So disappointed in hospital RNs and MDs

Nurses Relations

Published

I'm an RN, now FNP x 5 years with over 15 years of ER/CCU and ICU experience. Is it old fashioned to expect RNs to do a full assessment at the beginning of their shift?

I have a colleague/NP friend who has been in the hospital now x 1 week. I will spare the details, but she was admitted, discharged, admitted urgently to another hospital and then transferred back to the original hospital. In her whole WEEK of admission, she says just ONE RN and one MD even put a stethoscope to her back. A pleural effusion was MISSED because no one did this basic assessment. Is this the norm now? Do med/surg RNs chart their "make believe" assessment every day?? How do they do this and just flat out lie every day without being caught ? She spoke up at first, but soon tired of feeling like some crazed out NP who was being so picky about her care. She thought it would be interesting to see who would and who would not do an assessment. She says the new RN will come on shift, say hello, walk up to the in room computer and start charting a bunch of notes, pass meds and then continue with the same pattern all day. No bowel sounds auscultated, no lung sounds auscultated. Magical patient care without touching the patient !! This is at a pretty major size hospital too in a major metro area. I have to say I experienced something similar a few years ago but not nearly as bad.

Thoughts?

As you've correctly pointed out, nursing practice is being slowly phased out. I completely agree it's unacceptable for nurses not to be performing basic nursing assessments (which by the way wouldn't have caught the pleural effusion, which can only be differentiated through percussion which isn't part of the general scope of nurses), but if you've noticed the same problem then it's the overall trend of taking away nurse's ability to be nurses that should be what you want to change.

Percussion.... ain't nobody got time for that.

However I have auscultated many pleural effusions.. they have a distinctive "squeal".

While I think not assessing each patient every shift is 100% wrong, as a former floor nurse, I do get how it can happen. I also get, despite a lack of assessment, why a nurse would falsely document having done an assessment. And I think steps should be taken to make these people be held accountable for what they've documented.

I don't think that nurses and physicians skipping assessments is at all uncommon, and I think management knows this, and I think the JC knows this. What is baffling to me, is that they have survey questions like if the hospital was quiet enough during their stay, but not if the doctors and nurses listened to their lungs, heart, and bowels, and checked their pulses during each shift.

If they include questions like whether or not the side effects of each medication was explained to them, I think an assessment related question could be very easily included. Nurses and doctors who don't do assessments don't do them because they know they will probably never get caught, and I think they're probably right.

The lack of follow up on this issue by the powers that be is, in my opinion, direct evidence that they truly are not concerned with the health status of the community they serve. They worry about hourly rounding NOT to enhance patient safety, but to increase the likelihood of higher satisfaction scores. They worry about things like having oral care on vented patients documented q4h (or q2h, wth?) because they don't get paid to treat hospital-acquired infections, and not because the patient suffers.

They are all so concerned with what has been documented, so they can prove something wasn't their fault, and maybe still get reimbursed, but I have yet to witness or even hear about anyone checking to see if these things are actually being done.

Specializes in ICU.
Your fake charting allows your employer to pretend that they are providing adequate staffing. Grow a pair and act like a professional, it's YOUR license and reputation on the line.

Technically speaking, my employer is providing adequate staffing. I almost never get tripled. Even with adequate staffing, some days it is difficult to get everything done.

I will be 100% honest on my charting when someone starts sending me a check monthly to cover my mortgage and living expenses, which I will not be able to cover after I get fired. When you find someone willing to do that, please let me know. I really wouldn't mind never having to work again.

Technically speaking, my employer is providing adequate staffing. I almost never get tripled. Even with adequate staffing, some days it is difficult to get everything done.

I will be 100% honest on my charting when someone starts sending me a check monthly to cover my mortgage and living expenses, which I will not be able to cover after I get fired. When you find someone willing to do that, please let me know. I really wouldn't mind never having to work again.

1000x yes to your last paragraph. Lots of righteous indignation from people who would be unlikely to support you when you're unemployed.

Specializes in Critical Care.

I find it hard to believe all these nurses every shift and day aren't doing full assessments. It takes all of five minutes tops to do a head to toe assessment and listen with the stethoscope! I always do full assessments, but I don't necessarily do them right when I start my shift as I'm 12 hours and usually the PM assessment is done by the prior shift. It seems odd to me and if I were the patient especially as a nurse and NP I would speak up if no one truly was doing assessments.

I have two thoughts. One I think this discussion is good. Far to often in nursing we have situations where everyone knows something is wrong but no one wants to talk about it because they don't want to implicated as a bad nurse. If we don't talk about the temptation to become sloppy then more people are going to become sloppy. As a health care system we are far more concerned with documentation than patient care. So there is always a push when the assignment is busy to sacrifice assessment time for documentation time. It doesn't have to happen that way. As many people pointed out you can do a pretty quick and through assessment.

The other problem is these nurses who slowly stop doing assessments fall into a hole. They start to loose those assessment skills and therefore their assessment is less useful and even less of a priority. For example the difference between crackles and rhonchi can be hard to distinguish. So we need to be aware of this and keep teaching these basic skills for those who want to become better nurses.

It is not just hospitals. I am a RN at a nursing home. Doctors visit their residents and don't even bring a stethoscope! Nurses in our facility don't even carry a stethoscope either. How are they listening to lung and bowel sounds with no scope?

Specializes in Hospital Education Coordinator.

What a pity and what a risk. How hard is it to do a basic assessment? Easier than staning in court trying to explain why you didn't do it.

After a hospital visit I looked at my medical records. The admit nurse indicated I had no scars. Well, I have a severe burn scar the entire length of my left leg. If only he had looked.

Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
Technically speaking, my employer is providing adequate staffing. I almost never get tripled. Even with adequate staffing, some days it is difficult to get everything done.

I will be 100% honest on my charting when someone starts sending me a check monthly to cover my mortgage and living expenses, which I will not be able to cover after I get fired. When you find someone willing to do that, please let me know. I really wouldn't mind never having to work again.

Honesty in your professional charting SHOULD have more to do with the ethics of your postition than your fear of being fired. Do you think you won't be fired if your employer discovers the lack of "honesty" in the medical records? If you get fired you are likely eligible for UEB, unless your employer can demonstrate that you somehow shouldn't, like maybe for charting stuff that you did not do. That pattern of behavior could surely put you in a position of not working ever as a nurse again.

"Righteous indignation"? How about simple professionalism and ethics.

Specializes in ER, Med-surg.
I'm a medical-surgical RN and I do a COMPLETE assessment on each patient at the beginning of my shift and with any changes. There is no excuses. I do basic mentation (AAOx3, forgetful? eyesight hearing), respiratory system (lungs, cough, ask about sputum production, and do they feel short of breath), heart (listen to heart tones and ask about chest pain), belly (bowel sounds, ask about nausea, are they passing gas, nauseated, and when was the last time they moved their bowels). I then palpate radial and pedal pulses and assess for edema. Finally, I check for wounds and at IV / drain / tube feeding sites. If the patient is bedbound I bring my nursing assistant in with me and turn to assess the buttocks and to see if the patient is incontinent. I ambulate most of my patients x1-2 a shift to assess movement. I also cross check IV infusions and drips at the beginning of the shift.

I will also do focused assessments (neuros if ordered, angio sites, surgical dressings, CIWA / withdrawal scale) more frequently if ordered (q2-4hr). I also assess patency of central lines once a shift with flushes.

I am insulted that many people assume medical surgical nurses are lazy with their assessments. Most of my assessment I can get with just laying eyes on and discussing with the patient.

What's your nurse to patient ratio?

I will be 100% honest on my charting when someone starts sending me a check monthly to cover my mortgage and living expenses, which I will not be able to cover after I get fired. When you find someone willing to do that, please let me know. I really wouldn't mind never having to work again.

So you are comfortable with the reality that your false documentation could harm your patients?

Charting dishonestly is acceptable to you because you believe doing so is necessary for your job security? The continuance of your salary is more important than your professional and ethical responsibilities to your patients?

Do you not practice ethics in your personal life? Did nursing school not teach you about your great responsibility to patients and their families; that your professional duty is to be truthful? How can you advocate for your patients' well-being when you are documenting dishonestly?

Please take time to think long and hard about what you are doing. Most nurses on this thread find falsely documenting patient care to be reprehensible, and find failure to properly assess patients inexcusable. Please think about what is at stake for patients and their families, who are trusting you to be acting in their best interests, and are relying on your accurate assessments and documentation of care. Think about the rest of the team you are working with, who are also relying on your documentation in their actions with patients. It is appalling to me that you put your own needs above your patients.

I wonder if there's a difference in the incidence of these things in magnet hospitals vs non-magnet hospitals.

Food for thought.

+ Add a Comment