what do nurses hate about doctors?

CardioTrans, BSN, RN · Jul 13, 2008

As you can see, the majority of the things that irritate the nurses are the same no matter where we are.

I too have heard attendings tell MS, interns and residents...that if a nurse has a concern....listen to them..... they can make you or break you...........they can make your life easy or miserable.......its all in how you go about it.

Always remember that no matter where you are going to school at, where you do your residency/fellowship that you are going to work with nurses who have been nurses for years.......just because we are nurses and you have MD behind your name does not mean that we dont know anything. Sometimes "experience smarts" means a lot more than "book smarts".

I have had a physician call me insinuating that I didnt do something correctly for a patient and was very angry. When I researched the issue... I found out that it was something that was not done by one of the residents (an order not written)........ when I handed him all of the documentation.......all he could say was "thanks". Basically... he learned how I work and why I always say "Don't throw your toys, unless you are prepared to have them thrown back". The second time, he called me wondering why something did not happen for a patient.......again, I did the research on the issue....... found out that HE himself changed it.......... let him know in writing with his writing........... he came to the floor... found me........ smiled at me and said "Im taking my toys and going home".

Main thing is treat the nurses with respect. Ask their opinions.... LISTEN to them... there is a reason that it is called a healthcare TEAM.

Best of luck to you in school!

CseMgr1, ASN, RN · Jul 13, 2008

Bedside manner oh where for art thou?

If there were such a thing as a "Build a Doctor Kit", this particular doctor would fit the mold perfectly:

Back in 1970 (I'm giving away my age, now!), I was an Aide working nights on a busy medical floor. We were told (and WITHOUT exception) to stand up whenever a doctor arrived and relinquish our chairs at the Nurses's Station. We were EQUALS in this doctor's eyes, and he went out of his way to let us know that. "Don't get up", he would tell us. We also knew that whenever he said "Good Morning" or "Good Night" he MEANT just that. He never asked us to retrieve a chart or a nurse to make rounds with him. He waited on himself. And, his orders and progress notes were always clear, concise and legible...and ended with: "Thank you, X. XXXXX, M.D." And his patients LOVED him.

I was saddened to hear a few years later that he had died of an inoperable brain tumor.

I am sure that God made a special place in Heaven for this man. :heartbeat

Jo Dirt · Jul 13, 2008

I just don't like it when I'm talked to like an idiot. If you have a patient with orders to call you if their blood sugar runs over 400 but it is common for it to do so and you know it, don't get mad at me for calling you when their blood sugar is over 400. Change your orders.

If you make rounds at a nursing home, take into consideration some of the drugs you order "now" may not be in our facility ER box

texas2007, BSN, RN · Jul 13, 2008

My main one is to listen to your nurses, especially when they call you at night. They know you don't want to be woken up, but most likely they also thought that whatever they are calling you about cannot wait until morning.

Also, if you are on call for an icu, please go into it with the mindset that you will not sleep that night, and if you do, well great. When I was at work the other night, the fellow was in our pod and her phone rang. Before she answered it, she let out this loud sigh, gritted her teeth and said "CANT I GET JUST 1 HOUR OF SLEEP?!!?" Mind you, I had just called 5 minutes earlier to remind her to come write an order for a baby with a platelet count of 30. It really put a bad taste in my mouth, especially since I've had issues with her in the past also.

One last thing is please be open to suggestions. If a nurse has to call you multiple times about the same issue and you insist on making no changes, maybe your plan isn't working out for the patient. Try something new.

It seems like too many of the Drs I encounter are doctors either for the money or to tame their God complex. I really value when I know the doctor really cares about getting the best outcome for the patient, even if that means maybe they don't get a wink of sleep that night.

mbess02 · Jul 13, 2008

Nurses don't sleep at night. Required to stay awake on the night shift. Docs get call rooms and sleep when they can. Just a helpful piece of info.

Actually, when physicians are using call rooms at night, it's not because they are sleeping on the "night shift." When a physician takes call, they are generally in the hospital for 30-36 hours at a stretch. It's not like we're working 12's overnight, and sleeping through them. We're trying to get a tiny bit of rest so that we can keep going through our 30 hour shift without vomiting. Physicians who work night float - ie, who DO have night shifts and are at home during the day - don't get call rooms, and don't sleep during the night.

Nurses should recognize that most physicians are not shift workers the way RN's are. Would you want a doctor taking care of your family member to stay up all night in the middle of a 30-hour shift just because you're awake, too? Or would you want him/her to get the sleep he/she could before rounding on your mother/operating on your father/making critical care decisions on your child the next day?

SteveNNP, MSN, NP · Jul 13, 2008

Would you want a doctor taking care of your family member to stay up all night in the middle of a 30-hour shift just because you're awake, too? Or would you want him/her to get the sleep he/she could before rounding on your mother/operating on your father/making critical care decisions on your child the next day?

No, but I do expect the physician assigned to my patients be ready and available to address with me any needs the patients have. No, I'm not going to call you at 0300 for something that can wait until 0600, but don't get testy with me when I do call at 0300. You might not think it's important, but I've been doing this a lot longer than "you" have, and I can tell the difference between what needs to be dealth with NOW, and what can wait. I refuse to feel sorry for waking a resident up in the middle of the night when needed. I am close friends with many of the residents that rotate through NICU. They understand that I am capable of determining when they need to get out of bed and come see a patient. Until the AMA goes a step further and continues to limit the length of student/resident shifts, no one should "plan" on getting sleep in an ICU setting.

:smilecoffeecup:

allnurses Guide · Jul 13, 2008

Nurses should recognize that most physicians are not shift workers the way RN's are. Would you want a doctor taking care of your family member to stay up all night in the middle of a 30-hour shift just because you're awake, too? Or would you want him/her to get the sleep he/she could before rounding on your mother/operating on your father/making critical care decisions on your child the next day?

THis is one thing I do like about the UK system, if our docs are working nights they do not come to the hospital during the day and they have 2 dayss of before and 2 days off after a week of night duty.

Our docs are not supposed to sleep at night because they are being paid to be awake and as they do not have daytime comittments they have no need to sleep.

I have been lucky with the docs I have worked with but then I think it maybe a different healthcare culture. THe junior doctors usually value the nursing staff and I have found that we work collaboratively as a team rather than the them and us. We tend to go to each others nights out and socialise together as well as work together.

lpnstudentin2010, LPN · Jul 13, 2008

From the patients perspective, show you care and be kind to the nurses.

My old eye doctor, I had been his patient for 19 years, and we determined that I needed my right eye removed due to severe pain (and other factors but the pain was the last straw). He could not do it because he was going to be in Cambodia. One of his colleges did it. I met her 6 days before the surgery. Well I had the surgery and when I was waking up I had a new reaction to anesthesia that I have never had before. I was bawling my eyes out. I had approximately 8 surgeries before that. So it was kind of weird. Well she found me "face down in the bed sobbing" and rubbed my back. I had follow up visit with her, and a year follow up. At this point (having met her 4 times) I had a better relationship with her then my old doc who I had been his patient for 19 years. She did things like, I ran into her one day when I was there for a test, in another department, and she got really worried about me. I have now moved my care over to her because I like her better. I formed a tighter relationship with her and feel more comfortable talking to her then I EVER did with him, because she is not afraid to show that she cares about you, which I appreciate.

My surgeon, he is TREMENDOUSLY good at what he does. He is one of the best. However, he treats his nurses like cr@p. I had been told at a career day at my high school by a nurse who used to work in the OR there, but did not believe it, then the next time I saw him, he put a pressure bandage on my face (this is where he operates) and apparently put it on to tight, the skin broke down. The next time I went in, he took the bandage off and yelled at the office nurse telling her she put it on to tight, even though it was most defiantly him. I also mentioned that I had heard about his reputation to my floor nurse one day, and she said, "ya, when I shadowed in the OR one day I saw him have a fight with the scrub nurse" in which she was probably putting it nicely.

So treat both the patients good. And treat the nurses with respect, they will find out.

Nurse1990BSN · Jul 13, 2008

Well said! Novicetoexpert you hit the nail right on the head!

hypocaffeinemia, BSN, RN · Jul 13, 2008

This thread hasn't gone unnoticed @ SDN: http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showthread.php?t=542853

These cross-board scuffles never seem to end well.

GadgetRN71, ASN, RN · Jul 13, 2008

Actually, when physicians are using call rooms at night, it's not because they are sleeping on the "night shift." When a physician takes call, they are generally in the hospital for 30-36 hours at a stretch. It's not like we're working 12's overnight, and sleeping through them. We're trying to get a tiny bit of rest so that we can keep going through our 30 hour shift without vomiting. Physicians who work night float - ie, who DO have night shifts and are at home during the day - don't get call rooms, and don't sleep during the night.
Nurses should recognize that most physicians are not shift workers the way RN's are. Would you want a doctor taking care of your family member to stay up all night in the middle of a 30-hour shift just because you're awake, too? Or would you want him/her to get the sleep he/she could before rounding on your mother/operating on your father/making critical care decisions on your child the next day?

All of the above may be true but what it comes down to is that this is the MD's job..they knew this before they chose this career. Medicine and nursing are not your typical 9 to 5...what I have taken to doing is documentation of how long it took the MD in question to answer their pager or phone and if I get screamed at for calling, I have said "just doing my job, you're on call, quit giving me a hard time" And yes, I have said this...the OR has given me a backbone and a big mouth when I need one.

And many nurses do pull double shifts and shifts longer than 24 hours(this is true in the OR) When you are on call, especially during a weekend, you can be there straight through sometimes. In some places, this has gotten better because of mandatory overtime laws but in many others, it can be brutal. We are expected to get our tired butts up there, and for far less money. We also do not have sleep rooms which means if you stay there because of bad road conditions, you get the nasty old couch in the lounge.. :banghead:

All this being said, I like the specialty I'm in now(ortho) Most of the docs are nice people. Even if they have a snippy moment, often they will apologize after. :yeah:

NICURN04 · Jul 13, 2008

I'm in NICU, so if you do get to rotate through this wonderful world, please check the baby's weight before you prescribe them any narcotics, drips,antibiotics, ect. The other day when my baby had came back from surgery for a VP shunt and BP was out of this world, I look up to check for post-op orders and none was written all while the resident surgeon was at my desk talking about personal matters on his cell phone. I politely said, "Dr. X, this baby's BP is way to high, and he is displaying discomfort, would you please prescribe something for pain?" The surgeon took one look at me and said, "what would you like? (while I appreciate you asking my opinion on my choice of meds, I'm not the one getting it nor does my badge says MD!) So, Dr. X look at the anesthesia med sheet and prescribe this baby a fentanyl dosage for an adult and left:nono:, while I check on the baby next door who was on an oscillator. Feeling uneasy (called it a nursing intuition!), I called the unit pharmacist and it was then that we discovered not only the fentanyl dosage was wrong but the Gent and Vancomycin dosage as well! The next 15 minutes that I spent after you left would be talking to your attending about your carelessness and my attending to get the baby what he needs, so please re-read the orders after you have written them to make sure that it is appropriate for the pt, let me know what you wrote before you left, and leave your personal business elsewhere when you are at work, I don't want to hear about your Friday night plans when I'm trying to get a 29weeker situated after surgery. Good luck with MS! =)