Where do you go when you don't trust official data sources?

[10GaugeNeedles]

Been engaged in alot of discussion under the COVID heading. Got me thinking. I find myself not trusting published data. There's so much politicization of everything. The government agencies are simply not independent and they are the source of most information. They want compliance. Period. Why wouldn't they change the data to fit? They certainly could and they have before. They constantly put out demands and conflicting information over and over again. Masks are BS. They don't protect anything. they stop a cough. GREAT! But they push masks like they are vital to life. People are wearing their masks while jogging in the woods. seriously? What the foxtrot!!? 

I hear all colors of reports about anecdotal stories of people being hurt by the vaccines. Those stories don't even exist as far as official sources are concerned. Do I risk the vaccine hurting me or COVID hurting me? Neither is a good option. COVID is a crap shoot. but taking the vaccine is a conscious choice. People come out of COVID without a problem. people take the vaccine without a problem. Both sides are valid in my mind. but now they are forcing the vaccine by law. This isn't a clear situation. It's very muddy. vaccinated still get infected but the narrative is the vaccine is totally safe, effective, and mandatory and will save the world. How do we know the vaccine isn't driving mutation? If I can't trust the source, how the hell can I make an informed decision? The drug companies have a massive profit motive to avoid any bad press. did they really disclose all their data?

Every single positive case is counted as a case. Are vaccine injuries treated the same? How many people harmed by the vaccine are taken into account? There's no way to know. Positive case: Always assume regardless of symptoms. Vaccine injury claim: PROVE IT WITH AN AUTOPSY!! IT COULDN'T HAVE BEEN THE VACCINE!! ITS PROBABLY SOMETHING ELSE!! HERE'S A REFERRAL NOW GET OUT OF MY OFFICE!! (Yes I'm being hyperbolic). Its a double standard and there's no way we can get a clear picture with a double standard like that. This whole thing is a mess. 

Does anyone else feel like they have found an unbiased source of information that someone who doesn't trust CDC, FDA, government bodies can turn to to make an informed decision? I'm tired of all the fighting and politicization. I just want unbiased information. If you are like me, what did you do to get a clear picture of this mess and come to a conclusion about vax vs avoid? I'm seriously frustrated. I don't want to add to the problem. But I also don't want to get vaccination injury which can be just as bad as anything I can get from (yes liberals, vaccine injury happens. deal with it). Sigh....tired. I hope this makes sense. Does anyone else feel like this? I hope I'm not the only one. 

[BostonFNP, APRN]

I really hope it is only a small percentage of nurses that are actively searching for more efficient avenues of confirmation bias. Perhaps it is a relative lack of education in nursing compared to other healthcare profession that leads to questions like this and the lowest vaccination rate of the healthcare professions. 

[toomuchbaloney]

1 hour ago, BostonFNP said:

I really hope it is only a small percentage of nurses that are actively searching for more efficient avenues of confirmation bias. Perhaps it is a relative lack of education in nursing compared to other healthcare profession that leads to questions like this and the lowest vaccination rate of the healthcare professions. 

Even an associate degree in science with a nursing focus should impart enough knowledge to to avoid falling victim to much of the anti-vaccination misinformation.  There are likely some schools that are lax but I would guess this is more of an individual issue. 

[JKL33]

1 hour ago, BostonFNP said:

I really hope it is only a small percentage of nurses that are actively searching for more efficient avenues of confirmation bias.

I read Thank You for Arguing, too. ?

 

[Hannahbanana, BSN, MSN]

Here’s your answer to the question of who to trust. It apparently is beginning to take hold in some areas. 
https://thenib.com/saddle-up/

[Guest1171160]

I don't look to the news for information about the vaccine or COVID-19. I look on the CDCs website, the FDA for updates on vaccines, sometimes the WHO. I also read the information released from the vaccine makers. I know two basic things based on reading the fact sheets for the vaccines. You can still get COVID even with the vaccine, you can still spread COVID with the vaccine. I come across many people who don't believe this is true because the media tells them to get the vaccine to keep from getting the virus and they believe they can't spread it with the vaccine. This was the basis for the argument that was made for former president Obama having a birthday party, well he had on the invite that everyone had to be vaccinated. It seems they did not even think you could still spread it with a larger group, and guess what you can. I don't believe the media gives enough unbiased information. Even when people argue on Twitter about this they state if you get the vaccine you will be protected. I see this over and  over, and while there is a better chance, it is not full proof, nothing is. Yet somehow it is being spread like it is.  

[Guest1171160]

2 hours ago, Hannahbanana said:

Here’s your answer to the question of who to trust. It apparently is beginning to take hold in some areas. 
https://thenib.com/saddle-up/

Most people I talk to are smart enough to know not to get the over the counter on meant for horses, they know full well if they are going to take it, to get it from the hospital as the one they have is meant for humans. Part of the problem is that when news media outlets report on that drug, they only mention the over the counter one meant for horses, and so people go buy that, they don't understand that there is also one intended for human use at the hospital. The judge that ruled the wife could get that drug for her husband... every article I saw only talked about the horse version of that drug and one even had the picture of the horse medicine in the headline. Shame on them for spreading half truths. 

[toomuchbaloney]

4 minutes ago, RKM2021 said:

Most people I talk to are smart enough to know not to get the over the counter on meant for horses, they know full well if they are going to take it, to get it from the hospital as the one they have is meant for humans. Part of the problem is that when news media outlets report on that drug, they only mention the over the counter one meant for horses, and so people go buy that, they don't understand that there is also one intended for human use at the hospital. The judge that ruled the wife could get that drug for her husband... every article I saw only talked about the horse version of that drug and one even had the picture of the horse medicine in the headline. Shame on them for spreading half truths. 

You don't know most people so anecdote is a poor standard for evaluating the danger to people desperate to protect themselves without taking the vaccine.  The thinking and logic of those individuals is dangerously flawed.  

[Guest1171160]

I also understand the CDC and most doctors recommend pregnant patients  get the vaccine. Pfizer's Q&A section... "While there have been no specific studies in these groups, there is no contraindication to receipt of the vaccine for pregnant or breastfeeding women.  Pregnant or breastfeeding women should discuss potential benefits and risks of vaccination with their healthcare provider."   Pfizer updated their fact sheet on August 23. Before their fact sheet states there were no studies done on pregnant women and they could not say if they were safe or not for pregnant women to take. I have this fact sheet still. 

 

Moderna was updated August 27 and states that if you are pregnant or breast feeding to discuss the vaccine with your doctor. I have the previous one from them as well that states no studies had been done on pregnant women and they could not state if the vaccine was safe or not for pregnant women. This was still up after the CDC was saying the vaccine was safe for pregnant use. And yes I still have the fact sheet that states the above. 

 

You have got the CDC telling you they are safe, but not disclosing no studies have been done for this group, and the vaccine makers were saying we can't say because no studies have been done in this group.

 

 

 

[Guest1171160]

11 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:

You don't know most people so anecdote is a poor standard for evaluating the danger to people desperate to protect themselves without taking the vaccine.  The thinking and logic of those individuals is dangerously flawed.  

I only said most people I know, not every one in the world. There was no standard being applied to everyone by my statement. If I hear anyone talking about that drug all I say is you know there is one meant for humans, right? The sites like Pud Med Gov that talk about it could having some effect are talking about the one from the hospital not the one meant for horses, don't buy that one. 

[Hannahbanana, BSN, MSN]

Would that more people were like people you know. Reports of people showing up in ERs with effects of taking veterinary invermectin paste (orally, or asking if they should have applied it to their axillae instead (!!) ) are becoming a staple.
As we are fond of saying in our family, yet more evidence of failure to acqure a basic science education.

[10GaugeNeedles, BSN]

43 minutes ago, RKM2021 said:

I only said most people I know, not every one in the world. There was no standard being applied to everyone by my statement. If I hear anyone talking about that drug all I say is you know there is one meant for humans, right? The sites like Pud Med Gov that talk about it could having some effect are talking about the one from the hospital not the one meant for horses, don't buy that one. 

This ivermectin horse medication thing reminds me of the person that took fish tank cleaner. 

[BostonFNP, APRN]

1 hour ago, RKM2021 said:

This was the basis for the argument that was made for former president Obama having a birthday party, well he had on the invite that everyone had to be vaccinated. It seems they did not even think you could still spread it with a larger group, and guess what you can.

But were there any clusters/cases from Obama’s party?