MNA and Nurses Respond to the Killing of George Floyd by Police

[tnbutterfly - Mary]

We have all seen on the news the terrible scene that played out in the streets in Minnesota when George Floyd, an unarmed 46-year-old black male, was arrested by the Minnesota Police for attempted forgery at a convenience store. The action was caught on video as George Floyd, handcuffed and pinned to the ground face down by an officer who pressed with his full weight with his knee on Mr. Floyd's neck for more than 8 minutes. We watched and heard George Floyd crying out that he couldn't breathe. We heard him calling for "Mama". We watched as his body went limp with the officer still holding him down. This will be a scene I shall never forget.

The following are quotes from the Minnesota Nurses Association's response to this heinous crime.

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As nurses, we see the horrific effects of racism in our hospitals and community every day. We cannot remain silent as yet another black man has died at the hands of police...

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George Floyd's last words were "I can't breathe.” George Floyd died shortly after arriving at the hospital."

Nurses jump into action when they hear someone say "I can't breathe", instead of standing there watching them die. Their goal is to save lives, not kill people

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In the case of George Floyd, Minneapolis Police took no care or life-saving measures. Instead, they left him pinned down to the ground until paramedics arrived. Police ignored the pleas of George Floyd and he died.

Nurses care for all patients, regardless of their gender, race, religion or other status. We expect the same from the police. Unfortunately, nurses continue to see the devastating effects of systematic racism and oppression targeting people of color in our communities. We demand justice for George Floyd and a stop to the unnecessary death of black men at the hands of those who should protect them.

As a nurse, or as a compassionate human, how has this horrific event affected you? We have seen protests (some peaceful and some that have erupted into riots), vandalism, looting, and more. What is going on in your community? What actions can nurses take?

Let us stand together and let our voices be heard. Post your comments below.

[Workitinurfava, BSN, RN]

4 hours ago, milmom35 said:

interesting observation...by "society" I'm guess you mean the media? Help me understand, are you saying:

a) saying the media needs to stop reporting on "black and white issues" since they've filled the quota? Do we need to vote on a limit on how many stories can be on tv about a certain race?

b) the media needs more features on pressing issues faced by people of other races in the US?

c) feeling left out of this horrific drama that's been playing out since.....let's see...400+ years ago when black slaves were brought to this country that was settled by white colonists from Europe after they murdered and pushed Native Americans from their own land?

You took my comment wrong. I made my statement and will not elaborate on it.

[Hoosier_RN, MSN]

5 hours ago, toomuchbaloney said:

Your choice to be offended by my words when none was intended. I imagine that you must feel a deep sense of the concern and outrage expressed by these protesters. I know I do and I don't have biracial children. My son was let go after being caught with cannabis as a teen ...the officer called his parents (we were well known white people in the area). His black friend, the next weekend, was arrested by the same officer for his possession of Marijuana. The police didn't call his parents or give him a break.

Of course I was offended. You made the assumption that because I'm white, I couldn't possibly fear for my sons. Don't assume you know about others. By the same token, I truly believe all mothers worry about our children regardless of race. Sure, there are racist people out there. But my sons have also met racism from African-American people because they're not "all black". But I guess that's okay. That was sarcasm, because racism is never okay

[toomuchbaloney]

19 minutes ago, Hoosier_RN said:

Of course I was offended. You made the assumption that because I'm white, I couldn't possibly fear for my sons. Don't assume you know about others. By the same token, I truly believe all mothers worry about our children regardless of race. Sure, there are racist people out there. But my sons have also met racism from African-American people because they're not "all black". But I guess that's okay. That was sarcasm, because racism is never okay

I didn't assume anything. I specifically and prominently utilized a word to convey uncertainty. It's your choice to take offense when none was intended.

[Guest1144461]

On 6/8/2020 at 6:56 PM, milmom35 said:

@Numenor are you saying that:

1. The media is the problem because they don't feature stories about non-black folks getting murdered? Seriously, aren't we all tired of constantly hearing ALL these reports about black men getting shot, arrested, beaten up and killed by police? And that my statement agreeing that police do kill people of different races' proves that I don't care about the deaths of non-black people either? Isn't it fair to have this discussion post focus on police brutality against black people as the forum post is clearly about George Floyd's death and the nationwide (actually global) protests ? And what do you propose to do about the fact that "people are poorly educated about this"? Are you doing outreach to the media to better educate them too?

2. Would you provide references/citations for those statistics so we can all be better educated about what you've shared? As your profile indicates that you have in fact, attended graduate school, would you agree that statistics are sometimes used to support different views based on how they're interpreted? That study design, sample size, location and participant demographics are major variables that may in fact mean that the result of a single study (or 5, or 10) cannot be generalized across entire populations?

You also stated the issue of "70% single-parent households"--again, would you please share some solid evidence like peer reviewed articles or non-partisan research sources so we can all be better informed? It sounds like your saying that violent crime by black men in the US is caused by single parent households, or did I misinterpret that?

I believe we all agree that "unjust killings need to stop."

3. By saying it's a police brutality issue, not race--are you proposing that race must be ignored completely as we now live in a post-racial world? That crime reporting, media and every aspect of American life needs to be color-blind and state the race of the people involved? Would you be willing to follow your own advice as you explicitly point out statistics on violence and single parent households for black people in the U.S.? How do you think the encounter between George Floyd and the police officer would have gone if Mr. Floyd was a white man? If perhaps, it was a different state? Or what if Mr. Floyd was accused of having $20 million worth of fake money instead of a $20 bill?

And are you saying my response to this thread on Mr. Floyds brutal death by a white police office is somehow responsible for the lack of public awareness about police brutality? How do you explain separating the issue of police brutality against black men (and women)from the all the other pressing issues affecting African Americans (from economics to poor outcomes like higher number of COVID-19 deaths to incarceration.....and the list goes on and on)? If the results of these protests focused on the Black Lives Matter movement lead to reforms to reduce excessive force and murder by police--then wouldn't that benefit everyone, regardless of race?

NOTE-I may not respond further to this thread. My hope is to examine the ideas presented--it's not a personal attack as I don't know any of the people I've responded to. Nurses and healthcare providers have a responsibility to examine bias and assumptions. Understanding research is also important in clinical practice. If anyone has a burning desire to better understand statistics and research drop me a line.

@tnbutterfly - Mary, thanks for opening the discussion on such a pressing and important issue.

References and Suggested Reading:

Huff, D. (1993). How to lie with statistics. WW Norton & Company. https://is.gd/UeS2j2

Zuberi, T. (2001). Thicker than blood: How racial statistics lie. U of Minnesota Press. https://is.gd/a87W84

Sirry Alang, Donna McAlpine, Ellen McCreedy, Rachel Hardeman, “Police Brutality and Black Health: Setting the Agenda for Public Health Scholars”, American Journal of Public Health 107, no. 5 (May 1, 2017): pp. 662-665. https://doi.org/10.2105/AJPH.2017.303691

Bonilla-Silva, E. (2006). Racism without racists: Color-blind racism and the persistence of racial inequality in the United States. Rowman & Littlefield Publishers. https://is.gd/qV9oU2

Armour, J. D. (1997). Negrophobia and reasonable racism: The hidden costs of being black in America (Vol. 32). NYU Press. https://is.gd/Oq4AHl

LoBiondo-Wood, G., & Haber, J. (2017). Nursing research-E-book: methods and critical appraisal for evidence-based practice. Elsevier Health Sciences. https://is.gd/XvtAaj

Jakubec, S. L., & Astle, B. J. (2015). Research literacy. Encyclopedia of nursing education, 297-299. https://is.gd/0Gps1D

Thebault R, Ba Tran A, Williams V. The coronavirus is infecting and killing black Americans at an alarmingly high rate. Washington Post. April 7, 2020.https://is.gd/eY7fF0

Reyes C, Husain N, Gutowski C, St Clair S, Pratt G. Chicago’s coronavirus disparity: black Chicagoans are dying at nearly six times the rate of white residents, data show. Chicago Tribune. Published April 7, 2020. https://is.gd/9WpSaZ

If you aren't going to respond, I am not going to bother with a flushed out response. I am honestly surprised you ask these low hanging fruit questions/answers that are literally common knowledge even among most people I debate. To be frank, most of your questions are loaded/red herring fallacies and not worth addressing. This isn't my first rodeo with debating and I don't really understand what you mean regarding my "graduate education". Yeah I can read a study and determine its validity, so what? You don't need a degree to read and determine a study's applicability.

Here is loaded question: Would things be different if George Floyd didn't shove a gun into a pregnant woman's stomach during a previous armed robbery and have rap sheet a mile long? Inquiring minds what to know. See how this works?

Here is some "peer reviewed" data you asked for which was easily googleable in 5 minutes. You can draw your own conclusions rather than rely on obfuscation.

Black single parent households:

https://www.CDC.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr61/nvsr61_01.pdf

Black crime:

https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2018/crime-in-the-u.s.-2018/tables/table-43

Racial disparities and cop killings

https://www.pnas.org/content/116/32/15877

Police use of force data:

https://scholar.harvard.edu/fryer/publications/empirical-analysis-racial-differences-police-use-force

[Rose_Queen, BSN, MSN, RN]

Several posts have been edited or removed. Please remember to debate the topic and not each other. From the Terms of Service:

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Thank you

[NurseBlaq]

*comes in thread and reads through it*

Same usual suspects with Fox News talking points and bad stats.

*exits without responding to anyone because it will won't change anything*

?

[Hoosier_RN, MSN]

On 6/8/2020 at 10:02 PM, toomuchbaloney said:

I didn't assume anything. I specifically and prominently utilized a word to convey uncertainty. It's your choice to take offense when none was intended.

Whether you intended to offend or not, your original comment was offensive. You don't get to choose to tell others how they are allowed to feel. And this @toomuchbaloneyis how many of others feel when their feelings are dismissed, ignored, or deflected back as their fault.

I showed both of my sons your comments back to me, as well as mine to you. Their words...you really stepped in it.

Perhaps my response is very over the top, but imagine years of snide comments regarding race of your child. For some on here, it's their own race. So someone on here doing the white virtue signaling is a slap in the face, and maybe the reason for so many of the crazy reactions, whether they be socially right or wrong

[toomuchbaloney]

2 hours ago, Hoosier_RN said:

Whether you intended to offend or not, your original comment was offensive. You don't get to choose to tell others how they are allowed to feel. And this @toomuchbaloneyis how many of others feel when their feelings are dismissed, ignored, or deflected back as their fault.

I showed both of my sons your comments back to me, as well as mine to you. Their words...you really stepped in it.

Perhaps my response is very over the top, but imagine years of snide comments regarding race of your child. For some on here, it's their own race. So someone on here doing the white virtue signaling is a slap in the face, and maybe the reason for so many of the crazy reactions, whether they be socially right or wrong

I didn't tell you how to feel anything, but my words clearly triggered your feelings.

You forgot to outline exactly I really stepped in it. Was it when I asked about feeling compassion and empathy for mothers of black children who just want them to come home from their ADLs?

Are you seriously going to get salt salty with me speaking out against racism because your children have been treated badly because of racism?

[eakirlin]

One person, maybe more, wondered if I reported the policeman-nurse.

Yes, and nothing became of it. Not at my facility, who buried the complaint, and the police force would not even do forensics on the nails. I saved them. I asked my charge nurse to save hers. The nurse giving me the heads up was out on disability,but said she would testify.

So I am convinced that my near death experience with my car going over the side of a 20 foot overpass into downtown traffic, was a successful crime. Probably reinforced the behavior. I am not forgetting my stories, however, date, time.... and writing my senators and house of rep person. Like the police, some of those lawmakers will do something, but many will not. We'll see. So since I am white, I know it has been easier for me to get heard, because now I live in a mixed race neighborhood where a black person was recently stopped because the police, two of them, thought he "looked like someone they were seeking"... and he got his jaw broken twice, and then, oops, he maybe didn't look enough like someone. This person was sitting in a car after a minor purchase at a stop n go.

Then, there are the wonderful police stories, like the ones that followed me off a highway when my car was clearly failing, and drove me to my place of work. I am just saying, the negative stories SHOULD NEVER HAPPEN. It would be as if nurses tolerated lethal injections in someone who doesn't do them very often. And yes, I worked opposite Jeanine Jones back in the day, and have much more to say about that also. we ought to be zero tolerance society for police and nurse mischief. I really don't encounter nurse mischief since old Jeanine. Her case keeps coming up for parole, and so far, she is still in Huntsville.

[Guest1144461]

On 6/9/2020 at 9:44 AM, NurseBlaq said:

*comes in thread and reads through it*

Same usual suspects with Fox News talking points and bad stats.

*exits without responding to anyone because it will won't change anything*

?

"Bad stats" aka stats that don't fit my narrative LOL

[Tenebrae, BSN, RN]

On 6/3/2020 at 4:46 PM, Numenor said:

I just wish there was more outrage regarding non-black police killings that happen much more than you think (actually the majority). I can think of several egregious episodes over the last few years that barely made the news. Selective outrage in any situation just doesn't sit well with me, and its concerning that it takes something like this for the public to be concerned en masse.

Could you mention some of those please?

And site some sources that suggest the majority of deaths in custody actually happen to white people

[Tenebrae, BSN, RN]

On 6/4/2020 at 7:21 AM, tnbutterfly - Mary said:

Confirmation of the other 3 officers charged with aiding and abetting 2nd degree murder.

This is very significant.

Will the current protests now stop?

Is this enough?

its not remotely enough, when dealing with hundreds of years of instituionalised racism.

In discussion with a student nurse this week, she had been told that as a person of colour she could not expect to get good marks in school

In 2020!?