Medical Assistants to replace RN's?

[blueyesue]

Hello RN's. I took my daughter to the UW Children's Hospital in Madison yesterday. The nurse my daughter had was excellent. She took the time to educate my daughter on a couple of issues, and was very personable. When thanking her for the time and expertise she had shown, she stated that the whole hospital is in the process of replacing RN's with Medical Assistants to save money. She also stated that this is happening in places around the nation. My first question is has anyone been noticing this or know anything about this?

[CaitlinLiz]

I am actually an example of this. I work in a doctor's office as a Medical Assistant with another MA. We don't hire nurses, and it is an office with a Dermatologist and Orthopedic Surgeon. We are taught about the medications the doctor prescribes for when the patients ask about dosing and etc. We are taught to help with the sugeries when it comes to removing AK's and BCC's, etc. We are the ones calling in prescriptions, being the liaison between our doctor's and other doctors, etc. I absolutely love my job and I am so glad I had the opportunity I did/do, but I'm sure I won't be so happy about it after I get my RN when its even more common to have MA's instead. But I definately don't think MA's will ever replace RN's completely, I think it will just become more common to have MA's that can do a CNA's work and parts of an LPN's work and less LPN's and CNA's.

[Gingerbell, BSN, RN]

RNs are not paid for what they do. They are paid for what they know.

Perfectly stated.

~GB

[ohmeowzer RN, RN]

as long as i have been a nurse i have never seen MA's at the bedside... there have always been LPN;s and RN's and CNA's .. meandragonbrett where did you see MA's at the bedside? is the hospital JACHO approved?

[delvenia]

many hospitals in my area are using MA's for doing tasks like vital signs, bed baths and things of that nature. My hospital, for example, told us in orientation that we are not allowed to do does tasks becasue our scope of practice has us (RN's) able to perform more complex tasks and that is what were are to be utilized for in order to spend hospital funds appropriately. it would be impossible to replace Rn's with MA's because MA's are not licensed personel and cannot perform many of the same tasks as a RN. That is why they have defined the scope of practices, specifically prohibiting certain actions. Though very valuable, MA's are mainly used in DR office settings for which complex tasks are usually performed by the physician themselves...

[ohmeowzer RN, RN]

even with CNA's i still end up doing everything.. that is why my hospital is letting go all the CNA's and hiring only RN's.... i thought MA's only worked in DR's offices not hospitals ... this is the first time i have heard of MA's in hospitals.... i guess ya nver know... i have learned something here .. MA's can work in hospitals....

[Moogie]

MAs will not be able to replace RNs and function in the role. The state boards of nursing, American Hospital Association, CMS, and Joint Commission will never have any of that! Some hospitals DO have MAs at the bedside instead of having CNAs. Depending on their scope of practice for their state, MAs can insert foleys, draw blood via stick, do accu checks, and start IVs in addition to all of the other duties that a CNA would perform.

I would be extremely uncomfortable with any unlicensed individual doing any invasive procedures, especially starting an IV. I think nurses in the states that allow UAPs to perform such tasks need to let their legislators know what the differences are between licensed and unlicensed staff. A license assumes that someone has a certain level of knowledge and competence.

I'd also question the legal liability if something went wrong. If a UAP made an error in an invasive procedure, what would be the implications for the licensed staff supervising that individual?

[JStyles1]

RNs are not paid for what they do. They are paid for what they know.

And it kills me how there is such a big section of actual nurses that do not recognize that!

[JenPen2332]

great. As if we don't have enough issues getting jobs, now there may be even less?

[blueyesue]

I think I'm going to write a letter to the university hospital stating what a great experience I had with the nurse there, and how valuable she was.

[Moogie]

I think I'm going to write a letter to the university hospital stating what a great experience I had with the nurse there, and how valuable she was.

I think that's a good idea because all too often, nurses get either no feedback or only negative feedback.

However, are you going to address the rumor situation?

And did the nurse mean MAs replacing RNs in the clinics or at the bedside?

I think right now so many nurses are frustrated with the job situation: many new grads can't get hired, RNs are working in LPN or CNA capacities and LPNs work as CNAs to put food on the table, nurses with jobs are told to stay home because of low census and nurses who do find work have to put up with specialties that don't interest them at best to unsafe, toxic workplaces from which they are afraid to leave because they need their paychecks. I think much of the reaction to the original post is based on the general anxiety over jobs that many nurses feel right now---and it might make people breathe a little better if you, EJM, could please give a few more details about why the nurse in question said what she did about MAs replacing RNs at that institution.

And if the rumor is somehow true and bedside nurses are being replaced en masse with UAPs, we nurses need to get off our collective butts and get politically active so we can reclaim our profession.

Thanks!

[meandragonbrett]

as long as i have been a nurse i have never seen MA's at the bedside... there have always been LPN;s and RN's and CNA's .. meandragonbrett where did you see MA's at the bedside? is the hospital JACHO approved?

Yes, the hospital is JCAHO and CMS compliant. It's a major teaching facility and liver transplant center as well.

[meandragonbrett]

it would be impossible to replace Rn's with MA's because MA's are not licensed personel

This argument is invalid to a certain degree. Some states require certification of the medical assistant to perform certain procedures. They are then afforded a very defined scope of practice under their certification. A lot of MAs, RNs, LPNs, and other clinicians tend to become confused about the role of a MA because that are so many people that work in that capacity....but have no formal training. Our medical assistants have received formal training and work via delegation within approved hospital policy and procedure.

This is no different than having a non-certified phlebotomist drawing blood...but people aren't up in arms about that?