Apparently per the EEOC's guidelines employers (not just healthcare related) can mandate vaccination of workers. The exception is a "sincerely held religious belief" or a covered disability. Just found out this morning that a chain of for profit LTC/SNF's are rolling out a Covid vaccine mandate for all direct care staff or face indefinite unpaid administrative leave. I am a heavy supporter of vaccination and of the new COVID vaccine and in fact am due to get one in early January. But I am doing so of my own volition. My facility encouraged all workers to sign up for a vaccine and provided information sessions and it's been really effective at getting people to sign up.
Even though I would disagree with someone's choice to not vaccinate, I don't believe they should be mandated at this point.
That studies thus fat have shown that wearing masks has done very little to control infection spread
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Danish study finds face masks provide limited protection to wearer
I will take limited over nothing,(but you know a barrier is effective)
Is the first article from the "Music Man"? Always loved the "Ladies of River City:. OHHH we've got trouble......
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Friend, either you're closing your eyes
To a situation you do not wish to acknowledge
Or you are not aware of the caliber of disaster indicated
By the presence of Covid 19 in your community
Well, Ya got trouble, my friend, right here
I say, trouble right here in River City
Why sure I'm a billiard player
Certainly mighty proud I say
I'm always mighty proud to say it
I consider that the hours I spend
With a mask in my hand (not on my face)are golden
Help you cultivate horse sense
And a fevered head and a runny eye,
loss of taste, and a susceptible respiratory track
Jever' take and try to find a bar that let's you in mask-free
From a three-rail billiard shot?
But just as I say
It takes NO judgment, NO brains, and NO maturity to score
In an Infectious disease game
I say that any boob can take
And shove a C-19 virus up a nose
And I call that sloth
Besides, I'm not saying don't wear a mask or don't get vaccinated. Rather, I am saying that I personally don't wish to get vaccinated (about 40 to 50% of Americans like me) also do not wish to do so. Especially, those of us who have had and recovered from the Covid infection. I am also saying that "forcing" us to do so under economic threat is both unconstitutional and that this is especially the case given that these vaccines are authorized under emergency use and that under such limited authorization even The armed forces of the United States deployed on active duty cannot be compelled to take these vaccines or threatened with loss of their jobs for declining to do so.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
15 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
Yes we live in a free nation where we are free to live by our beliefs and that right is Constitutionally protected. I and tens of millions like me will jealously oppose infringement upon those rights. Indeed, it a central premise of the government upon which we were found that we are "endowed by our Creator" with those rights that they in essence emanate from an "act of faith" (the existence of a Creator, I would argue is also testified to by Science but that is a different matter). So much angst directed at people who are reticent to vaccinate and so little directed at a government (China) that likely either accidently via gross negligence or perhaps deliberately via an act of war or terrorism unleased this upon the world.
Yes. Free to believe nonsense, pseudoscience and propaganda. Free to speak misinformation, terrible advice, pseudoscience and propaganda into the public space. Free to deflect, project and pretend.
It sounds like you've made up your mind about the origins of the virus without having much evidence. That's not at all surprising...it's the expected emotional response.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
12 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
Besides, I'm not saying don't wear a mask or don't get vaccinated. Rather, I am saying that I personally don't wish to get vaccinated (about 40 to 50% of Americans like me) also do not wish to do so. Especially, those of us who have had and recovered from the Covid infection. I am also saying that "forcing" us to do so under economic threat is both unconstitutional and that this is especially the case given that these vaccines are authorized under emergency use and that under such limited authorization even The armed forces of the United States deployed on active duty cannot be compelled to take these vaccines or threatened with loss of their jobs for declining to do so.
Yeah, that's how you feel about it. Of course, in reality facts and data are often in direct conflict with your beliefs and feelings, aeb your posts in these threads.
I guess people can debate whether or not this violates their rights as Americans, or as human beings, or whatever, but this answers the question as to whether it is legal.
I am also saying that "forcing" us to do so under economic threat is both unconstitutional and that this is especially the case given that these vaccines are authorized under emergency use
I suppose nurses can debate the constitution if they like, but for now, this is the law of the land. Like any law, it may, at some point, be put to the test as to whether it is constitutional, and could, in theory, be deemed unconstitutional. At this point, the constitutionality of this practice is just an academic question.
As far as basing this argument on the fact that the vaccine is authorized under "emergency use"- Well, this is an emergency. It is kind of a weak argument. It's not like the naysayers will be in favor of required vaccinations once the FDA completes the process.
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On 5/28/2021 at 2:02 PM, myoglobin said:
"forcing" us to do so under economic threat is both unconstitutional and that this is especially the case given that these vaccines are authorized under emergency use
I suppose nurses can debate the constitution if they like, but for now, this is the law of the land. Like any law, it may, at some point, be put to the test as to whether it is constitutional, and could, in theory, be deemed unconstitutional. At this point, the constitutionality of this practice is just an academic question.
As far as basing this argument on the fact that the vaccine is authorized under "emergency use"- Well, this is an emergency. It is kind of a weak argument. It's not like the naysayers will be in favor of required vaccinations once the FDA completes the process.
Keep in mind that not even active duty personnel in the Armed Forces can currently be required to take the vaccine precisely because it is "emergency use" . https://www.statnews.com/2021/02/23/federal-law-prohibits-employers-and-others-from-requiring-vaccination-with-a-covid-19-vaccine-distributed-under-an-eua/ .Once it gets standard approval than that protection will not apply. Also, there are lawsuits moving forward against employers that require vaccination https://www.cbia.com/news/hr-safety/covid-19-lawsuits-increasing/ so ultimately this is something that will probably find it's way to the SCOTUS. I am in the process of talking to hundreds (thousands?) of others interested in creating a fund to help employees looking for the resources to oppose the mandatory vaccinations and to stand up for what we believe to be our constitutional rights. We may or may not prevail but we can it least make it very expensive for institutional "bullies" .
Keep in mind that not even active duty personnel in the Armed Forces can currently be required to take the vaccine precisely because it is "emergency use" . https://www.statnews.com/2021/02/23/federal-law-prohibits-employers-and-others-from-requiring-vaccination-with-a-covid-19-vaccine-distributed-under-an-eua/ .Once it gets standard approval than that protection will not apply. Also, there are lawsuits moving forward against employers that require vaccination https://www.cbia.com/news/hr-safety/covid-19-lawsuits-increasing/ so ultimately this is something that will probably find it's way to the SCOTUS. I am in the process of talking to hundreds (thousands?) of others interested in creating a fund to help employees looking for the resources to oppose the mandatory vaccinations and to stand up for what we believe to be our constitutional rights. We may or may not prevail but we can it least make it very expensive for institutional "bullies" .
As the law is, some employers can require it, some can not. Apparently, the military can not. Hospitals can.
Are you thinking this will work its way up to the Supreme Court before it gets full FDA approval? Assuming this did work it's way through the legal system, and AND, the court decided to hear it, by that time, this will have FDA approval, and be no different from any other vaccine we might be required to have as nurses.
But, as we don't know when the next pandemic is coming, it would be great for this to under go legal challenges paving the way for future decisions. In all likelihood, the law will favor the responsibility of healthcare institutions to protect vulnerable patients using the best science available.
Of course, I could be wrong on this. You do have full support of politicians like Marjorie Taylor Greene, “Vaccinated employees get a vaccination logo just like the Nazi’s forced Jewish people to wear a gold star". She is a rising star right now, and will no doubt support any legislation that reduces vaccinations.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
1 hour ago, myoglobin said:
Keep in mind that not even active duty personnel in the Armed Forces can currently be required to take the vaccine precisely because it is "emergency use" . https://www.statnews.com/2021/02/23/federal-law-prohibits-employers-and-others-from-requiring-vaccination-with-a-covid-19-vaccine-distributed-under-an-eua/ .Once it gets standard approval than that protection will not apply. Also, there are lawsuits moving forward against employers that require vaccination https://www.cbia.com/news/hr-safety/covid-19-lawsuits-increasing/ so ultimately this is something that will probably find it's way to the SCOTUS. I am in the process of talking to hundreds (thousands?) of others interested in creating a fund to help employees looking for the resources to oppose the mandatory vaccinations and to stand up for what we believe to be our constitutional rights. We may or may not prevail but we can it least make it very expensive for institutional "bullies" .
This has certainly struck an emotional chord with you. Will this particular life saving vaccine be the only employer required vaccine you will be protesting? Will you also be protesting the violation of your right to privacy when health businesses require a TB test or a urine sample for employment purposes?
londonflo
3,002 Posts
I will take limited over nothing,(but you know a barrier is effective)
Is the first article from the "Music Man"? Always loved the "Ladies of River City:. OHHH we've got trouble......
Adapted from: