transgender nurse (transvestite)

LeesieBug · Jan 10, 2004

And who are you to be calling these people "deviants"?

"Deviant" is not an insult. It is an accurate description of behavior that is outside of socially accepted norms, WITHOUT making a judgment regarding whether the behavior is "right" or "wrong". As a female, if was to walk around with a was of chew in my cheek, and spit while walking down the street, I would be "deviant". It's not a word we should be offended by.

Main Entry: de-vi-ant

Pronunciation: -&nt

Function: adjective

Date: 15th century

: deviating especially from an accepted norm

- deviant noun

That said, I do not think the person should necessarily be prevented from becoming a nurse. HOWEVER, I think it is naive to believe that she will not ever have to face issues with patients who can tell that she is a he, or at least suspect that this is so (ESPECIALLY if the person changes presentaion from male to female, as mentioned.) It would be very important for her to learn how to handle such situations professionally, and with sensitivity to the patient, and also learn how to protect her own feelings in such a situation. I think it may make some patients feel "deceived". Especially certain heterosexual men, edlerly and conservative people would be quite distressed.

I am of the "whatever floats your boat" mentality, but part of working with people is knowing that everyone is different....us, as well as those we serve. If we are unique in a way that may make others uncofortable, we need to be prepared to deal with that.

fab4fan · Jan 10, 2004

"Deviant" may not techinically be an insult, but it sure can be used as one. It came across to me as an insult/comment made out of prejudice.

MishlB · Jan 10, 2004

Originally posted by nursecathy
I am a Practical Nursing Instructor. I have had a transgender accepted into my program. He/she is a cross dresser, presents as a female but has male sex organs. I had no control over this person getting in based on numbers only. What are your thoughts on this issue? Should we allow a nurse to take care of the patients who misrepresents their sex? I feel that it is wrong. Nursing is much too personal at times.

Don't jump to conclusions. Treat this person the same as others, and base your judgements on performance. Why would you treat them any different than another student? Unfortunately, I think this student is being set up to fail, based on your comments. Too bad. We need nurses, regardless of parts.

twarlik · Jan 10, 2004

There seems to be some concern about this person "being male one day and female the next." I've met a couple of pre-op transsexuals and I can tell you that this was never an issue. If this person is seriously pursuing a sex change then they will be living as and presenting themselves as female each and every day. As for their mental state, I don't really feel that this should come into question. This person's mental state is no more questionable than anyone else's. I think the OP should meet the person and see what their situation is, since it seems that at this point they have only very cursory information regarding the student.

As for future patients...I can imagine it causing some discomfort for a few people. No matter how much surgery a transsexual has, there will always be people who pick up the clues that say, "I used to be a man!" The voice, the hands, the always present adam's apple...This person is probably already used to dealing with this sort of thing and don't think the OP should worry too much about it. Give this person the support they deserve and they may one day turn out to be a great nurse!

Please keep us updated on this. I'm interested to hear how this goes.

LeesieBug · Jan 10, 2004

It came across to me as an insult/comment made out of prejudice.

Prime example of everyone being different. I did not see it that way at all.

dragonfly954 · Jan 10, 2004

you would be quite surprised how many people are transexuals,crossdressers,etc working in the medical profession.

BRANDY LPN · Jan 10, 2004

"At the last hospital I worked we had a Cardiothoracic Surgeon who underwent a sex change. She had to send out a letter to all her patients informing them and while a few left, most stayed." QUOTE

Why would she have to send such a letter? Did this person live as a man and then suddenly have a sex change? If not why would it be any of her pts business? I for one do not care about my health care providers (nurses included) sexual identity and DO NOT want to know, not because this would make me uncomfortable in a judgemental way but I fell it is very unprofessional to share this with a pt. I dont go around discussing my sex life and wouldnt want to hear about some one elses.

As to the OP let this student have a chance there is no reason that this person couldnt be a wonderful nurse.

Louisepug · Jan 10, 2004

This is an interesting topic and actually hits very close to home for me. My aunt Stephanie whom I was very close to, was a transgender/transvestite that passed away from a heart attack a year ago. She was formally a man but dressed/looked like a woman and honestly believed that she was in the wrong body. She had breasts, long hair etc., but I don't think she ever had the final genitailia surgery done. Anyway, I do know that her life was very, VERY hard and full of lonliness/depression, struggling etc. She was very successful in her work but people (even in L.A where she lived) still discriminated her even to the day of her death. I guess what I want to say is that, would we or do we as nurses discriminate against a nurse who has diagnosed depression or mental disorder? A nurse who is gay? A nurse of a different culture? A nurse that has breast cancer? A nurse that has a deformity? The answer is hopefully, "no," because these are things that we as a society have come to pretty much accept. Just because someone may look different on the outside doesn't mean anything about the inside. I think it's awesome that this person is obviously following their calling to be a nurse, and not letting their sexuality hold them back. I think that makes this person admirabley strong and we can all learn from his/her strength. As far as patients go in a hospital setting; well, there are all kinds of patients so there should be all kinds of nurses, right? If I were transgendered and a trans. nurse was taking care of me I would feel really happy about that and comforted. And who knows, maybe this person will end up in some kind of specialty field and not even in a regular hospital. I just think that this shouldn't even be a concern, although I know for most people who didn't have someone like this is their family it would be, but it just makes me sad to think that there's all this fuss over this person when they are obviously just trying to do some good in this world. I think it would deepley hurt this person to know that such a big deal was being made about their sexual identity affecting their ability to follow their dream. Please just try to understand this person as much as you can. Read up on the topic, anything, but please don't make them feel unwelcomed in your program. They already get plenty of that in society. Louisepug

allnurses Guide · Jan 10, 2004

I guess what I'm concerned about, especially in reading all the diverse opinions just right here on our little bulletin board, is that this is a very emotional issue for the student. Nursing school just doesn't seem to be the right place to start to work this issue out. My first day of nursing school, a woman showed up with a cast on her leg. She had tripped coming out her front door and broken her leg. She assumed she would be able to continue in the nursing program. When the instructors came into the room, they spotted her cast and asked her to accompany her to another room. They came back alone.

Making sure someone has the physical and emotional stability to complete a nursing program seems a function of the instructors. It is pretty distracting to have someone changing back and forth trying to come to terms with the huge change they will physically and emotionally be going through, while at the same time undertaking nursing school.

steph

allnurses Guide · Jan 10, 2004

Originally posted by Louisepug
This is an interesting topic and actually hits very close to home for me. My aunt Stephanie whom I was very close to, was a transgender/transvestite that passed away from a heart attack a year ago. She was formally a man but dressed/looked like a woman and honestly believed that she was in the wrong body. She had breasts, long hair etc., but I don't think she ever had the final genitailia surgery done. Anyway, I do know that her life was very, VERY hard and full of lonliness/depression, struggling etc. She was very successful in her work but people (even in L.A where she lived) still discriminated her even to the day of her death. I guess what I want to say is that, would we or do we as nurses discriminate against a nurse who has diagnosed depression or mental disorder? A nurse who is gay? A nurse of a different culture? A nurse that has breast cancer? A nurse that has a deformity? The answer is hopefully, "no," because these are things that we as a society have come to pretty much accept. Just because someone may look different on the outside doesn't mean anything about the inside. I think it's awesome that this person is obviously following their calling to be a nurse, and not letting their sexuality hold them back. I think that makes this person admirabley strong and we can all learn from his/her strength. As far as patients go in a hospital setting; well, there are all kinds of patients so there should be all kinds of nurses, right? If I were transgendered and a trans. nurse was taking care of me I would feel really happy about that and comforted. And who knows, maybe this person will end up in some kind of specialty field and not even in a regular hospital. I just think that this shouldn't even be a concern, although I know for most people who didn't have someone like this is their family it would be, but it just makes me sad to think that there's all this fuss over this person when they are obviously just trying to do some good in this world. I think it would deepley hurt this person to know that such a big deal was being made about their sexual identity affecting their ability to follow their dream. Please just try to understand this person as much as you can. Read up on the topic, anything, but please don't make them feel unwelcomed in your program. They already get plenty of that in society. Louisepug

I appreciate what you've shared. I don't think you can call being concerned about whether the timing is right for nursing school discrimination. To use some of your examples, if a student found out they had breast cancer and was going to need surgery and chemo, the timing might not be right for nursing school. That isn't discrimination. If a student had a mental disorder, wouldn't it be smart to get help first and make sure you had the emotional stability to withstand the pressures of school before starting school? That also is not discrimination. I think what some folks here are questioning is the timing of when this transgendered person is applying to nursing school. I don't think anyone here has said that we want to discriminate simply based on the issue of transgendered identity. That we want to keep this person from becoming a nurse forever. My concern is the timing only.

steph

dreamon · Jan 10, 2004

Originally posted by TinyNurse
as a nurse that just graduated I both can and can't believe that this topic came to this board........... This person ( student) is a human being regardless male/female whatever..... they need to be treated as such. ( a human) I graduated in 2003 and, um isn't a big topic "cultural diversity"???? I mean how can the students learn from you if you cannot yet accept your own ideas regarding cultural diversity?
Treat it as just another nursing class, attempt to incorporate more cultrual diversity issues and you will teach all of your students ALOT!!!!
This can be an issue dealt with daily in city hospitals. nurses need to feel comfortable with it. Be a leader, do not be afraid..... Open the road to cultural diversity with this........ what a great opener~!!!
xo Jen

Tiny Nurse, I appreciate your outlook on this situation. Transgender/sexuals will be coming out more and more in the future. I am NOT surprised that someone brought this topic up. There are many close-minded people on this board.

Obviously is this student comes to class dressed as a woman and is taking female hormones...why use the 'he/she'? what is a he/she?

I am sure that some people will have a problem with this student using a female bathroom.

So what?

Are there open stalls in the restroom?

Are you uncomfortable that she will see you washing your hands??

Get over yourselves people...we are a few years into a new millennium. At least try to learn about someone before condemning them.I feel sorry for people with no empathy for others who are not like themelves. Life will be rough for you in the future.

BadBird, BSN, RN · Jan 10, 2004

Reading your post makes you sound prejucided against this person and they haven't even started yet. When you are sick you need a smart and compassionate nurse, it doesn't matter their sexual preference or dress style, you aren't having sex with them. This person has probably already had a difficult time in todays society without added stress of having instructors negative attitudes. I wish that person luck, it takes guts.