SORRY - i have to rant about this. I don't want to start a fight- and I'm not going to generalize about all BSN or ADN programs. They have to be evaluated individually on their own merits but....... The constant arguement over ADN vs BSN is driving me crazy!!!! People act like I've really got a choice- like I can just walk out and "get" either one. ya right.
I am a 36yo pre-nursing student at a CC (in greater OKC metro). I have a previous BS in a science. I still have pre-reqs to do and support course to finish just to be competitive. & believe me- competition is HIGH- even for the lowly ADN Last semester there were 300 applicants for 50 spots. I have loved all my instructors, been impressed with the level of instruction, and feel prepared.
I have never seen an ad for a job that said "ADN need not apply"- all they ask for is the RN current license- yes, I understand that the BSN may be needed to go into higher mangement etc.
NOW, why I'm not doing the BSN. Here in OKC we have a few BSN programs at state & private universities, and even a few BS to BSN accelerated. The tuition ranges from $20,000 to over $50,000. Having loans from a previous degree & a husband that makes a good salary- I don't qualify for financial aid. SO....if anyone expects me to get that degree- hand over the $$$$$$, please. Also, the BSN programs don't accept many students- the smaller universities have only 20-50/ year and the larger major university accepts around 120/year. &That particular program had over 700 applicants last year!!!! YA I can just walk in and "get" my BSN- hahahahah
BTW- compare NCLEX pass rates
major university- 83% my CC - 87%
university#2 - 57% cc#2 - 87%
university #3 - 50% cc#3 - 82%
now, tell me- would I really want to go to a program that only 50% passed?? what good is a BSN if I can't pass boards? I realize there are many factors to it, but come on....50%!
Let me give you an eye opening fact---if OKC (local metro areas) went to "all BSN" this year and did away with ADN--they would lose 248 new nurses! (that's how many passed boards from 3 major ccs last year) WOW- you think we're short on nurses now- try cutting out all those new grads.
I'm just frustrated with the whole discussion. Like I've said, people act like all of us have EVERY option available, or that we can afford it, or that these programs are just waiting for me to come and "get" my degree.
At least around here- all the ADN/ASD are very professional, highly technical, and very competitive. There are no "waiting lists". You have to apply every semester, meet basic requirements, then compete with GPA, preference points, etc. NONE of them simply put you on a list for meeting the requirements.
It may be different in your neck of the woods, but that how it sits here.
Everyone has to make their own choice, evaluate their own needs and the programs available. I'm done- I feel better - thanks for listening:rolleyes:
I think you made some very valid points. Many people seem to believe that everyone in this country has access to a four-year degree, and that those of us who don't have that degree are not motivated in some way. There are no BSN programs around here, and the closest one requires a RN license before acceptance, so the local community college program is the ONLY choice for those of us who live around here, and who can't just move to a new city or state to get a BSN. Parents who want to go to nursing school can't just apply at colleges hundreds of miles away from home, move their families to that area, and take out student loans if they're already in debt. It is significantly less expensive to get an associate's degree than a BSN, and according to what I've seen on this site, the pay rate is not that different between the degrees. I also don't see any ads that say they won't hire a nurse with an associate's degree, so if you want a BSN, then that's great, but many nurses I know have well-paid jobs, and they "only" have an associate's degree.
I too am sick of the ADN/BSN debate. As said on an episode of ER, "what do you call the med student who graduated last in his class? You call him DOCTOR." Basically, whatever route you go, you are an RN. Whatever program works best for you, do it! I never would have thought I would go for the ADN - I grew up with the concept being drilled into my head that I had to "finish college, and get a bachelors." Well, that's great, and I plan to do that at some point, but it's not always possible immediately. Finances, needing to work while in school, family issues - people's lives are all different, and we all have different issues. I think anyone who has enough of a chip on their shoulder to look down on anyone because of having a "lesser degree" has exactly the degree they deserve - a BS degree! :rotfl: LOL, that whole degree name has always made me laugh, and for once I can actually use that play on words! I know many excellent ADN and BSN nurses - and the only difference I can tell between the degrees (other than the attitudes expressed by certain individuals) is the ability to be management/administration. LOL, why would I want to join the ranks of the nurse managers anyways? The only reason I want to get my BSN is so I can go on to be an NP. I know management is needed, and they need people who are going to be helpful to the staff nurses, but that is just not for me. ICK!!! Seriously, why do people have to have such inferiority complexes that they have to try and make people feel bad about the degree program they chose? In the end, we all have an RN after our name, and we do the same procedures to the same patients. People need to get over themselves already.
Hi! I will be graduating from a BSN program this August and it only took me ONE year to get my BSN (but it was an accelerated program).... much, much cheaper than going to my local community college and less time. Now, I just have to pass my NCLEX, but my school has a 99% pass rate.
I do have a question though. I've been looking online at hospitals, mainly in the NY metro area, and I find that the majority want BSN prepaired students. Does anyone know why that is? Why do the major cities only want BSN students over ADN students?
Hi! I will be graduating from a BSN program this August and it only took me ONE year to get my BSN (but it was an accelerated program).... much, much cheaper than going to my local community college and less time. Now, I just have to pass my NCLEX, but my school has a 99% pass rate.
I do have a question though. I've been looking online at hospitals, mainly in the NY metro area, and I find that the majority want BSN prepaired students. Does anyone know why that is? Why do the major cities only want BSN students over ADN students?
The DMC, Detroit Medical Center and Oakwood Hospitals here in Detroit, Mich also say BSN preferred on their job postings. I talked with a nurse recruiter at one of the larger Hospitals here in Detroit and she said the BSN is the current trend now. I have no idea why. She also said anyone could go the shorter route and the hospital would pay up to 70 percent tuition assistance for the ADN nurse to get his/her BSN at a later time.
If that's the way she really said it, i'd love to have told her "It's not a purse, it's a type of education."
I was not offended by it and alot of the RN openings at other hospitals do say BSN preffered. I don't know what area you are in and it may not be that way in your neighborhood. I live the Detroit area, lot's of hosptials here and schools. There are more CC's than Universitys also. I understood what she said. I am almost 40, been a nurse assitant for years and when I am 60, I may not be able to or want to bedside nursing. The way it looks I will be late 60's or early 70's before my age group can retire. It just opens more doors, and I figure while I am in school to go ahead and get it over with. I may not want to go back to school after getting hired on somewhere.
Well, it's not offensive, but to refer to it as a trend is like saying that 'it's popular NOW, may not be next week' instead of 'hey this job now requires more education'.
Well, it's not offensive, but to refer to it as a trend is like saying that 'it's popular NOW, may not be next week' instead of 'hey this job now requires more education'.
According to the nurses I have questioned regarding the ADN/BSN debate, it's all about upgrading the profession. Personally, I plan to go for my BSN once I'm working as a nurse anyway. The hospitals want you to attain that level of education so that their statistics are upgraded -- and I'm sure that has to do with the funding that is available and the criteria for said funding for the hospitals -- it behooves them to support that goal with tuition reimbursement at whatever percentage is the going rate for your region.
I also spoke with a friend of mine who is a financial administrator for a hospital, and he said that as hospitals get more and more regulated, it really is to their advantage, and to the advantage of the personnel to get the highest level of education possible for each person. So with such mutually beneficial information, why not take advantage. In a few years when the market is flooded with nurses, it WILL make a difference as to whether or not you can progress. Right now, with the shortage in some regions, it makes little difference as long as you have RN after your name.
Here's to all of us... the aspiring professionals making it whatever way we can!
According to the nurses I have questioned regarding the ADN/BSN debate, it's all about upgrading the profession. Personally, I plan to go for my BSN once I'm working as a nurse anyway. The hospitals want you to attain that level of education so that their statistics are upgraded -- and I'm sure that has to do with the funding that is available and the criteria for said funding for the hospitals -- it behooves them to support that goal with tuition reimbursement at whatever percentage is the going rate for your region.
I also spoke with a friend of mine who is a financial administrator for a hospital, and he said that as hospitals get more and more regulated, it really is to their advantage, and to the advantage of the personnel to get the highest level of education possible for each person. So with such mutually beneficial information, why not take advantage. In a few years when the market is flooded with nurses, it WILL make a difference as to whether or not you can progress. Right now, with the shortage in some regions, it makes little difference as long as you have RN after your name.
Here's to all of us... the aspiring professionals making it whatever way we can!
My college actually goes into some of the area hospitals and teaches the bridge classes that the ADNs need to become a BSN. My patho teacher teaches there 2 days a week:) I believe that the ADN students do not have to pay for the courses either and they are taught right in their own hospital...so convienient!
Nursing is one of the few 'professions' that has three entry way levels of education. OTs, PTs, STs all require a miminmum of a BA or BS. And a PT requires an Masters for entry level. We have been having this debate since the 50s. And it is unlikely to ever change. Why, because of the proliferation of associate degree programs (they far out number BSN programs); the growing shortage of nurse educators; the growing graying of nurse educators; the growing need for nurses. And I did not start out in a BSN program but a diploma one, graduating from an associate degree program and getting my BSN two years after graduating. And I did it without the assistance of my employer.
Until one settle on one entry level, no one will respect us as a profession. And I cannot honestly blame them.
Nursing is one of the few 'professions' that has three entry way levels of education. OTs, PTs, STs all require a miminmum of a BA or BS. And a PT requires an Masters for entry level. We have been having this debate since the 50s. And it is unlikely to ever change. Why, because of the proliferation of associate degree programs (they far out number BSN programs); the growing shortage of nurse educators; the growing graying of nurse educators; the growing need for nurses. And I did not start out in a BSN program but a diploma one, graduating from an associate degree program and getting my BSN two years after graduating. And I did it without the assistance of my employer.
Until one settle on one entry level, no one will respect us as a profession. And I cannot honestly blame them.
Grannynurse :balloons:
I totally agree. We are the only profession that has so many entry levels. Why is that? I feel that every other person in the health care setting needs at least a BS, why should the nurse be any different? But, I also understand that with the nursing shortage how can a BSN only status be implemented? I also feel that why should the ADN go on and get a BSN... the pay is relatively the same, there is no incentive. I will be graduating w/ my BSN in August, but I will complete my program in one year. If I didn't find an accelerated program, I would of went to my local community college and gotten my ADN, since I already have a BS in another field. However, I am glad that I am getting my BSN because I do feel the more education you have, the better! And eventually I want to go on and maybe get my NP, I just want to work first and pay off some schools loans and get experience.
Last semester there were 300 applicants for 50 spots. I have loved all my instructors, been impressed with the level of instruction, and feel prepared.
student4ever
335 Posts
I too am sick of the ADN/BSN debate. As said on an episode of ER, "what do you call the med student who graduated last in his class? You call him DOCTOR." Basically, whatever route you go, you are an RN. Whatever program works best for you, do it! I never would have thought I would go for the ADN - I grew up with the concept being drilled into my head that I had to "finish college, and get a bachelors." Well, that's great, and I plan to do that at some point, but it's not always possible immediately. Finances, needing to work while in school, family issues - people's lives are all different, and we all have different issues. I think anyone who has enough of a chip on their shoulder to look down on anyone because of having a "lesser degree" has exactly the degree they deserve - a BS degree! :rotfl: LOL, that whole degree name has always made me laugh, and for once I can actually use that play on words! I know many excellent ADN and BSN nurses - and the only difference I can tell between the degrees (other than the attitudes expressed by certain individuals) is the ability to be management/administration. LOL, why would I want to join the ranks of the nurse managers anyways? The only reason I want to get my BSN is so I can go on to be an NP. I know management is needed, and they need people who are going to be helpful to the staff nurses, but that is just not for me. ICK!!! Seriously, why do people have to have such inferiority complexes that they have to try and make people feel bad about the degree program they chose? In the end, we all have an RN after our name, and we do the same procedures to the same patients. People need to get over themselves already.