Terminated

[sdugan07]

Wow, this is very hard to take in. I was just fired for something that I didn't even know I did wrong. I used my nursing judgement in Friday when a patient did something and I wrote a note about it. I even checked with 2 other nurses (sitting at the desk with me) to make sure a general note was adequate not an "expanded note" and they said that's all they would do too.

In any case it's the "termination process" that's killing me here. I was advised by a supervisor over the weekend to check in with someone from administration to review my "file" on Monday. Monday morning I get a phone call from another supervisor about Fridays incident, I explained in full detail. On my way in on Monday I get another phone call about Fridays "incident," I explain in full detail, said that it's all in my note and asked if I had anything to worry about. We arranged to meet Wednesday. I told her I was on my way in then anyway, she said not necessary.

I went in to review my file. My DON saw me, glared and went into her office. I went to see an administraitor I had a good connection with and told her that I wanted to sit down with her and review my file in private. We ran around for 10 minutes until I was told that the DON was ready to see me. I said that I wasn't here to see her and we were meeting Wednesday. Didn't seem to matter.

I went in. DON at her desk. Supervisor who called me at a table taking notes. They told me that I was suspended and I wasnt supposed to be there. Nobody had told me I was suspended before this. We had only aggreed to meet on Wednesday. They asked me to explain Fridays events where I did nothing wrong. I explained. I was criticized. I defended. They yelled. I started sweating, shaking and told theme that I had only come in to see my file. I left the office.

I was pulled into HR. They showed me my file. HR went to see my DON. The administrator I "trusted" came in to see me. I tried talking to her about my write ups to understand them because I didn't and then she started asking me about my wedding, insisting we lighten the mood and talk about that instead.

HR returned and said I needed to go back to the DON's office. DON, Suservisor, HR and me. I was told that I broke policy. I asked what one and if I could see it, they said no. I asked HR to advocate for me, she said that she has to advocate for everyone in the room, including the DON and Supervisor. I was handed a paper that said I was terminated. I told them I did what I was trained to do, they need to re-educate the people who trained me. They said this isn't about them, this is about you. I got up and walked out. HR followed my yelling "I'm going to need your badge!" I tried to step into an office she said " you can't go in there!" Then "don't forget to bring back your badge!"

I don't know I'm mixed up. I was looking for other employment and I'm about 90% sure I have another job. But this termination process seems very weird. I have felt like my head had been on a chopping block for weeks and I think they were looking for anything to kick me out. Should I do anything about this? If so, what?

[magslu]

sdugan

I was terminated in a similar fashion. They took situations and turned them into major issues. I told friends about it just to get a sanity check if I really did something off.

In the end, I realize..... if they don't like you and it could be for the way you wear your hair even. They will build a case against you....for me, it was to build a misconduct case so they could block my unemployment.

I pretty much found something better, the company treats me right...... move on...let it go and find a place that appreciates you

[KatieMI, BSN, MSN, RN]

sdugan

I was terminated in a similar fashion. They took situations and turned them into major issues. I told friends about it just to get a sanity check if I really did something off.

In the end, I realize..... if they don't like you and it could be for the way you wear your hair even. They will build a case against you....for me, it was to build a misconduct case so they could block my unemployment.

I pretty much found something better, the company treats me right...... move on...let it go and find a place that appreciates you

Same story happened with me... TWICE. Eventually, I figured out that if they cannot live with someone near being too smart, then too bad for them, not for me. I found a place where I was, and is, treated very well precisely because of the above, and very happy there.

OP, if you have at least a year of experience and not afraid to really work hard, take a careful look on local agency/local travel nursing. You'll be an outsider, so mostly out of reach of local management and HR as well (unless you do something really crazy) and internal politicking and see and feel for yourself the interior of the unit before you decide to land there or move along. You can try another one any moment you like it. Money can be much better as well. And, agencies more often than not do not care a dime about terminations and work history in general as long as your license us clean. Agency can be hard and unpredictable, but I won't exchange my low prestige Med/Surg on steroids on any posh place where gossip is the main time killer and a code run once in 24 months in ACLS class.

[Meriwhen, ASN, BSN, MSN, RN]

You don't have to share any details you don't want--and honestly, it's a lot better for you if you don't. But at the same time, without details it's hard to judge whether your termination did have merit, or if it was a three-ring circus and you were unwillingly cast as the main clown.

If you do feel that you were terminated unfairly, you could consult with a lawyer versed in employment law and see what he/she thinks. Most lawyers will give you an initial consult for free or at reduced cost, and they can tell you if you have a case worth pursuing. But don't expect the lawyer to turn it into a megabucks cash payout. Also don't look for lawyer to be able to get your job back...and to be honest, given what happened, you probably shouldn't go back to work there anyway. You'd have a target on your back the minute you return.

Sorry this happened. Best of luck on whatever you decide to do.

[Meriwhen, ASN, BSN, MSN, RN]

7). There is no such thing as "excessive nursing note". If it has to be the size of "War and Peace", so be it.

THIS. Keep it objective, but make sure it has all the critical information. Do not presume that people will understand/infer something that you left out because you thought it was blatantly obvious and didn't need to add it.

Also chart as though it will be exhibit A in a courtroom, because it very well may be. Thorough charting can be the thing that saves your job/reputation/license.

[applewhitern, BSN, RN]

Exactly what I was thinking, CelticGoddess. In my state, they can fire you without cause. No unions here, either. When you accept a job, you sign a paper that states they can fire you without cause, and that you can quit without cause.

[kbrn2002, ADN, RN]

There may not be anything you can do about a termination, deserved or not. The very first paragraph of our employee handbook states that the employer can terminate employment with or without notice and with or without reason. The employee also can leave with or without notice and with or without reason. Of course, buried about 30 pages into the "these are the multiple pages of reasons we can and will fire you" handbook it also states that if the employee leaves without proper notice said employee will not be eligible for rehire and will not receive any vacation/benefit money accrued.

Since the employee has to sign that handbook, it is acknowledging that the employee is aware that that they can be fired for any reason or absolutely no reason at all and there is no recourse. A good, very expensive lawyer may be able to something with it but I doubt if it would be worth it.

I am sorry you ended up in this situation, but you can hold your head high knowing you truly did nothing wrong and move on to bigger and better things. After all, why would you even want to fight to keep your job with an employer that treats you like that.

[injured1]

Seems extremely, if I perceived an error, when I was DON, I tried turning it into a "teachable moment"

best wishes

Stories like this is what motives me to become an N.P w specialty straight out of Nursing school for grad with health information as dual degree. So I don't have to deal with these horror stories I see you guys go through. Literally I a viewing nursing school as just an undergrad. Study, get a good G.P.A in nursing, I have all the sciences, Mico, Micro lab, Physics, Stats, Ap1 and 2, Medical Term, human growth and development, even took an occupational therapy class, Chemistry, Nuclear Chemistry, will also have patho physiology coming up next semester, and I have 90 credit hours already.

Question: I was going to go for an ADN program, but I also like the academics of Micro( I hate the lab - 38 assignments in 28 meetings lab sessions for 1 credit hour ) and AP1 and Ap2. I always thought OT would be good, but NP pays higher. I was thinking ADN, 24 months...then get a bachelors awarded with the ADN. Then go take maybe two bridge classes then M.S.N in NP. Is this a bad route for me? I just am a male, and honestly..I am matter of fact. Cattiness I would clasg with, bc of my of fact demeanor. I care about results and effort, not what billy did, or bobby joe did....I have been told, I have a very strong personality. I would like to thank that my AP teacher was an M.D endocrinologist for 20 years, my micro teacher had their Ph.D in microbiology. Chemistry classes, Ph.D, even my communications class was taught by a lawyer..I got no breaks with my profs...Like really a lawyer for simple communications lol.

However, when I talk, it can be T cells and B cells...other students would pick my brain from other classes. I just took the hard profs but one's who gave me alot of info. I like the to view someone as a whole...example...if their head of humerus is internally rotated in, possible sub scap weakness, also impingement or even bicep tendon related, if they have shoulder pain. Or...a person having an organ removed and a bag....seeing if they are ok not just physically but mentally. Understanding everything as a whole. Using data to improve outcomes, etc.

Some say, I don't think like a nurse...like I need to know a reasoning behind everything, not just know, example if someone has a stroke on the right side, it's a left CVA...ok great to know, but why? Stuff like that. The reasoning, and the process of things. Am I going about this right? Is nursing just real catty?

[injured1]

Auto correct got me ^^^^^

[Amethya]

I got fired myself from my last job, I had to share a computer with a co-worker, she had my password and everything, because I don't have anything to hide. I was looking for another job, but when it was after hours and everyone left. The next day, I guess she decided to snoop and found I was looking for another job and told my boss. When we were about to leave, she called me in and told me I was fired because I was looking for another job. I didn't know how to defend myself, so I let her talk and she said she was doing me a favor and just putting "Ms. Amethya wasn't fit for the job." instead of what I did, to make it easier for me to find, in her words. I grabbed my stuff and left.

[cjcsoon2bnp, MSN, RN, NP]

Stories like this is what motives me to become an N.P w specialty straight out of Nursing school for grad with health information as dual degree. So I don't have to deal with these horror stories I see you guys go through. Literally I a viewing nursing school as just an undergrad. Study, get a good G.P.A in nursing, I have all the sciences, Mico, Micro lab, Physics, Stats, Ap1 and 2, Medical Term, human growth and development, even took an occupational therapy class, Chemistry, Nuclear Chemistry, will also have patho physiology coming up next semester, and I have 90 credit hours already.

Question: I was going to go for an ADN program, but I also like the academics of Micro( I hate the lab - 38 assignments in 28 meetings lab sessions for 1 credit hour ) and AP1 and Ap2. I always thought OT would be good, but NP pays higher. I was thinking ADN, 24 months...then get a bachelors awarded with the ADN. Then go take maybe two bridge classes then M.S.N in NP. Is this a bad route for me? I just am a male, and honestly..I am matter of fact. Cattiness I would clasg with, bc of my of fact demeanor. I care about results and effort, not what billy did, or bobby joe did....I have been told, I have a very strong personality. I would like to thank that my AP teacher was an M.D endocrinologist for 20 years, my micro teacher had their Ph.D in microbiology. Chemistry classes, Ph.D, even my communications class was taught by a lawyer..I got no breaks with my profs...Like really a lawyer for simple communications lol.

However, when I talk, it can be T cells and B cells...other students would pick my brain from other classes. I just took the hard profs but one's who gave me alot of info. I like the to view someone as a whole...example...if their head of humerus is internally rotated in, possible sub scap weakness, also impingement or even bicep tendon related, if they have shoulder pain. Or...a person having an organ removed and a bag....seeing if they are ok not just physically but mentally. Understanding everything as a whole. Using data to improve outcomes, etc.

Some say, I don't think like a nurse...like I need to know a reasoning behind everything, not just know, example if someone has a stroke on the right side, it's a left CVA...ok great to know, but why? Stuff like that. The reasoning, and the process of things. Am I going about this right? Is nursing just real catty?

This seems a bit off topic from the OP and I don't want to spin this off into another discussion entirely but..

If you view nursing school as "just an undergrad" and seek to immediately go into an NP program with health information duel degree why not just get a BS in biology or something related and then go into a PA program? Most NP programs have fewer clinical hours than PA programs because they are relying on the fact that most applicants have been RNs for a while and come in with a good degree of clinical experience. You don't seem to identify with the role of a nurse at all so why not go straight to a PA program which will give you more clinical hours and the fact that you don't have prior clinical experience is not as significant. I work with PAs and NPs (and am in the process of becoming an NP myself) and it just seems to me like your post sounds like someone who is better suited to a PA program.

Best of luck!

!Chris

[sdugan07]

Being a few days out from this I think I have a better understanding of what happened here now. Last week I asked one of my supervisors and 2 of the providers for references as I was seeking new employment. I think my DON (who started over the summer and hasn't liked me since I refused a mandate to pull a 16 hour shift due to a medical condition) caught wind of my job seeking. What happened on Friday really wasn't anything. I have spoken to several nurses about it and they were surprised that it was even brought up for questioning let alone, write up/termination. I hadn't thought about Friday's event since I finished my note about it on Friday. Usually if it is something, you might think about it. The only reason I would want to do anything is to protect my reputation, not my job, I have no interest in taking it back. However, I'm not even sure that my reputation is going to be damaged by this that much anyway, I have seen some fabulous nurses fired from this facility and the turnover rate is out of this world. I guess it would just be better to leave it behind me.

[middymids]

I understand your plight, as I too had nearly the same type of incident happen this past June. I was written up by peers, and you need to remember that these "write-ups" are all he said-she said. You never get to face your accuser, and HR always backs the institution. The institution is always right, and the employee is always wrong (thrown under the bus). I am sorry that you had to face this kind of employer and manager. One would think that today, needing nurses, that the institutions would find a more "adult " way to handle conflicts, and not always jump to "write-up" an individual.