Purely hypothetical... IF Hillary Clinton gets elected and IF she pushes through her socialized medicine plan then what would happen to the payscale for U.S. nurses? Would it drop $10 an hour per nurse?
I know these are big IF's and I am not here to argue if her plan could ever work but I am just trying to plan ahead in case it DOES happen.
Also I cant seem to find anything to tell me how much nurses make in the socialized medicine countries like canada or united kingdom. Does anyone know how much these nurses make on average?
I wish I had the source at my fingertips, but I seem to remember a news article that quoted Hilary many years ago as saying that nurses were paid too much. I believe this was right after her stepfather had been hospitalized just prior to his death. Does any one else remember this?
Yes I wish you had the "source" at your fingertips as well. Perhaps the reason you don't have it is there never was such a "quote". Healthcare reform is an issue that should be debated but please lets get our facts straight so that it is an informed debate not one based on hearsay and misquotes- or just plain ole made up stuff. :angryfire:nono:
as long as discrimination and inequities remain so commonplace around the world - - as long as girls and women are valued less, fed less, fed last, overworked, underpaid, not schooled and subjected to violence in and out of their homes - - the potential of the human family to create a peaceful, prosperous world will not be realized.
hillary clinton
remarks for the united nations fourth world conference on women
The federal government decided long ago that it knew how to manage your health care better than you and replaced personal responsibility and accountability with a system that puts corporate interests first. Our free market health care system that was once the envy of the world became a federally-managed disaster.
Few people realize that Congress forced Health Maintenance Organizations (HMOs) on us. HMOs rose to prominence through federal legislation, incentives, and coercion.
Now, the Food and Drug Administration's bias toward large pharmaceutical companies enlarges their power, limits treatment options, and drives consumers to seek Canadian medicines. Regulations from D.C. make it virtually impossible for small business owners to cover their employees. The unemployed often cannot afford insurance, meaning those who need basic medical attention overcrowd emergency rooms and drive up premiums.
The federal government will not suddenly become efficient managers if universal health care is instituted. Government health care only means long waiting periods, lack of choice, poor quality, and frustration. Many Canadians, fed up with socialized medicine, come to the U.S. in order to obtain care. Socialized medicine will not magically work here.
Health care should not be left up to HMOs, big drug companies, and government bureaucrats.
It is time to take back our health care. This is why I support:
Making all medical expenses tax deductible.
Eliminating federal regulations that discourage small businesses from providing coverage.
Giving doctors the freedom to collectively negotiate with insurance companies and drive down the cost of medical care.
Making every American eligible for a Health Savings Account (HSA), and removing the requirement that individuals must obtain a high-deductible insurance policy before opening an HSA.
Reform licensure requirements so that pharmacists and nurses can perform some basic functions to increase access to care and lower costs.
By removing federal regulations, encouraging competition, and presenting real choices, we can make our health care system the envy of the world once again. "
I share a difference of opinions with Ron Paul on some issues, but on the healthcare issue, the guy was working as an OB/GYN, delivering babies for years and dealing directly with this issue. On that merit alone, I'd say he's better equipped to talk healthcare than any of the other candidates.
I think the bolded quotes are the truest. As a nation we're terrible on spending. And now it's biting us because we're printing money we don't have (lowering the value) and borrowing from China.
We already see it in many crappy hospitals. The pay sucks and as a result those hospitals rarely attract the best and most willing. Or if they do, the red tape stops them from being the nurses they can be. I read a thread here earlier from a travel nurse who saw a patient treated incorrectly, with harmful results, and she was unable to do anything to stop it due to hospital regs.
I think that if we went with national healthcare, nobody would come out and SAY that nurses will be getting paid less.
But if they don't have the money to pay for things in the first place, I can't imagine they're going to somehow pull money out of the air to afford raises and cost of living increases for nurses. Or worse yet, they limit the scope of practice for RNs and let cheaper labor (CNA/LPNs) take on more responsibility for the same pay.
And that's no slight to LPNs.. I can't imagine they'd want to do RN work for LPN pay either.
Would RN pay go down? Not directly, but only because nobody wants that slammed to their record. But I could easily imagine other bad things happening. There's just no money to pay more. So the only realistic option seems to be for it to stay the same or to get paid less.
From FEMA/Homeland Security's approach on Hurrican Katrina, the "War on Drugs", and the war in Iraq.. it seems the government is great at spending TONS of money for no results.
The other possible downside is the private contracting that goes on with the government. Look at all of the lucrative contracts for Halliburton during Katrina and the "private contractors" in Iraq. They get paid TONS of money - but the actual employees and soldiers do not.
It makes me wonder if the same sort of contracts would go out to some niche of healthcare providers while nurses ended up being treated like second class workers :angryfire
Here's a video I liked:
I haven't heard anything yet to truly suggest to me that letting the government handle my job duties, pay, etc. is a good thing *shrug*
Why not simply debate the facts rather than spread false rumours in an attempt to discourage others from supporting a candidate? If someone finds it necessary to make stuff up to discredit another, then obviously their own political beliefs aren't that strong (or appealing) to begin with.
Why not simply debate the facts rather than spread false rumours in an attempt to discourage others from supporting a candidate? If someone finds it necessary to make stuff up to discredit another, then obviously their own political beliefs aren't that strong (or appealing) to begin with.
Yeah, everyone loses in those cases.
To pretty much put to rest that Hillary quote, here's some more discussion on it at snopes.com. Just browsing it looked like there was some good discussion there. Taken out of context or a straight out lie, they have more to go off of than we do it seems:
If a socialized medical system comes about then theres got to be SOME form of goverment price control over the prices being charged by the drug companies, hospitals, and doctors and so if there is price controls then everyone in the medical system would get pinched right? There just wont be the same amount of money as there is right now so everyone from HMO's all the way down to nurses would get a financial bite in the butt correct?
If a socialized medical system comes about then theres got to be SOME form of goverment price control over the prices being charged by the drug companies, hospitals, and doctors and so if there is price controls then everyone in the medical system would get pinched right? There just wont be the same amount of money as there is right now so everyone from HMO's all the way down to nurses would get a financial bite in the butt correct?
if a socialized medical system comes about then theres got to be some form of goverment price control over the prices being charged by the drug companies, hospitals, and doctors and so if there is price controls then everyone in the medical system would get pinched right? there just wont be the same amount of money as there is right now so everyone from hmo's all the way down to nurses would get a financial bite in the butt correct?
hs, don't worry about whether you will make more or less money when you get your nursing degree. you really cannot control that. just be proud you will be a future nurse.
Jules A, MSN
8,864 Posts
Ummm the one he left his other wife for?