Now, if ALL places were run like this...tell me what you think!

Nurses General Nursing

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Hey guys!!

I was reading a few threads on 'customer service' running amok, and wanted to share how things owrk at my current clinic. I swear, if all places would impart these rules/guidelines, the world of nursing would be so much better to work in.

First, I work in a general medicine clinic. My collaborating doc is well known for treating pain, but we are NOT a pain clinic. The patients get schooled on this at the first office visit, if not before. My OM, (the doc's daughter) is a gem, she is PHENOMENAL! She (well, all of us, really) has a zero-tolerance policy for bull, and once you're on her list, you're on it.

*We don't tolerate abuse. Period. If you come in and raise sand, you're out. Dismissed from the practice as a patient. If you have a friend or family member come in and raise sand for you, you're still out. If you bring a friend to your office visit, and that friend steals someone's wallet in the waiting room, you're still out. You brought them.

*We talk to each other. Actually had one lady tell me when I was new that the doc always gave her extra meds "in case she had a bad day". When I baked and said I'd have to verify that, she proceeded to tell me that our MA knew how to call them in, and no, he didn't write down the extra pills, just added them in when the script was called to the pharmacy. So, staff-splitting does NOT work.

*Behavior really does count. We have a 200-person strong waiting list to be a patient here. I databased it myself, from a tattered little book. Every time someone calls or comes by to ask where they are on the list, I can tell with a click of a mouse. People who come in and flip an attitude or demand to be seen immediately either get bumped to the bottom of the list, or taken off of it altogether. Posted a story relating to THAT on my other thread about things you'd love to tell patients. We even drew up a memo detailing the rules, that we hand out when someone comes by to add their name. For the ones that phone their order in, I call personally and explain the details.

* We keep records. Since we do prescribe controlled substances, if we hear or see that a patient has been arrested for DUI, selling, possession, or other offenses, we dismiss. If we get a call that someone is selling, we dismiss. If someone fails a drug screen, we dismiss. We have a closet full of dismissed charts, all carefully organized and databased (I love my computer) with names, reasons for dismissal, etc. You'd be amazed at what people will try to sneak back in. Different hair, different NAME, fit-throwing, wheedling, threats, etc. This souldn't be a surprise. All our patients are required to sign a behavior contract when they come to the clinic, that clearly states what comprises grounds for dismissal.

We have no doorknob leading from the lobby to the clinic proper. It was removed. We had people coming in without permission for 'sidewalk consults', demanding pain shots, and one lovely lady who proceeded to stand there, even though it was quite obvious that my OM was on the phone, shaking her pill bottle in her face and screaming, "WHERE are my %^&* refills?!?!?" Yep, bye-bye, sweetie!

We have a medication policy, as we call all prescriptions in. The meds are guaranteed by a certain time, period. No, you don't get an early call in without a darn good reason, and some people get REALLY creative. No problem, they get moved to the bottom of the pile. Every time they come back in (some of these people must LIVE at the pharmacy) wanting to know why they haven't gotten their meds yet, to the bottom they go. May sound mean, but they get the point after a while.

Point being, we just DO NOT reward bad behavior. There's no sense in it. Sure, we may lose a patient here and there that doesn't want to comply with the rules, but there are dozens ready to fill their spot in the chart rack. We're not outright mean, we just refuse to take abuse lying down.

So, my question...if it works for us, why on Earth can hospitals and other places make it work, too? Set policies and adhere to them, that's really all it is. Why is this phenomenon so difficult to replicate? They sure don't care to policy the staff to death, so I know it's not that. Why not go in the other direction?

Specializes in Case Manager.

I'd LOVE to work in a facility with similar rules. I don't see how people can put up with being blatantly disrespected day in and day out. 90% of the time being rude or a jerk is INEXCUSEABLE. I expect to be treated with the same respect I give to the patients, not be cursed at, have things thrown at me or assaulted and undermined and belittled by patients, families or managers.

This whole post is just so awful! It really makes my tummy upset to see some of the comments.

I am really sorry that some of the nurses here have a rough time on the job, but sometimes it seems that a lot of posters think this a profession specific thing. All jobs are stressful, esp jobs dealing with the direct public. Everyone has different personalities and different opinions. "Outsiders" might not realize what it is they can do to make your job easier because they don't work your job, and it doesn't occur to them (before anyone says it, obviously i'm not talking about people that will just cuss and scream for no reason, everyone knows that is inappropriate). But things like calling late... WOW! just WOW! Other people have lives too. I work and go to school and volunteer AND i'm a single mom. I am lucky if I have time for lunch! I would LOVE LOVE LOVE an extra 15 mins in the middle of the day to call to make appts, fill scripts, etc etc... but it just isn't happening!

I am very happy that this situation works out for the place of employment of the OP. As stated, patients are not *forced* to go there. However, if this was the situation everywhere... where does that leave the patients that will get used, abused, tossed aside, and not treated because they "stepped outta line"?

I am on public insurance (yeah I know... I must be a drug seeking hooker...) so I can only go to specific places that will take it. Most of the clinics in my area are run by our local hospital. THEY ARE TERRIBLE!!! Everyone (except my lovely neurologist, I must say) overbooks and doesn't care that we have to take off an ENTIRE day to go to the doctor. I have literally sat in my OBGYN office for THREE HOURS just so I could get my BC refilled. Yeah, I know, I'm not supposed to get POd right... esp after simply asking the front desk how many more are before me and having her roll her eyes at me.

I would just like to add... as easy as it is for patients to choose where they go and how they act... you also have the choice to switch professions if you find that this one doesn't suit you.... just a thought.

Oh please. You really have a problem with removing abusive patients from a practice? Really?

I suppose you think healthcare workers should just lay back and take whatever comes their way?

If so, you're part of the problem. No one has the "right" to be abusive, but a private business has every right to remove a "customer" from their property.

Doctor shopping, pill mills, and drug-seeking/selling are very real, very big problems in certain parts of the country. It's THE biggest drug problem where I'm at. Do you really have a problem with an MD taking responsibility and monitoring who he gives controlled substances to? It's his license and livelihood (not to mention his duty) that is on the line if he doesn't.

Do you really think a patient should be able to get whatever they demand?

Really?

For those expressing distress at the rules of the OPs practice ... how would you propose dealing with drug-seeking behaviors? Especially considering that enabling those behaviors just strengthens them as well as potentially placing the practitioners in a pretty serious legal situation.

It sucks that people with chronic pain should have to be subjected to those same rules ... but just how is the practitioner supposed to differentiate?

Would love to hear some ideas.

What sucks about it?

The rules pretty much boil down to this:

Don't abuse the staff.

Don't sell your drugs or doctor shop. We're paying attention.

What the hell is so awful about being asked to behave like a civilized human being?

No one is being abused in this situation. In fact, what's happening is that these rules keep the staff and the MDs 'script writing privileges from being abused. People are acting like that's a bad thing.

i think you know it's not meant literally.

he is speaking emotionally, thinking of all those people living in pain.

that's an aspect of being a softie.:twocents:

leslie

There are ways to express that without actually wishing someone suffer. You can invoke empathy without invoking a curse. :p (Hint: He could have said: "I hope you never have to...etc")

But, we'll have to agree to disagree. :)

I think her dismissals were because of pain med seekers.... not oops I need my allergy meds... if i'm not mistaken...

Yeah well I take lopressor, lisinopril and HCTZ and my former doctor's office treated me like a crazy drug seeker when refill time rolled around. The doc would write for six months at a time, I would try to call way ahead of time, and they would still act exasperated and would definitely put me at the bottom of the list and leave me for days with no BP meds if I didn't jump through hoops and beg and plead. One time, just once, I was really, really busy and called later on the day before one of my scripts ran out and you would have thought I committed a capital offense.

Love the kind and wonderful staff at my current MDs, including the doctor, she writes me a year at a time and she the nurses' are very understanding of getting me apts with my crazy work schedule.

Specializes in med-surg, psych, ER, school nurse-CRNP.
I hope you verify before you dismiss. With over 200 patients on your waiting list, I wouldn't be surprised if people make false reports just to move up in line.

We do. We're really close with the local police in the surrounding counties, and locally too. Mightn't someone be falsely accused of selling? Sure. But we remove ourselves from the situation anyway, simply because where there's smoke, fire usually isn't very far behind.

Specializes in med-surg, psych, ER, school nurse-CRNP.
Yeah well I take lopressor, lisinopril and HCTZ and my former doctor's office treated me like a crazy drug seeker when refill time rolled around. The doc would write for six months at a time, I would try to call way ahead of time, and they would still act exasperated and would definitely put me at the bottom of the list and leave me for days with no BP meds if I didn't jump through hoops and beg and plead. One time, just once, I was really, really busy and called later on the day before one of my scripts ran out and you would have thought I committed a capital offense.

Love the kind and wonderful staff at my current MDs, including the doctor, she writes me a year at a time and she the nurses' are very understanding of getting me apts with my crazy work schedule.

We do a year's worth on maintenance meds as well. All other refill requests, either by phone or in person, are handled same-day, usually by me. Yes, it takes time to pull charts and verify, and MOST are pretty good about that, because there have been incidents where they thought Doc wrote whatever, and it was really the heart doc that wrote it, but those are rare. Now, the times we have refused? Try the lady who took a year's worth of Phenergan in 2 months. Not only was she cut off from getting any Phenergan for 6 months (in the absence of any definable GI issue, after an extensive GI workup by a GI specialist, too), but the pharmacy who filled her refills every 6 days got a "What the heck were you THINKING?" phone call.

Specializes in med-surg, psych, ER, school nurse-CRNP.
then don't?

Then perhaps you shouldn't have?

Seriously, I love my work, I just put up with too much in other facilities to really think that the rules are anything but great. In my clinic, public assistance or not, if I'm seeing you, you can be assured that, barring an emergency or a complicated workup, you'll be out in less than an hour. We call back in order of appointment time, and I have a pretty good 15-minute turnaround, sometimes less if one is just there for refills. Then, you get a brief head-to-toe, meds written, notes put in for Doc to review if need be, for an increase in meds, a change in meds, or what-have-you, and you're all set.

My nickname is Speedy. The patients love it. Of course, the complicated ones take longer, especially if we have to call EMS or write for a years worth of 20-some-odd maintenance drugs, but it all evens out, and no one ever leaves my exam room unless I have been assured that I've covered everything that needs covered, or made arrangements to do so (I have to have an OK from Doc to up controls, so as soon as I know, I call the patient and let them know if he agreed or not).

So, rules aside, you might just find you like it where I work. At least if you didn't, you wouldn't be there in something you didn't like for the whole day. Just saying.

Specializes in Hospice.
What sucks about it?

The rules pretty much boil down to this:

Don't abuse the staff.

Don't sell your drugs or doctor shop. We're paying attention.

What the hell is so awful about being asked to behave like a civilized human being?

No one is being abused in this situation. In fact, what's happening is that these rules keep the staff and the MDs 'script writing privileges from being abused. People are acting like that's a bad thing.

What sucks is that we who deal with drug seekers frequently do have a tendency to assume drug seeking in anyone asking for certain classes of meds. People who are in chronic pain or are perceived as "milking" the system" really are treated badly much of the time. This is often complicated further if the person seeking pain relief is exhibiting symptoms of pseudo-addiction.

In my opinion, the way to deal with the unacceptable behavior is to set and enforce the kind of strict limits described in the OP. Drug seekers will tend to get weeded out and staff who are supported in this way won't get so fried that they go into terminal compassion fatigue. Nothing excuses manipulation or abuse of staff, I don't care how sad your story is.

Hey AngelfireRN!

What, is up!

Specializes in med-surg, psych, ER, school nurse-CRNP.

Hey!!!

Oh, not much, just causing controversy...you know, what I do best, lol. How goes it with you, girl?

HA, yes. Miss all that.

Can we place a bet on how fast this thread will manage to turn tail and run down that long dark alley? LOL! :lol2:

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