I remember being taught in nursing school the rights of medication administration -
Right patient
Right medication
Right dose
Right route
Right time
Right documentation
Right situation
Right place
RIGHT TO REFUSE.
I also remember my nursing instructor stressing how important number 9 is and that we as nurses have a duty to ensure that the right to refuse any medical care or medication is honored and upheld. To advocate for our patients and protect them. Protect them from what you may ask? To protect them from other medical professionals and “people” who think they can bully, manipulate, control and dominate any patient to force a medication, procedure or any type of medical care.
And wouldn’t you know that this RIGHT to refuse has been what I have had to defend more than anything? As an RN of more than a decade, I will forever support the right to choose and also the right to REFUSE any form of medical care. I can’t believe anyone feels that mandates of any form of medicine or medical practice or procedure is acceptable. Even more shocked that some nurses and NURSE LEADERS feel this is acceptable after a career of fighting for, defending and advocating for our patients rights.
Forced healthcare is NOT healthcare and I stand for the freedom this country was founded on. I have stood for my patients right to choose. And now that nurses and other healthcare workers rights are being threatened, I stand for their right to choose as well. COERCION is not CONSENT.
Which one are you talking about? There are 176 covid vaccines available or in trials across the world. AFAIK every country in the world is promoting vaccinating against covid and countries are using many different vaccines.
I meant getting the vaccine not necessarily a specific one. The action not the substance.
You expressed thoughts and doubts and opinions and I answered them. Yeah...you don't seem to understand why these vaccine are pushed right now instead of the polio vaccine (for instance)...you said so in your remark.
You expressed the same sort of doubt that Carlson is pushing...his commentary isn't a hidden mystery and he isn't alone in right wing programing in efforts to generate doubt and highlight individual "freedoms" over civic or patriotic duty.
If I don't understand explain, not off hand insult me by saying I watch Tucker.
There was nothing rude or disrespectful about my response to your concerns and questions.
By brining up Tucker, you are attempting to asign me to a negative character so none of my contributions will be seen as valid or worth consideration. Because anyone who watches Tucker is a right wing, Trumper GOP conspiracy theorist, so that means anyone who watches him is also that. You may think your tactics are cleaver and sneaky but they are not. Again!! Great job for not talking about Trump!
I meant getting the vaccine not necessarily a specific one. The action not the substance.
You are wondering why, across the world, in the midst of a pandemic that has killed more than four and a half million people, healthcare professionals and governments are encouraging people to get one of the many readily available and extremely effective vaccinations? This seems suspect to you?
I've asked YOU before, show me how many reinfected people are being hospitalized and dying. Still haven't seen anything......
speaking of unanswered questions do you remember the one above in bold? You don't have an answer to that right?
I've never said how long after infection somebody should or should not be vaccinated. That's not for me to decide. I said I could appreciate someone deferring vaccination after infection under certain circumstances.
Your argument is presented in a way that suggests natural immunity isn't good enough. Is that your conclusion and if so, why?
Perhaps you're misunderstanding my position to be completely against vaccination. It isn't.
I've answered that before, but I'll expand on my previous answer if you wish.
According to a study which you have referenced and appear to support, during a period when it would be expected that most previous infections would provide substantial protection, the rate of reinfection was about 1% compared to just under 4% in the general population. The case fatality rate was actually higher in those previously infected compared to those who were not previously infected (3% vs 1.8%)
That's what we know of optimal protection from reinfection: within a year of previous infection and with the same variant circulating as they were previously infected with.
As for when someone should be vaccinated after previous infection, I would agree that's something to defer to the experts, their view is that it should not be delayed due to previous infection.
What do you mean by homeopathic protection? I’m confused.
Homeopathic ”drugs” are biochemically inert. They are so diluted that it’s just water. You can’t treat any condition or disease with them. They have no plausible mechanism of action or effect beyond placebo. Or perhaps you weren’t really referring to homeopathic ”drugs”? Did you mean that the unvaccinated try to treat ”like with like” by getting a Covid-19 infection instead of a vaccine? If that’s what you meant, getting protection with the help of a vaccine is much safer than trying to get natural immunity through an infection.
This is how you reply to an idea ! To the point, respectful and not insulting or derogatory. !!
I've answered that before, but I'll expand on my previous answer if you wish.
According to a study which you have referenced and appear to support, during a period when it would be expected that most previous infections would provide substantial protection, the rate of reinfection was about 1% compared to just under 4% in the general population. The case fatality rate was actually higher in those previously infected compared to those who were not previously infected (3% vs 1.8%)
That's what we know of optimal protection from reinfection: within a year of previous infection and with the same variant circulating as they were previously infected with.
As for when someone should be vaccinated after previous infection, I would agree that's something to defer to the experts, their view is that it should not be delayed due to previous infection.
First of all I didn't cite that reference but thank you for sharing. After reading that article it reports A 0.7% infection rate and 2 deaths out of 9119.
It also says:
"Compared with patients who were excluded, patients who were included in the analysis were more likely to aged >65 years, African-American or Hispanic, and have higher proportion of those with hypertension, diabetes mellitus, atrial fibrillation, nicotine dependence, hyperlipidemia, prior stroke, COPD, asthma, and chronic kidney disease. "
When it comes to your support for blanket mandates and dismissing natural immunity, what am I missing? I really do mean that, what did I miss?
What do you mean by homeopathic protection? I’m confused.
Homeopathic ”drugs” are biochemically inert. They are so diluted that it’s just water. You can’t treat any condition or disease with them. They have no plausible mechanism of action or effect beyond placebo. Or perhaps you weren’t really referring to homeopathic ”drugs”? Did you mean that the unvaccinated try to treat ”like with like” by getting a Covid-19 infection instead of a vaccine? If that’s what you meant, getting protection with the help of a vaccine is much safer than trying to get natural immunity through an infection.
The tone in this response is the example of the hostility that is disheartening.
Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.
8 hours ago, Cclm said:
I am fully vaccinated have have been an outspoken advocate for all the childhood disease vaccines. I do find it strange that this covid vaccine is being pushed so hard. Why this one? Why not any of the others? The childhood diseases are much worse than covid and there is several. Also, never in my life did I think I would come across a situation as a nurse that someone might not have the right to refuse to be injected with a drug. Or be congratulated because I got injected with a medication.
When I got my covid shot, the nurse congratulated me. Now I think she was just being positive but I found it very odd. I would never say congratulations to a patient after I give them s med.
I don't think there's any conspiracy, I think everyone needs to get vaxed, however there is some oddities with this that makes me a bit uncomfortable.
She may have congratulated you because the latest message I'm seeing is that we're supposed to couch our science-based advice with kindness and understanding, and to reason with anti-vaxxers and make sure they aren't offended by our approach.
Thus, her admittedly odd response may have been in the manner, of "Good job! You did it!"
I think the patience and reasoning approach is perfectly appropriate for a small percentage of people, who genuinely are confused rather than seeking to promote an agenda in which reason will never work, or asking open-ended questions whose point is certainly to cast suspicion on some unnamed, shadowy forces.
I do find it strange that this covid vaccine is being pushed so hard. Why this one? Why not any of the others?
She may have congratulated you because the latest message I'm seeing is that we're supposed to couch our science-based advice with kindness and understanding, and to reason with anti-vaxxers and make sure they aren't offended by our approach.
Thus, her admittedly odd response may have been in the manner, of "Good job! You did it!"
I think the patience and reasoning approach is perfectly appropriate for a small percentage of people, who genuinely are confused rather than seeking to promote an agenda in which reason will never work, or asking open-ended questions whose point is certainly to cast suspicion on some unnamed, shadowy forces.
I do find it strange that this covid vaccine is being pushed so hard. Why this one? Why not any of the others?
No shadow figures at all. Why tho?. I'm not questioning the "push" I agree with it, but why so much now? Fir this?
Cclm, LPN
786 Posts
I meant getting the vaccine not necessarily a specific one. The action not the substance.