Vaccination Mandating

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I'm in NY. Wonder how other NURSES are feeling about mandatory COVID vaccination?

Specializes in Trauma ED.
4 minutes ago, toomuchbaloney said:

Yeah. Tone is a big concern for you.  I got that message in another comment.  

Apparently it isn't. Glad you see that. Especially when your desire is to slant things. Context matters. Cherry picking is bush league B.S. RNC. But, you probably think it's cute to take a sentence out of context. But wait, you have been elected to positions before, so that must be where you get it from. Politician!  When you wanna go toe to toe, I'm here to oblige. I told you in another thread I was gonna move one. Don't troll me and show your rear end and I promise you won't see my "tone" show through. How is that for being fair and moving on? That last sentence is rhetorical. 

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Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.

Meanwhile, vaccines are an effective way to protect patients and healthcare professionals should vaccinate voluntarily fire that purpose.  When employers mandate vaccination to protect patients and budgets, nurses should accept vaccination so that staffing challenges are not experienced because of vaccine refusal. It is best if healthcare staff make personal choices which do not jeopardize the health of patients or co-workers. 

Mandates aren't necessary when the vast majority do the right thing voluntarily. 

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Specializes in Research.
9 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:

 

Yes, everyone here can read the words here and discern for themselves your intentions.  What would you say your intentions are in this thread? Is it to push against American vaccine mandates from your place in Australia?

Nope, I do not push anything.

I have finished my academic compilation of data including the he said this, she said that.

All I am here for is to talk to nurses at the coal face. Those whom are medicating the sick ones.
The Clinician's pushing all the deceased into the morgue.
So I may get a better understanding of that area of healthcare.
 

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Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
40 minutes ago, AreYouReallySure said:

Nope, I do not push anything.

I have finished my academic compilation of data including the he said this, she said that.

All I am here for is to talk to nurses at the coal face. Those whom are medicating the sick ones.
The Clinician's pushing all the deceased into the morgue.
So I may get a better understanding of that area of healthcare.
 

This thread is about vaccination mandates.  

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Specializes in Geriatrics.

Polarization of the topic is the gasoline to the proverbial fire. Nurses should focus on education, not edicts, to encourage their patients to be protected. 
Vaccination for Covid is safe and effective. Judging people who make poor decisions doesn’t help elicit their compliance. 
we need to stand together, not call for our coworkers to be fired. We need to create a safe inclusive environment to encourage those we work with to stand with us and make the right decision. 

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Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
10 minutes ago, vintagegal said:

Polarization of the topic is the gasoline to the proverbial fire. Nurses should focus on education, not edicts, to encourage their patients to be protected. 
Vaccination for Covid is safe and effective. Judging people who make poor decisions doesn’t help elicit their compliance. 
we need to stand together, not call for our coworkers to be fired. We need to create a safe inclusive environment to encourage those we work with to stand with us and make the right decision. 

Judging decisions or choices to refuse vaccination is different from judging a person. I might judge a HCW's decision or choice to refuse vaccination, in the absence of medical contraindication to be irresponsible or selfish.  Does that mean that the individual is generally selfish or irresponsible? I have no idea.  That doesn't mean that I can't comment upon what I do know about.  It is an irresponsible and selfish choice, in my opinion, for a health professional to refuse vaccination when they have no contraindication to vaccination. 

We really don't need to create a safe place for unvaccinated health professionals to protect their feelings about remaining unvaccinated.  It's not OK. We need then to step up and help get this pandemic under control.  We need them to stay in the game as a part of the solution, not a part of the replication pool. They had a safe environment to make a choice to vaccinate and they chose not to.  Now they get the other kind of encouragement...that was their choice. 

This is not nurses hoping other nurses will lose their jobs...this is nurses having compassion fatigue and not wanting to feel sorry for self inflicted harm. 

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Specializes in Cardiac-ICU-IV-M/S, Anticoag Clinic-MH.
On 9/17/2021 at 4:28 PM, pclaybrooke said:

Don't just follow the liberal media machine that tout's fear on a daily basis, but never seems to put success stories from the vaccinated and unvaccinated

Thank you for being one of the first nurses to support vaccine choice.  I have many colleagues here in MT that have made the well thought out choice not to be vaccinated at this point. I will cite the following reasons why I'm not ready to be a test subject for a vaccine that does not meet minimal efficiency standards.

1. Worked from the being of the COVID Pandemic with appropriate PPE and universal precautions and did not contract COVID while caring for potentially infected and actual infected patients.

2. No long-term data of how this vaccine will effect anyone in 5, 10 and more years.

3. Work with a pharmacist, several doctors, half the nurses on my own unit and multiple other providers who have choosen not to be vaccinated at this point. The even bigger reason is most of those whom are vaccinated say it should be a choice. 

4. Boosters being needed after 6 months does not meet efficiency for a vaccine. 

5.There has been no previous RNA vaccine that worked long-term that I can find.  Please provide information if you have information otherwise.

6. As for my colleagues saying we are mandated to have other vaccines. Those vaccines have decades of research.  Please don't compare Noval COVID-19 to Polio. The first Polio Pandemic was in the early 1890s. The first vaccine was in the 1950s. 6 decades of knowledge of the illness and its affects. Also, survival rate and major complications doesn't compare to an illness less than a 2 year old. 

7. Why are they giving a vaccine to inhibit the spike protein that isn't on the newer variants?...

8. Final reason as a healthcare provider protecting a patient's right to have informed choice is all our responsibility. If we are willing to give up our own right, how easy will it be to take the next step and violate our patients rights.

•Will we start with mandated vaccines for the good of all.

•Next forced procedure because well we know best...

•Remove life support because well they are over 80 and we need those resources for someone else. 

•Slippery slope....

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Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

Worked from the being of the COVID Pandemic with appropriate PPE and universal precautions and did not contract COVID while caring for potentially infected and actual infected patients.

This is irrelevant to the efficacy and safety of the vaccine.  This does not change the reality that unvaccinated HCWs are at greater risk for infection, hospitalization and transmission of disease to others as compared to vaccinated HCWs. 

 

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

2. No long-term data of how this vaccine will effect anyone in 5, 10 and more years.

There is no reaaon to be concerned about long term side effects from these vaccines just like there is no reason to worry about long term effects from other vaccines. This new concern was cooked up as an excuse to refuse vaccination, it is not based in science. 

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

3. Work with a pharmacist, several doctors, half the nurses on my own unit and multiple other providers who have choosen not to be vaccinated at this point. The even bigger reason is most of those whom are vaccinated say it should be a choice. 

Vaccination is a choice.  Multiple people all making bad choices about safe and effective vaccinations during a pandemic is an example of what, in your opinion? Are they all willing to give up employment if your workplace mandates the vaccine?

 

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

4. Boosters being needed after 6 months does not meet efficiency for a vaccine. 

According to whom? I disagree with your assessment of the efficacy.  

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

5.There has been no previous RNA vaccine that worked long-term that I can find.  Please provide information if you 

Again, this is irrelevant to the safety and efficacy of the vaccines.  The mRNA technology is not new, just new to vaccine development and it has dramatically shortened the production time for these biologics, that's an amazing advancement. There's been no previous coronavirus that has caused long term immunity following infection. Boosters are doable to keep people or of the hospital. 

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

6. As for my colleagues saying we are mandated to have other vaccines. Those vaccines have decades of research.  Please don't compare Noval COVID-19 to Polio. The first Polio Pandemic was in the early 1890s. The first vaccine was in the 1950s. 6 decades of knowledge of the illness and its affects. Also, survival rate and major complications doesn't compare to an illness less than a 2 year old. 

Isn't it nice that modern technology and knowledge allowed us to develop safe and effective vaccines in record time so that we didn't have to suffer through years of covid illness and death? What exactly are you trying to say about survival rates and complications? Are you suggesting that covid isn't that bad compared to other VPD?

 

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

7. Why are they giving a vaccine to inhibit the spike protein that isn't on the newer variants?..

What? 

59 minutes ago, nurseluckett said:

8. Final reason as a healthcare provider protecting a patient's right to have informed choice is all our responsibility. If we are willing to give up our own right, how easy will it be to take the next step and violate oyour patients rights.

No one is giving up a right to refuse.  You said yourself that you have chosen to refuse to vaccinate.  That means that you made a choice and you weren't forced to do anything.  Why do you think it's easy to violate your patient's rights? Is it because doing the wrong thing and making bad choices in one area of your life can cascade into other areas and decision making?

  • We didn't start with mandates, we started with people lining up and making appointments to get vaccinated.  Too many refusals resulted in employer mandates. 
  • There aren't forced vaccines so extrapolating that forced procedures will follow is essentially an example of hysteria and hyperbole based in fabrication and paranoia. 
  • Yes, health systems which are overwhelmed by unvaccinated covid patients may need to ration care according to crisis assessment and resource availability.  Utah recently announced crisis level healthcare.  
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Hey folks- As you react to posts in this thread, check the post count of the poster.  Notice the connection between outlandish indefensible posts, and new "members"?  Notice how new "members" rarely come in with honest communication, exchange of ideas and experiences?  Rarely side with evidence based practice, or expert consensus?

This trend pops up in this forum periodically.  After a small number of posters recycle endless nonsense, somehow we get an influx of new members who, remarkably, take the same stance.

The point is to drive division and elicit emotional responses.  Exchange of ideas and debate are healthy.  Being manipulated- not so much.

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Specializes in Research.
12 minutes ago, hherrn said:

Hey folks- As you react to posts in this thread, check the post count of the poster.  Notice the connection between outlandish indefensible posts, and new "members"?  Notice how new "members" rarely come in with honest communication, exchange of ideas and experiences?  Rarely side with evidence based practice, or expert consensus?

This trend pops up in this forum periodically.  After a small number of posters recycle endless nonsense, somehow we get an influx of new members who, remarkably, take the same stance.

The point is to drive division and elicit emotional responses.  Exchange of ideas and debate are healthy.  Being manipulated- not so much.

Your last post's paragraph is very pertinent. I feel we can all just ignore posts that do just as you say they do. It's like shouting at everyone at the local Pub.

Seeing as this particular thread is about mandated vaccinations, I would like to ask if Gillick Competency is a legal thing that we as nurses have a right to be able to do for ourselves, and not just for our patients?
May I ask a Nurse with Medico-Legal expertise to respond? Surely we have one here in this thread?

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Specializes in Psych, Addictions, SOL (Student of Life).
On 9/17/2021 at 3:39 PM, nursej22 said:

Sorry, I'm known for being a little thick here. 

What does "very communistic" mean? Do you mean public health? Doing something that benefits society as a whole?

As far as vaccine mandates go, they are being made by employers, not the government (except when it is the employer). So what is the term for when an employer sets conditions of employment? Marxism, communism, fascist, Nazi like? Capitalism? 

California here: all healthcare workers And government employees are mandated to receive the vaccine

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Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
3 hours ago, AreYouReallySure said:

Your last post's paragraph is very pertinent. I feel we can all just ignore posts that do just as you say they do. It's like shouting at everyone at the local Pub.

Seeing as this particular thread is about mandated vaccinations, I would like to ask if Gillick Competency is a legal thing that we as nurses have a right to be able to do for ourselves, and not just for our patients?
May I ask a Nurse with Medico-Legal expertise to respond? Surely we have one here in this thread?

Medical emancipation of adolescents is a state level determination.  In Tennessee the conservative state political leadership got in the way of public health outreach to teens for ALL vaccination while trying to prevent uptake of the covid vaccine. It's crazy. 

The Tennessean

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