I have been a CNA for a little over a year now as I am transitioning into the health care field. During this time, I have observed the nurses I work with, who happen to be all female so far.
I have noticed nearly every female nurse I have worked with puts up with things that would shock someone not in healthcare. Things that would get you arrested if you tried them outside of a facility. Things that I personally can't tolerate.
What I want to know is, if you are a nurse that puts up with these actions, why do you do it? Is it for job security? Are you a submissive person? Do you feel that you deserve the things that people do to you? Do you think it's lack of education about what is and isn't appropriate behavior? Or maybe it's due to the accepted culture of a workplace?
This isn't for a class or anything, I just really would like to know what the motivation is.
And you see them when they're anxious, a nervous wreck, dealing with something unexpected, dealing with living in a strange place outside of thier normal routine. Most of them are just clueless about what is going to happen next. I have found if I just give constant updates and let them know what and whyI'm doing something every time i'm w/ them ...it really alleviates their anxiety.
I really don't want to become a jaded burned out nurse. I don't want to become a slacker, a corner cutter -- and then have something really bad happen. I want to be an honest employee and learn all i can. i don't want to become a stupid nurse who just stops learning.
I want to become a very professional nurse, very knowledable, and a nurse who understands people and patients enough not to let them odd and demanding behavior bother me. I want to develop patience ...but it's very hard as I have never really been pampered myself as many of these patients expect to be ... the entitltmenet attitude really gets to me.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
patients are exempt from this because they are sick and nobody is their best when they are sick. family members are also exempt because they are concerned about their loved ones. most co-workers are cut some slack because they are working right by your side and they deserve your respect, but management, they treat their employees like crap. always adding and changing the rules. never taking responsibility for problems, always preaching and never listening. it doesn't matter that you are also a professional and deserve some respect. we all worked hard to get where we are. stop pointing fingers and start patting us on the back once in awhile.
i can't tell if this post if serious or if i've missed the joke.
being sick is no excuse for the boob grab, throwing poop at the nurse, striking, threatening or otherwise attacking the nurse. i've been sick. i've been a patient. unless you're demented or delerious, there is no excuse.
as far as family members, being worried about a loved one is no excuse for following the nurse into another patient's room, threatening, attacking or otherwise attempting to intimidate the nurse. no excuse -- if they're demented or delerious, they should not be visiting the hospital. i've been a family member. being anxious, frightened or worried is absolutely no excuse for mistreating the very people who are trying to help -- or anyone else, for that matter.
as for your co-workers, if they're working right beside you and covering your back they deserve your respect. however, that doesn't give them an excuse to attack or threaten anyone.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
patients are exempt. they are the reason we do this. i don't think anybody likes to get hit or have poop thrown at them. you misunderstood what i said. in our field we have to understand that sick and elderly people do strange and sometimes mean things. i can deal with a patient who is sick better than i can deal with a system that fails to help me care for this patient.
patients are not exempt. unless they are confused, demented or suffering from delerium, there is absolutely no excuse for the behavior you describe. we don't have to "understand that sick and elderly people do strange and sometimes mean things." nor do we have to tolerate it.
patients are not exempt. unless they are confused, demented or suffering from delerium, there is absolutely no excuse for the behavior you describe. we don't have to "understand that sick and elderly people do strange and sometimes mean things." nor do we have to tolerate it.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
So when a dementia patient throws feces we should tell them it is not proper behavior and escort them to the door? When an unhappy and angry family member comes to us because they have a concern, we should tell them have to get at the end of the line? We see people at their worst, and sometimes at their best. I try to be my best.
My post specifically referred to visitors, families, and physicians. . .not patients.
A family member can be unhappy and express their concerns without hollering at the top of their lungs, assaulting staff, being disrespectful, and calling people every name in the book. For example, a family member hit my coworker a few months ago. My coworker called the police and pressed charges, and I'm glad she did this.
Sorry, but there's a difference between expressing a concern and behaving like an animal. If a visitor wants to use brute force, we should have the power and the backing to show them the door.
I want to become a very professional nurse, very knowledable, and a nurse who understands people and patients enough not to let them odd and demanding behavior bother me. I want to develop patience ...but it's very hard as I have never really been pampered myself as many of these patients expect to be ... the entitltmenet attitude really gets to me.
Acute delirium aside for a moment, when faced with a confrontational situation in life outside of the workplace, (roadway, supermarket check out line, wherever) the choice is clear, fight or flight. As a 6' 190 lb male, I will always remove myself from the situation unless personal defense would be necessary. Always,..why? Because I'm not going to teach a fool anything, and I am not interested in trying. They receive silence from me, call the police if necessary.
The workplace however, is a different story....
Personal danger aside for a moment (again fight or flight) you are faced with only two choices,...confrontation or diplomacy. Regardless of how vile and inappropriate someone may be, I will first try to diffuse the situation, failing that, I go immediately silent and then quietly call in the troops, (IE security, police, intervention team,...whatever). This serves three purposes, (1) puts an end to the situation, (2) denies the other party any ammunition to use against me later. (3) doesn't make it personal.
Patients are exempt. They are the reason we do this. I don't think anybody likes to get hit or have poop thrown at them. You misunderstood what I said. In our field we have to understand that sick and elderly people do strange and sometimes mean things. I can deal with a patient who is sick better than I can deal with a system that fails to help me care for this patient.
Thank you so much for being honest. Can you tell me WHY you feel this way? Anyone else (Rexie68, etc.) who has a similar thought, feel free to chime in.
We all know that there are assertive ways to deal with these situations, but not everybody is willing to. I know many of the nurses on this site are very skilled at standing up for themselves and their patients, but not all are. These are the people whose replies I am most interested in.
For example, I'll share a story from my past, before I had even heard of therapeutic communication or assertiveness:
One fine day at the LTC, it was shift change. I came in 20 minutes early, as was my habit. I was standing at the nurses' station, looking over my assignment and talking with a patient's family member. A senior LPN came by, obviously having a crapper of a day.
She looks over at us and says, "You need to go down to So-and-So's room and do this-that-and-the-other." I said, "Please excuse me for a moment, Mr. Family Member." I then went over to the nurse and explained that I wasn't on the clock yet. Before I could offer to find Mrs. So-an-So's CNA, the nurse cut me off and yelled that we CNAs could expect "to be treated even worse" if we didn't stop standing around in the halls talking all day.
I was so mad and embarrassed that I stalked off. I couldn't even talk, I was so upset. I clocked in right on the dot of shift change, got report, and went on with my day. I never recovered my composure completely. Eventually I talked to the nurse in private and told her that I didn't appreciate being talked to that way and that if she wanted to talk to me, she would need to be civil. That got me a tirade about how crappy her week had been and she didn't have any sleep and it was all my fault. At that point, I decided she was irrational and dangerous. I had no idea what to do, so I just went on about my business.
Later, I learned about the chain of command and how to get things resolved correctly through the proper channels.
So, for me, the motivation was mostly ignorance. I didn't know how to handle the situation. Also, I was raised to be extremely passive to authority and that conditioning kicked in a little bit.
thank you so much for being honest. can you tell me why you feel this way? anyone else (rexie68, etc.) who has a similar thought, feel free to chime in.
we all know that there are assertive ways to deal with these situations, but not everybody is willing to. i know many of the nurses on this site are very skilled at standing up for themselves and their patients, but not all are. these are the people whose replies i am most interested in.
samanthaeh,
first, thank you for the compliment of asking for my feedback. i wasn't always assertive; it took time and experience to gain self confidence in my skills and assessments.
while i no longer let myself be taken advantage of, i also don't get upset easily. even a pt who is alert and oriented can have a bad moment or bad day and may end up yelling at me for no particular reason. usually i remove myself from the situation (as long as the pt is safe) and return a bit later to attempt to engage in conversation to figure out what may be the cause of the pts anger. as i said before, we're on the front lines and readily available for a pt to vent their frustration. after all, no one wants to yell at the almighty physician! (though this is slowly changing). often i've found that it's the pts attempt to control their situation....they may feel that there's nothing else they can control in this environment. we see them at their most fragile and vulnerable moments, while at the same time examining every inch of their body. also, for some pts, yelling and arguing is a part of their normal living environment (unfortunately) and they haven't learned other skills to cope. again, most verbal tirades don't phase me anymore. of course, if it were a continuing barrage despite my efforts at remedying the situation, i would insist that the pt/family member talk with social services or the nurse manager.
when a pt is demented, delirious, etc, it is not unusual for them to act out physically. if i know a pt has a history of hitting, kicking, etc i will bring in another staff member if at all possible when caring for them. keeping a calm, soothing voice may be helpful, as may a no-nonsense yet cheerful demeanor. don't let them feel your trepidation or anxiety. if you are confident and professional, this helps. there are times when there is just nothing you can do to prevent physical abuse except medication and/or restraints. it's never the first choice, but a viable option.
pts who are demented who may pat my bottom or some such thing are usually easily redirected. i just don't make a big deal about it. if a pt is alert and does the same thing, he/she will get a very direct, no-nonsense "that is not acceptable." usually that is enough. if not, i will absolutely have another staff member with me if i must enter the room and i report the problem to my nurse manager. i've never had it go beyond that.
i find staff to staff hostilities to be the most problematic. we tend to be passive-aggressive and would rather complain about someone than confront them. i think you acted appropriately at the time in the situation you described. you even attempted to talk with her in private....kudos to you. as you said, you didn't know about the chain of command at the time and so were left without recourse.
i'm sorry that this is so long....i just started typing and my fingers didn't want to stop!
Specializes in M/S, MICU, CVICU, SICU, ER, Trauma, NICU.
Patients are exempt. They are the reason we do this. I don't think anybody likes to get hit or have poop thrown at them. You misunderstood what I said. In our field we have to understand that sick and elderly people do strange and sometimes mean things. I can deal with a patient who is sick better than I can deal with a system that fails to help me care for this patient.
This is dysfunctional thinking. Very dysfunctional thinking.
I know exactly what you are talking about. I have put up with many things NOBODY would tolerate in any other job. Being punched in the head, kicked, scratched, spat full on in the face, abused and screamed at in my face by a senior doctor, been called all the foul names under the sun and having so called 'dementia' patients or old men put their hands right up into my fanny for a quick feel when I bent over to get something - this is how bad it gets. I reported and complained many times to very senior people. And you know what happened? Absolutely NOTHING. This is why I blame management and the lack of regulation in health care re patient code of conduct - if a patient abuses ANY staff member in any way, they should be asked to leave or they can go to another facility. Who cares if they have a serious problem? Why should I be called an effing fat white m**le or fat white s**t because the patient knows management will just MAYBE give them a little telling off and they know they can't get kicked out. I blame many things on the fat nurse managers, waddling along the corridors, laughing at inane, stupid jokes when nurses who are stressed out and busy just need someone to listen, help out a bit and DO SOMETHING about all this abuse.
I know nurses who have gone on strike re all this and it hasn't done any good. Maybe they all felt too guilty standing up for their rights.
In Australia now we have a no tolerance policy and it states if staff are abused, the police can be called but it's a load of BS - I have never seen anyone so much as tell a patient off let alone call police; only one CNC did it one day when a young nurse was fondled sexually (a patient was grabbing a young nurses' breasts whilst making lewd comments re what he'd like to do to her) by a disgusting, fat, abusive patient with a history of abuse in different hospitals - the CNC told him he would be transferred but the police were never called; another fruitless exercise - that patient knew he would get away with it.
Nothing will change until management demand abusive patients are either guarded when nurses are in the room, or the police ARE called and charges laid.
Next time someone abuses me, I have decided to not only tell the facility but to also tell the patient I will be complaining to the police and laying formal charges.
Unless nurses demand better conditions from their managers, and NO ABUSE with charges to be laid if there is abuse, nothing will probably change in the future.
We are easy targets unfortunately as we are all supposed to be so caring and 'nice'. Why we should have to look after/tolerate these abusive patients/families at any time is beyond me. I for one speak up now and do not tolerate any abusive or unacceptable behaviour, and I tell them straight to stop. What else can we do when management doesn't support us?
I believe it is all managements' fault - let them get full on abused and see how wonderful they feel when they get home after a shift.
SoundofMusic
1,016 Posts
And you see them when they're anxious, a nervous wreck, dealing with something unexpected, dealing with living in a strange place outside of thier normal routine. Most of them are just clueless about what is going to happen next. I have found if I just give constant updates and let them know what and whyI'm doing something every time i'm w/ them ...it really alleviates their anxiety.
I really don't want to become a jaded burned out nurse. I don't want to become a slacker, a corner cutter -- and then have something really bad happen. I want to be an honest employee and learn all i can. i don't want to become a stupid nurse who just stops learning.
I want to become a very professional nurse, very knowledable, and a nurse who understands people and patients enough not to let them odd and demanding behavior bother me. I want to develop patience ...but it's very hard as I have never really been pampered myself as many of these patients expect to be ... the entitltmenet attitude really gets to me.