the rule - so in that, I can definitely see where you're coming from.

I do also see a few other newbies around me legitimately struggling and from an outside perspective it is clear (with one at least for certain) that much of that struggle is exacerbated by her having a preceptor who isn't very involved, though I'm sure her own hesitation and low level of confidence in herself plays a significant part as well. I wouldn't go so far as to describe her as possessing a "paranoid victim mentality" though, because for her, the scenario I described is very much a reality.