We had this huge discussion at work today, and i thought i'd get your opinions.
The statement was this: "We have to many people becoming nurses for the money. Its not like it used to be, where a nurse chose to be a nurse because they liked helping people. Its all about the money,."
We were talking about the increased patient complaints, and an older nurse stated the above and thats the reason for increased patient complaints.
First welcome to a rewarding career...regarding the entire union thing...See this is how I have personally seen it...of course nurses are taught not to want unions, well heck then we have something to fight for us, why would management want that or Department of Health. Every year we pay dues or license recert...where are those due's gone to? Not a single penny is spent on helping nurses, protect nurses against poor working conditions...the sole purpose of those dollars are to protect patients and the community, now don't get me wrong..patients need protect, some bad things have happened...however when will we pay into a system that helps us fight against nursing shortages, denied PTO, dismissals for being sick??? You won't see if from the nursing board even thou thoose things lead to patient safety issues.
So nurses need something to help us, yes we have our liability insurance...but you don't pay them to fight for PTO or nursing shortages you pay them if you are accused...hence we are litterly guilty until proven innocent, interesting in our judicial system isn't it? However unions we can pay dues to have them fight for PTO, nursing shortages, ridiculous accusations of reprimand(sick call), better benefits as in in health insurance. So therefore the few dollars that come out of my paycheck a month are well worth it. I have worked both places union and nonunion...The happier nurses are with unions, because they have something to fight for them...for the basic human/employee rights that nurses deserve. How many of you work without a break? How many of you forgot the last time you went to the bathroom while at work? These things are prevented with unions, it generally speaking is a ZERO tolerance level of such things. Don't you find it amazing that, empoyee rights, such as breaks, mean after 4 hours of work 15 min, after 6 hours of work 30 min lunc after 8 hours an additional 15 min...does that happen??? Not often but you know if employee's at McDonalds were denied a break action would be taken, not in nursing...it is live or die. That is what unions do for you, of course a company doesn't want them...no administration does. So I ask again are they bad??? When you have a voice, when your human rights your employee rights are protected and upheld...IMHO...heck no, one of the best additions to nursing...Now correct me if I am wrong but I believe the first union came to nursing at some point in the 90's after other labor industries had them for years. Yes I have worked nonunion places where they stated "open door", well that went as far as those words do, the manager didn't protect staff from improper justices. Interesting enough we perform a self sacrificing job, that litter sacrifices us. Obviously I fully support a union because they fully support an employee...IMO a patient is best taken care of by a happy nurse!
There are many opinions about unions, mine come from my own experience and contemplation on the matter. People are so hipped on patient safety that they don't realize the number one patient safety issue is short staffed and burned out nurses. That is why I am not in support of foreign nurses...I am sorry if that hurts anyone's feelings...I have a friend who came over as a foreign nurse due to culture's of the country she came from...she tolerates horrible BS at her employment, I try to explain that it isn't right but you cannot change an individuals culture or understand of life, I feel for her when she comes to me in tears...but honestly when one tolerates improper treatment it only opens the door for more improper treatment.
LOL Y'All are probally sick of my opinions by now...can't help it...I care not only about my patients but my fellow nurses and we deserve better treatment. The only way to have awarness of that is to verbalize it.
goingCoastal...unions prevent walk out on patients by scheduling STRIKES...company knows it is going to happen. If a group of nurses state we are striking such and such day, that is not walking out...that is just our given freedom in the US. Now I honestly have mixed feelings on the whole walk out thing..if a nurse just left and didn't tell anyone, yes she should be prosecuted..however if a nurse went to a supervisor and stated this isn't working i need help and didn't recieve help and then later went to the supervisor and stated she is leaving...she should not be in trouble. She did what she needed, she handed her patients over to her supervisor. I think the whole walk out prosecution thing is really a threat/scare tactic...a control issue to make nurses put up with more than what they should. Honestly I haven't seen a state board prosecute it unless no one was informed of the nurse leaving...correct me if I am wrong please. Again MHO. I love the "above that" statement from them, how can one be above something when one is treated worse, almost like a dog??? LOL That goingcoastal I know is not from you...just made me laugh to think, I am some how "above" someone, no one is above anyone, let alone someone who is treated better with respect.
Annette
Thanks for your response. I certaintly agree with you. I think you explained the attitude I encountered in school against unions for nurses, but its about time nurses started looking out for themselves, because it seems that Hospitals Adminstrators and the folks who are suppose to be doing it are not.
Nurses give so much of themselves everyday on the job, and
I think most enjoy caring for their patients, but at the same time, They are not treated fairly or compensated at the level they should be. As you stated above, a nurse who is exhausted certaintly affects patients care.
I went into nursing for the money. That doesn't mean I lack compassion or don't enjoy working with patients and familes.
It was a second (or third :chuckle ) career for me. I'm not 'called' to it, and as a recovering (former) Catholic, I have rejected the above-mentioned (and hilarilously accurate) 'monastic lifestyle'.
I'm not a religious person. I care about my patients. I believe it makes me a better nurse. Here's an example: the hospital where I was previously employed was a Catholic hospital. One of their stated philosphies was that when pain for a terminally ill patient cannot be adequately relieved the nurses should remind the patient of the "cleansing and spiritually purifying nature of suffering"
That philosphy only made me a fierce advocate for pain control.
Nursing school did not prepare me for the real world of nursing; we were taught "ivory-tower" nursing; i.e., how to pass the NCLEX.
I think that managers actually embraced the bullying/eating our young philosphy. It worked for them. What did they care? They could close the office door and let HR deal with the troublemakers who wouldn't tolerate the conditions the staff faced daily. I have observed that whenever the managers stepped onto the floor to 'help' or to 'fix' something, generally, chaos followed in their wake.
In this regard I say bring on the unions for the right reasons: protect staff nurses/nursing assistants from the working conditions that we currently face. As has been stated in previous posts, we all work hard and deserve every penny and then some.
The hospital organizations, faceless, heartless entities that they are, are looking for cheap labor and a quick fix. Nurses must also realize that power corrupts, and so must be vigilant to not allow the union bully to replace the organization bully. Where I live, Chicago, has a very colorful history with unions, and so I still hear my parents' stories about the questionable value of unionizing. Which means I'm willing to try it if it will benefit nursing as a profession.
Nurses must realize their own power and use it: "Grow the fist" as was previously posted.
Healthcare as an industry will need to be brought to its knees first before conditions improve, and a walk-out will seem like a picnic compared to what will happen when the shortage really tightens its noose in 10 years or so.
I'm very surprised to hear your experience with a Catholic hospital. I'm afraid they were ignoring statements made by the United States Catholic Bishops on care of the dying. Everything must be done to relieve pain, even if it hastens death. If all these measures have been taken, and pain is impossible to relieve, then read the last sentence. But, all measure to relieve pain must first be used. I don't think this statement is outrageous, and also, it doesn't say it is the role of a nurse to discuss redemptive suffering with pts. I believe that would be a role for clergy...
61. Patients should be kept as free of pain as possible so that they may die comfortably and with dignity, and in the place where they wish to die. Since a person has the right to prepare for his or her death while fully conscious, he or she should not be deprived of consciousness without a compelling reason. Medicines capable of alleviating or suppressing pain may be given to a dying person, even if this therapy may indirectly shorten the person's life so long as the intent is not to hasten death. Patients experiencing suffering that cannot be alleviated should be helped to appreciate the Christian understanding of redemptive suffering.
Patients experiencing suffering that cannot be alleviated should be helped to appreciate the Christian understanding of redemptive suffering.
I won't debate religion as it is not appropriate.
I have buried both my parents because of lung cancer, and I can tell you that watching them die didn't have anything to do with 'redemtive suffering'.
Did watching them die have anything to do with my switch to nursing? Yes. I still did it for the money, when I had the money, instead of law school.
First and foremost I will advocate for my patients. I don't care what religion, color, creed or national origin my patients come from. I don't care if they are drug-seeking or have habits I don't share.
I have a job to do, and I will do my best to keep my personal feelings out of it. I have seen the devastation familes go through when patients are given a terminal diagnosis in the ER and I have fallen apart in the break room because of it. None of it means I don't care or will embrace the addled-brain notion of redemtive suffering.
Let one bishop see the suffering of children and then tell me that there is beauty in suffering.
I'm sure the Bishops have had plenty of experience in ministering to dying pts. Also, they are human beings who also have lost loved ones. That statement is not outrageous whatsoever, do you think?
Yes, there is spiritual value in redemptive suffering, although our pleasure-driven culture doesn't see it's value. But it is spoken of in the Bible more than once.
As far as religion, I believe you are the one who brought it up. I agree, though, many hospitals started by religious groups do fall short of the ideals on which they were founded.
Specializes in Education, Acute, Med/Surg, Tele, etc.
There is NOTHING wrong with wanting a paycheck with a career..it is certainly a bonus to the profession to be paid what we deserve! If it is the ONLY thing..yes wrongo, but if you say yes...money did sway me into nursing...nothing wrong with that as long as it isn't the only reason...if it is...well two weeks as a nurse on your own will certainly get you running for the hills! LOL!
I chose it for the stability, the fact that I have always been med savy and wanted to help others in their times of medical woes, to be able to have flexiblity in a career, and the money..heck yes...and any nurse that says otherwise is kidding themselves! The money is good...why not, we deserve to have payment for services rendered since in essence we do so much more than just earn that check..so very much more (so I see us as priceless, but still need to pay the bills!).
I mean, if you all the sudden were told "due to budget cut backs, you will need to give up your benifits and take a pay cut...but you are a nurse and shouldn't mind because you don't do this for the money!..." HELLO...I would leave! I love my patients, but I need the stability of a career which includes being paid for my services for myself and my family who will always come first in my life!
Anyway...I think a nurse who shouldn't be a nurse in terms may just be in the wrong area of nursing. Things are so vast to those that really endevor to try that their is room for everyone somewhere. Just have to strive and find your niche! (except people that DON'T care, they need to get out! This is a caring profession!).
WHen i told them i was doing a poll, many of them wanted to change their answer at that time to "i enjoy healing people, or i enjoy making a difference".
You told them after asking them the question that it's a poll? I probably would have been peeved about being a part of a survey that i didn't consent to.
There is NOTHING wrong with wanting a paycheck with a career..it is certainly a bonus to the profession to be paid what we deserve! If it is the ONLY thing..yes wrongo, but if you say yes...money did sway me into nursing...nothing wrong with that as long as it isn't the only reason...if it is...well two weeks as a nurse on your own will certainly get you running for the hills! LOL!
I work in a hospital where we have lots of nursing students come through. All they talk about is how much they are going to be making. To be completely honest, there are only a handful of them that I would want taking care of me or any of my family. I graduated eleven years ago, and our instructors were VERY strict. If they didn't feel we would be safe practioners, it didn't matter how smart the person was, they could bar us from taking boards. I don't remember once thinking about how much I would be making (even though the first job I had after graduating, I didn't even make twice as much as I had as a CNA). It was about "where can I go and make a difference in someone's life "(for the better of the person, not my bank account).
I understand where you're coming from. However, the school I attend is VERY strict and if they don't think you'll be a good nurse, you will not pass their program. Many students complain and I admit, the way they talk to students is at times very inappropriate not to mention demeaning. I waitressed for 10 years and the money was better than that of a nurse. My husband has no college education and makes $30/hour as an electrician. I don't think the moeny is all that wonderful unless you travel, have your master's and experience in your field of nursing. I can't wait to graduate to help people and give them optimal care, but I'd be lying if I said I would be glad to work 12 hour shifts 4-5x/week for minimum wage.
Unfortuneatly there are people right now that are rude and snotty to new employees and each other! In my opinion the nurses that aren't dedicated to premium care for patients (whether from ignorance or inexperience) and nurses that are rude for no reason to their coworkers only add to the decline in health care.
marylyric
125 Posts
Thanks for your response. I certaintly agree with you. I think you explained the attitude I encountered in school against unions for nurses, but its about time nurses started looking out for themselves, because it seems that Hospitals Adminstrators and the folks who are suppose to be doing it are not.
Nurses give so much of themselves everyday on the job, and
I think most enjoy caring for their patients, but at the same time, They are not treated fairly or compensated at the level they should be. As you stated above, a nurse who is exhausted certaintly affects patients care.