Valid Reasons To Not Get Vaccinated

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Whether you're in support of the COVID vaccine, against it,  or on the fence please use this particular thread to cite credible, evidence-based sources to share with everyone so we can engage in a discussion that revolves around LEARNING.  

I'll start:

The primary concerns I've shared with others have to do with how effective the vaccine is for those who have already been infected.  I've reviewed studies and reports in that regard.  There are medical professionals I've listened to that, in my personal opinion,  don't offer a definitive answer. 

Here are some links to 2 different, I'll start with just 2:

Cleveland Clinic Statement on Previous COVID-19 Infection Research

Reduced Risk of Reinfection with SARS-CoV-2 After COVID-19 Vaccination — Kentucky, May–June 2021

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1 hour ago, toomuchbaloney said:

Because you engage in trolling tactics with combative language where you should have valid reasoning to remain unvaccinated.  I think that the evidence shows that you haven't made your point. Or maybe you aren't making the points that you are trying to make.  

Is it your point that you are open minded and can understand and appreciate the concerns that cause people to remain unvaccinated...and I cannot understand the concerns?

The premise of this thread is to discuss VALID reasons to remain unvaccinated.  

If it's trolling why do you reply? ?

 I've explained to you my perspective. Shared information with you.  You disagree with all of it. 

I'm OK with that, really. 

  I'm not OK with a nasty attitude tiward people with concerns about vaccination. That makes it worse

 I've been balanced enough to at least agree with things that you and others have said regarding vaccination. Unfortunately it's too challenging for a few medical professionals hrre to do something as simple as at least try and understand where somebody with a differing perspective is coming from even if they don't take that position and agree with it. 

 

 

 

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4 minutes ago, jive turkey said:

If it's trolling why do you reply? ?

 I've explained to you my perspective. Shared information with you.  You disagree with all of it. 

I'm OK with that, really. 

  I'm not OK with a nasty attitude tiward people with concerns about vaccination. That makes it worse

 I've been balanced enough to at least agree with things that you and others have said regarding vaccination. Unfortunately it's too challenging for a few medical professionals hrre to do something as simple as at least try and understand where somebody with a differing perspective is coming from even if they don't take that position and agree with it. 

 

 

 

I don't know why you keep saying that we don't understand. I certainly understand what the unvaccinated are saying. Their views are not difficult to comprehend.  

Understanding and comprehending a POV doesn't require one to sympathize or agree with a decision to remain unvaccinated during a pandemic.  The professional obligation is to correct the wrong thinking and provide accurate information and guidance.  

All eligible adults should vaccinate ASAP.

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16 minutes ago, jive turkey said:

There's nothing to cry about. I'm calling you out for not having the strength to argue without getting in your feelings and launching insults.   Anybody who comes at me sideways gets it back.  That's what you experienced and didn't take it very well. 

Considering your psych cocktail recommendation you clearly can't argue intellectually without resorting to juvenile rebuttals.  Save it for the playground and be dismissed.  

Deuces 

Please stay on topic and discuss valid reasons to not vaccinate.  You have yet to provide any support for remaining unvaccinated at this moment in time.  

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1 minute ago, toomuchbaloney said:

Please stay on topic and discuss valid reasons to not vaccinate.  You have yet to provide any support for remaining unvaccinated at this moment in time.  

 If somebody (particularly PCR+) has concerns whether or not a drug will be effective for them and decides that the risk of taking it outweighs potential benefits AND talks to their provider if they had doubts but still thought it was not a good idea for them...  that's a valid reason not to  IN MY OPINION.  

 I'm not on a tyrannical crusade to tell people what they should and should not do. Can't say the same for some of you

 I already shared articles with you. I've shared others with other posters that you were able to read yourself. I could show you a 100 more it's not going to change your mind I'm not trying to change your mind so no need to ask for more proof. 

 I already know you disagree with everything I just said so there's no point in you telling me anything else.

OK? 

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3 hours ago, BostonFNP said:

I literally spend my entire day prescribing and re-evaluation medication. I tell patients to take different medications all day. I know some will have adverse effects but the benefit of the medication outweighs the risks. This is how all of medicine works. I don't take financial responsibility for adverse effects just like the patient doesn't take financial responsibility for their condition if they refuse.  It's an asinine straw-man argument.

 

Boston in disengaging from further rhetoric from either of its about prescriptions and medical advice.  You're a provider, I'll give you that, you know what you're doing. 

 If you'd like to share information that helps diminish the concerns I expressed in the original post I guarantee I am receptive to hearing it but I'm not going back-and-forth with anybody else anymore trading jabs

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21 minutes ago, jive turkey said:

Boston in disengaging from further rhetoric from either of its about prescriptions and medical advice.  You're a provider, I'll give you that, you know what you're doing. 

 If you'd like to share information that helps diminish the concerns I expressed in the original post I guarantee I am receptive to hearing it but I'm not going back-and-forth with anybody else anymore trading jabs

OK, here is the very 1st reply to your original post which addressed your concerns but you apparently didn’t like it, so here we are on page 11. 
 

“toomuchbaloney   

8,506 Likes   5,584 Posts

Saturday

   On 8/14/2021 at 8:39 PM,  jive turkeysaid: 

Whether you're in support of the COVID vaccine, against it,  or on the fence please use this particular thread to cite credible, evidence based sources to share with everyone so we can engage an a discussion that revolves around LEARNING.  

I'll start:

The primary concerns I've shared with others has to do with how effective the vaccine is for those who have already been infected.  I've reviewed studies and reports in that regard.  There are  medical professionals I've listened to that, in my personal opinion,  don't offer a definitive answer. 

Here are some links to 2 different, I'll start with just 2

Cleveland Clinic Statement on Previous COVID-19 Infection Research

Cleveland Clinic Statement on Previous COVID-19 Infection Research

From the MMWR that you linked:

  Quote

This report details the findings of a case-control evaluation of the association between vaccination and SARS-CoV-2 reinfection in Kentucky during May–June 2021 among persons previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 in 2020. Kentucky residents who were not vaccinated had 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with those who were fully vaccinated (odds ratio [OR] = 2.34; 95% confidence interval [CI] = 1.58–3.47). These findings suggest that among persons with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection, full vaccination provides additional protection against reinfection. To reduce their risk of infection, all eligible persons should be offered vaccination, even if they have been previously infected with SARS-CoV-2.*

And from the Cleveland Clinic link you provided:

  Quote

This is still a new virus, and more research is needed. It is important to keep in mind that this study was conducted in a population that was younger and healthier than the general population. In addition, we do not know how long the immune system will protect itself against re-infection after COVID-19. It is safe to receive the COVID-19 vaccine even if you have previously tested positive, and we recommend all those who are eligible receive it.”

Your own citations provide the definitive answer that the vaccines are safe and effective and all eligible adults should vaccinate. ”

 

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13 minutes ago, emtb2rn said:

OK, here is the very 1st reply to your original post which addressed your concerns but you apparently didn’t like it, so here we are on page 11. 
 

“toomuchbaloney   

8,506 Likes   5,584 Posts

Saturday

   On 8/14/2021 at 8:39 PM,  jive turkeysaid: 

Whether you're in support of the COVID vaccine, against it,  or on the fence please use this particular thread to cite credible, evidence based sources to share with everyone so we can engage an a discussion that revolves around LEARNING.  

I'll start:

The primary concerns I've shared with others has to do with how effective the vaccine is for those who have already been infected.  I've reviewed studies and reports in that regard.  There are  medical professionals I've listened to that, in my personal opinion,  don't offer a definitive answer. 

Here are some links to 2 different, I'll start with just 2

Cleveland Clinic Statement on Previous COVID-19 Infection Research

Cleveland Clinic Statement on Previous COVID-19 Infection Research

From the MMWR that you linked:

  Quote

This report details the findings of a case-control evaluation of the association between vaccination and SARS-CoV-2 reinfection in Kentucky during May–June 2021 among persons previously infected with SARS-CoV-2 in 2020. Kentucky residents who were not vaccinated had 2.34 times the odds of reinfection compared with those who were fully vaccinated (odds ratio [OR] = 2.34; 95% confidence interval [CI] = 1.58–3.47). These findings suggest that among persons with previous SARS-CoV-2 infection, full vaccination provides additional protection against reinfection. To reduce their risk of infection, all eligible persons should be offered vaccination, even if they have been previously infected with SARS-CoV-2.*

And from the Cleveland Clinic link you provided:

  Quote

This is still a new virus, and more research is needed. It is important to keep in mind that this study was conducted in a population that was younger and healthier than the general population. In addition, we do not know how long the immune system will protect itself against re-infection after COVID-19. It is safe to receive the COVID-19 vaccine even if you have previously tested positive, and we recommend all those who are eligible receive it.”

Your own citations provide the definitive answer that the vaccines are safe and effective and all eligible adults should vaccinate. ”

 

Hey emb2:  I'm shallow and I can't see your logo clearly.  Is that a yamulka for the Jewish space force?  I'm a member myself.

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1 hour ago, jive turkey said:

 If somebody (particularly PCR+) has concerns whether or not a drug will be effective for them and decides that the risk of taking it outweighs potential benefits AND talks to their provider if they had doubts but still thought it was not a good idea for them...  that's a valid reason not to  IN MY OPINION.  

 I'm not on a tyrannical crusade to tell people what they should and should not do. Can't say the same for some of you

 I already shared articles with you. I've shared others with other posters that you were able to read yourself. I could show you a 100 more it's not going to change your mind I'm not trying to change your mind so no need to ask for more proof. 

 I already know you disagree with everything I just said so there's no point in you telling me anything else.

OK? 

What is being countered unequivocally in these threads are not private decisions based upon collaboration with medical providers and you know it.  It's also not tyrannical to emphatically and persistently encourage people to follow public health recommendations and vaccinate against covid ASAP.  That's an emotional word choice. 

This isn't about changing anyone's mind.  It's about discussing VALID reasons to not vaccinate.  So far we have found that none of the reasons mentioned are valid. For instance, previous infection or concern about future side effects are not valid reasons to remain unvaccinated during this pandemic.   

 Do you have more reasons that you would like to discuss?

 

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1 hour ago, toomuchbaloney said:

#1Sofar we have found that none of the reasons mentioned are valid. For instance, previous infection or concern about future side effects are not valid reasons to remain unvaccinated during this pandemic.   

#2 Do you have more reasons that you would like to discuss?

 

That's your opinion, you're entitled to it.  You're not a dictator or anyone's God to be the authority over what is and isn't valid for someone to do to themselves.  I surely hope your attitude about the issue is limited to this forum because you'll likely turn people off from the vaccine being so cavalier about what's valid and not. 

#2 No not with you I don't.  Are you done?

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Once again, please do not make this debate a personal one-on-one.

Instead of arguing with each other and sliding down that slippery slope towards TOS violation(s), here's how to place a member on ignore. 

  1. Look in the upper right corner of any page and click ACCOUNT (it is to the left of your Profile Photo).
  2. Scroll to and click ACCOUNT SETTINGS.
  3. When that loads, click ACCOUNT OPTIONS, scroll to and click IGNORED USERS.
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  5. Click ADD USER.
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9 minutes ago, jive turkey said:

That's your opinion, you're entitled to it.  You're not a dictator or anyone's God to be the authority over what is and isn't valid for someone to do to themselves.  I surely hope your attitude about the issue is limited to this forum because you'll likely turn people off from the vaccine being so cavalier about what's valid and not. 

#2 No not with you I don't.  Are you done?

That's my opinion which is supported by the accountable experts and based upon expert analysis of the emerging data.  You have your opinion, which is unsupported by any data or expert analysis. 

No, I'm not done.  I want to discuss valid reasons to not vaccinate.  What makes something valid, in your view?

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33 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:

 

No, I'm not done.  I want to discuss valid reasons to not vaccinate.  What makes something valid, in your view?

Asked and answered. 

If you've never read the 48 laws of power I highly recommend it.  This may help you understand why I question things my man.

I look forward to another debate with you on another subject!

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