Should Nurse Managers...

[ThePrincessBride, MSN, RN, NP]

I hear a lot of horror stories on this site about how nursing "management" is, well, lacking in desire in the eyes of many nurses. Recently, a university near me just began an combine MSN/MBA program. I have never heard of such a program before.

With all the complaints about poor management in the field of nursing, do you feel that people should be required to take management/business courses before becoming managers/staff nurses?

[tyvin, BSN, RN]

If you are going to go in that direction the program sounds great. When I was in college I took business as a minor because I felt that was the direction I was going in. It will prepare nurses better to run places and be administraors IMO. Nothing worse then working and being scrutinized by adminiistrators with no nursing background.

[punkydoodlesRN, BSN, RN]

My Nurse manager has her MSN/MBA and has for about 15 years I think. I don't know if it makes her any better, I hardly even know her - just been there a few months. I did think it was weird when I interviewed to see MSN/MBA on her badge. Didn't realize it was a path for nurses.

[iNurseUK, RN]

I think the main issue is that nurse managers are often not clinicians or, in the increasingly rare instances that they are actually nurses, are so out of touch with present-day nursing and all it's modern technicalities that they might as well come from the Planet Zog. I'm pretty sure a few of ours are from Zog :)

[birdie22]

many of the NM i have met are more concerned with the finances of running a unit - not the floor nurses. i think an MSN/MBA looks good if you are the hospital hiring the NM, but if i cant respect my boss as a nurse, it doesnt really matter matter what letters come at the end of their name.

[rnccf2007, BSN, RN]

I am halfway done with completing my BSN and would like to pursue a Master's degree. The type of program you speak about is offered at my university and I have thought that may be an area I would consider pursuing. As iNurseUK stated, "I think the main issue is that nurse managers are often not clinicians or, in the increasingly rare instances that they are actually nurses, are so out of touch with present-day nursing and all it's modern technicalities..." I have worked with some nurse managers who quickly forgot where they came from, had not been on the floor for years, or were given a management position r/t a BSN but had never worked the floor. Does not make sense to me. I believe that everyone RN in management should work the floor at LEAST one day a month and walk in the shoes of the people they make decisions over. They just might change their tune. For example, at my last place of employment, a NM who had not worked the floor for years found another position, but decided to work prn as a staff nurse. Disaster! She ran around in circles and kept stating how far behind she was. I helped her as much as I could, even though she had previously written me up as a NM when I complained about short staffing. Another time, I was on a quality control team r/t central and PICC line infections. The leader was a Quality Control BSN who had never worked the floor and therefore had only knew about central and PICC lines in theory. Did not make sense to me.

[linearthinker, DNP, RN]

I am sure having knowledge of business and healthcare finance helps them do their jobs better. Since the avg staff nurse doesn't understand jack about healthcare finance, the fact that their boss does probably wouldn't impact or impress them much, lol. My guess is it is more valuable to them in the day to day performance of their job than a MSN in leadership or management, and probably more helpful career wise in the long run.

[llg, PhD, RN]

The MSN/MBA combination has been around for many years -- and I think it is the best combination for nursing management. People with that combination get education in nursing at an advance level and also education in business. I think that is better than either half of that education alone.

Then, if they want to advance further to the executive level, they are in good position to get a DNP and do a lot with it as a leader on a large scale.

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

i think msn/mba is a great combination for nurse managers, but i also think they should have experience as bedside nurses before going into management. i know a few new graduates who are just off orientation and are already halfway through msn/mba programs. they're bragging about how soon they'll have the manager's job, but meanwhile aren't paying much attention to the job they have now. i can't help but think they'll be poor managers because they'll lack a good deal of perspective about what nursing is all about.

my current manager, whom i think is awesome, spent a number of years at the bedside and excelled there before going into management. she's working on her msn/mba now and it's giving her new insights into the management aspects of her job. but she was already a terrific clinician and hasn't lost sight of the reason we're all here. unlike those newbies who really don't give a rip about bedside nursing but are just "marking time" so they can come to work in a suit.

[carolmaccas66, BSN, RN]

We have to do a management unit as part of our degree in Aust, though the course could have changed now.

[steelydanfan]

I am halfway done with completing my BSN and would like to pursue a Master's degree. The type of program you speak about is offered at my university and I have thought that may be an area I would consider pursuing. As iNurseUK stated, "I think the main issue is that nurse managers are often not clinicians or, in the increasingly rare instances that they are actually nurses, are so out of touch with present-day nursing and all it's modern technicalities..." I have worked with some nurse managers who quickly forgot where they came from, had not been on the floor for years, or were given a management position r/t a BSN but had never worked the floor. Does not make sense to me. I believe that everyone RN in management should work the floor at LEAST one day a month and walk in the shoes of the people they make decisions over. They just might change their tune. For example, at my last place of employment, a NM who had not worked the floor for years found another position, but decided to work prn as a staff nurse. Disaster! She ran around in circles and kept stating how far behind she was. I helped her as much as I could, even though she had previously written me up as a NM when I complained about short staffing. Another time, I was on a quality control team r/t central and PICC line infections. The leader was a Quality Control BSN who had never worked the floor and therefore had only knew about central and PICC lines in theory. Did not make sense to me.

When my nurse manager can take my pt load and function fully, when she decides to be an advocate for the state laws she is bound to follow instead of being a mouthpiece for the Corporation and try to evade such laws every chance she has; when she wants to design processes that help us instead of using the monthly staff meeting to lecture and harangue us; I just MIGHT respect her.

[rnccf2007, BSN, RN]

When my nurse manager can take my pt load and function fully, when she decides to be an advocate for the state laws she is bound to follow instead of being a mouthpiece for the Corporation and try to evade such laws every chance she has; when she wants to design processes that help us instead of using the monthly staff meeting to lecture and harangue us; I just MIGHT respect her.

Thank you