Male Nurse Disgusted by Female Nurses

This male nurse is appalled at his female colleagues' behavior. Is he right? Nurses General Nursing Article

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Hi Beth:

I believe you submitted a recent article about Safe Patient/Nurse Ratios in this country. I have been a nurse for about one year and a half and I am appalled by what I have observed with the untenable and unsafe patient/nurse ratios healthcare employers are demanding nurses work with, BUT, I am even more FRUSTRATED and DISGUSTED with the TOTAL LACK OF UNITY among nurses when it comes to speaking in one voice to employers about this.

They would rather run to the bathroom and cry or ***** and moan in private never having the guts to unite and square off with the managements responsible for creating unsafe conditions for the sake of profit. I am a male nurse....you ladies always tout this spirit of "Teamwork" on the floors yet I have never in my life witnessed the amount of undermining and backstabbing that exists among nurses.

Before we can begin to force change on healthcare employers we have to take ownership of our failure to unite.Ladies. please stop all the petty politics among yourselves! Let's all come together as one body and push our legislators for change!! We are in the millions and we are in demand!! That is power!!

Dear Male Nurse Disgusted with Female Nurses,

The female experience is very different from the male experience, my friend. You are operating in the largely female world of nursing, and it probably feels very foreign to you. But as women, this is our world and we know it well.

You believe we are petty and fight among ourselves rather than uniting and speaking up to management. Uniting and speaking up to management as one is male behavior. Female behavior is more divisive and it has kept us down as a profession. You're right, the nursing profession is really not built on strength or unification.

But there's a reason for this behavior. As a male, you would not know this as a lived experience.

Female Conditioning

Females are conditioned to envy each other, not to trust each other, and to compete with each other. Females compare themselves to other females all their lives. Girls compare themselves to Barbie, to the pretty girls, to the girls boys like best, to the cheerleaders. To every other girl.

Women are taught to be helpless when they're not, act stupid when they're smart, not be hungry when they're starving, and to remain passive they're angry.

Females are called the "b" word for being assertive and considered to be more feminine when they are "sweet". It's a dichotomy of expectations.

The dichotomy is everywhere. Look at popular movies about mean girls.

Being direct and straightforward is not how women are brought up to communicate whatsoever. Saying what we need is less important than meeting other's needs.

Meanwhile, boys are taught to stick together, in the army, on the football team. You rarely hear doctors criticize other doctors. Even when a patient goes to see a doctor with a condition that was mishandled by another provider, the response is more along the lines of "Well, let's move forward from here".

By contrast, nurses are hard on each other. Nurses can be quick to blame other nurses. As females, we expect perfection from ourselves...and each other.

State boards of nursing, made up of nurses, are notoriously hard on nurses as compared to doctors' governing boards.

There's another reason for your observations about female behavior.

Men Rule

It's still largely a male-dominated world. Men have the power. Look at the recent "Time's Up" issue. Even in liberal Hollywood, men have the power. Hospital boards are largely male. Hospital CEOs are largely male while CNOs are largely female.

It's a tough but true reality.

Even in nursing, a traditionally female occupation, when men become nurses they are often viewed as more qualified. It's no secret that men in nursing make more than women.

Self-Value

But we women have very special qualities. Intuition, compassion. Empathy. We are nurturers. When we focus on those unique gifts and collaborate together, instead of competing with each other, we are our most powerful selves.

No Excuses

This is not to say these explanations are excuses. Excuses are for people who don't take responsibility.

We are a force to be reckoned with once we take responsibility and come together. There are over 3 million nurses in the United States. We act as if we only have a rake when we actually have a bulldozer in the garage. We have enormous ability to bring about change.

How do we rally the masses? I don't know. Nurses do unite in outrage, as in Show Me Your Stethoscope. But there is an apathy around bringing about political change. The nursing profession itself is not unified by the American Nurse's Association (ANA). Some would say the ANA is beholden to the American Hospital Association (AHA). The AHA is a powerful lobby.

For whatever reason, it is time to stand up, stand together, and speak up. There is a grassroots movement that is dedicated to legislating nurse-patient ratios. It's the Nurses Take DC organization.

If every nurse reading this would make a call to their legislator, or write an email- it will make a difference!

Easily find out who your legislators are and make a call.

Write a letter to support H.R. 2392 and S. 1063 Nurse Staffing Standards for Hospital Patient Safety and Quality Care Act of 2017 legislative bills. Legislators respond to topics based on the number of phone calls and mail from their constituents.

Please read Mandated Nurse-Patient Ratios and share it and this article on social media. Use hashtags #NursesTakeDC and #allnursesSTRONG

Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.
Most institution shortages are created to save money, whether we want to believe it or not.

Considering that BSNs have only research and community health that ADNs don't, none of which is on the test, then as far as I'm concerned they are equal. Enough with the BSN preferred/required crap in job ads. Shortage solved.

I don't follow the logic here at all. I follow you that while under-staffing is blamed on a non-existent shortage it is often rooted in saving the employer money. But then you go on to suggest there is a shortage and the solution is to hie more ADNs? I would suspect most people would argue that (aside from the outcomes data) the push to BSN is also part of a cost-savings program for the hospital to get rid of experienced RNs and replace them with new-grads.

Physical therapy is also a female dominated profession yet they seem to be totally in control of their destiny.

PTs are more of a 70:30 split vs a 93:7 split. And you think that increasing the entry point for PTs strengthened them, why argue the opposite for nursing?

Specializes in Critical Care.

Ironic male nurse wants to blame the crappy working conditions arising from the majority male corporate leadership on the female peon nurses! He's just mad and looking for someone to blame. It's not the female nurses fault. It is the takeover by ruthless corporations combined with virtually no unions to fight back for workers rights. National Nurses United is an exception and has brought about better working conditions and even a state mandated patient ratio in CA.

For what its worth I do speak up when I have to and it isn't pleasant. I usually win, but not always and don't have a union that has my back. I can tell you it is unpleasant to speak up and you are labeled a problem. Management is used to nurses doing their bidding without back talk. On top of that the corporate yahoos at the top have been on a firing spree this past year and many heads have rolled from peons transporters to supervisors and educators. I've watched the corporate yahoos fire two CNO's over the years because they weren't "corporate" enough, not tough enough, they were viewed as too sympathetic to the nurses so out the door they went with security escort! Management has no problem firing nurses!

Now that doctors work for hospitals they are facing the same problems we have dealt with and many are committing suicide over the stress and bad working conditions. It is an epidemic.

Many nurses flee the hospitals because of the working conditions so there is a perennial shortage of nurses. I would too if I could find a job that pays enough. Unfortunately there aren't a lot of good paying jobs left in America and we have many new nurses that have other failed degrees and more student loan debt just trying to find a living wage job!

Change is not going to come from the working nurses, many who are single mothers. It is only going to come from a powerful union and/or govt mandates like the safe needle act which finally gave us safe needles, only ten years after they were in existence. The problem is govt pays a lot of healthcare via medicare and medicaid and it knows safe staffing ratios will cost more plus hospitals have lots of money to lobby and buy off the politicians so there is a vested interest to not act!

I can assure you regardless of gender, if these were relatively young- new nurses , they would've been fired in most hospitals.

Specializes in EMS, LTC, Sub-acute Rehab.
Oh my, where do I start?

The nursing collective as it appears to be referred to by many here is not much of a collective at all. Our common thread is our license. Aside from this, nursing is still very much a blue collar job with various points of entry for most, including various ways to travel up the ladder into management positions. We are pitted against each other from the start because many of us come from different educational backgrounds and bring a different perspective. This could be said of any group of workers but the difference is that we are making decisions about another human being and the stakes are higher. So we come in with different knowledge bases and practical life skills (nursing is often a second career these days) to contend with others who may not have much of either. This doesn't change with standard entry education because a nursing license and a nursing position is still fairly easy to obtain in comparison to jobs with similar requirements in other fields. A BS degree is a hell of a lot easier to come by these days than it was in previous decades, even if it costs more.

After establishing that nursing is easier to take on than say, engineering, you have to actually look at the varied socioeconomic, ethnic and cultural backgrounds of nurses, in addition to their personal motivations. These vary so widely we could have an entire thread devoted to the topic. First generation immigrants may have a more difficult time standing up for themselves in the workplace generally, for fear of rocking the boat. Younger women may not have a sense of their own voices yet; for some nursing is even a first job. Older women may be trying to bide their time for retirement. Some, like myself, prioritize my job last in a long list of priorities so that I choose to work part-time per diem only to accommodate more important interests and obligations. I may not be close to retirement but I also don't need a full-time job.

As for the victimhood of women that is so popular these days (and we've been through before- I remember the 90s)- views tend to be largely generational. I see a whole lot of Millenial and baby boomer women complaining out there but less of my own generation (does this have anything to do with the fact that gen X has been more financially successful than their parents?) But I also remember growing up in a world where we shucked off the feminism of our mothers and grandmothers since we believed (and I still do) that we were living in a world with plenty of opportunity for women for the taking. Those boomers were so angry at us for not appreciating them enough (though it was their mothers and grandmothers who really did the work). So interesting that their own children are now out protesting divisivesly with silly pink hats. I'm sorry but I can't get behind the neo-women's movement. I'm doing just fine and so are many, many women that I know. I have CHOICES.

So forgive me if I do not believe that the way to change nursing is with collectivism, which is the new political rage these days. I haven't any issues standing up for myself, asking for better working conditions, speaking up in a meeting, standing my ground over an important issue, asking for more pay and GETTING it, refusing work, quitting my job, or letting another nurse know that they are WRONG. I have positioned myself so that I OWN my work and that is each individual's responsibility. If we had more personal accountability and less kowtowing, we might get somewhere. Having someone else hold a gun to the head of management (unions) gets "us" very little.

Wanna change nursing? Change HEALTHCARE. No, I'm not talking about lobbying for more care for the sick, I'm talking about a wellness model. KEEP people well. Advocate for alternative therapies, promote naturopathy, clean food and water, advocate for livestock health and small farms, advocate for personal choice in healthcare, model wellness to your patients. We need to change the sickcare model. You work in an INDUSTRY that operates for PROFIT and it is no different than any other, I am sorry to say. Why would you expect any more? If you lobby your state officials, perhaps you should think bigger and stop worrying so much about teeny tiny changes that frighten the beast but keep him going.

And on that note, I'm going for a run.

I love this. It really speaks to me. Thank you.

Specializes in Geriatrics, Dialysis.
I would hope most women would not blame patriarchy if he fairly acquired a job in administration. It's sometimes hard to tell, but I personally would never blame inequality unless I had substantial proof it was true. Say a woman more eligible and more experienced is denied the job and it's given to a man with less experience/credentials, then I'd say "hey maybe this is inequality". Nursing doesn't have to be all women. It shouldn't be all women. I know many caring and compassionate men. If my boyfriend didn't pass out at the sight of blood he'd be an excellent nurse. I have five men in my nursing class. Four of them are amazing with patients and excellent at their jobs as techs and they'd make awesome administrators for change.

Yes, it is acquiring the job fairly that is sadly so often an issue. Speaking from personal experience a few years back when our male ADON was promoted to DON he had the opportunity to hire a new nurse in the ADON role. There were several candidates both internal and external that had way more experience both in nursing and management than the male nurse candidate that he hired who had been a nurse less than a year. It was a regular good old boys club in that office for quite awhile. Very bad for morale. We had several nurses quit when that happened, some out of anger that they didn't get the job over him and some out of disgust for the obvious preference for the man.

I have worked with several male nurses over the years and just like their female counterparts some were great, some not so much. Difference is though that the male nurses invariably get the schedule they want, the assignment they want and the pay they want with little argument. We are not union so management isn't locked in to a pay scale by experience only. In every case when people have been willing to discuss wages it was discovered that the male nurse had a higher starting wage than the female nurse regardless of previous experience. The men are also promoted over women even when the female candidate is clearly more qualified.

I would like to applaud you on your courage to speak the truth. I love being a nurse. I hate management. In 20 years I have seen a handful of leaders worthy of the job. Worse still is the influence of government and its money. Best practices, drug companies and diagnoses. If you don't see it yet soon you will. Managers are often incompetent to rule so they choose people who they think will help them perform better. These people are often the ones who make themselves available and have lots of information on everyone. I just label them borderline types. Is that the right diagnosis? They will stop at nothing to be the teachers pet? It's everywhere. It's disgusting and.... I just travel. 3 months anywhere is about all the politics I can handle. But I do love the job.

IMHO, while the letter writer's language might be a little frustrated and harsh, I largely agree with him. I'm a female nurse. I'm more on the side he describes. I see, often, management applying the tactics of "divide and conquer" to their great advantage, with nursing. It may be because nursing is a more traditionally female occupation, but that strategy has been used also in male-dominated occupations.

One interesting point I've read about in a number of studies is that nursing has a high level of "lateral abuse" even compared to other healthcare occupations, i.e. people turning on each other, as the letter writer describes.

Raising the Level of Awareness of Nurse-to-Nurse Lateral Violence in a Critical Access Hospital

Up to 90% of nurses experience lateral violence [1, 2]. Extensively and globally reported in the literature, nurse-to-nurse lateral violence (NNLV) or nurse aggression profoundly increases occupational stress with psychological, physical, and organizational consequences [3]. The pervasiveness of nursing workplace violence is of major concern for nursing as evidenced by the multiple position statements developed in response to NNLV [4]. A conservative estimate of the annual cost of nursing workplace violence is $4.3 billion dollars or nearly $250,000 per incident [5]. Nearly 60% of new nurses leave their initial employer within the first six months due to NNLV perpetrated in the workplace [6–8]. Each percentage point of nurse turnover results in an annual cost to an average hospital of nearly $300,000 and $3.6 million in poorly performing hospitals [9].

I have seen the most incompetent nurses become managers and mismanage the unit over and over again.

Because of all the nonsense.... Traveling is where it's at. I'll never go back to Staff work.

Specializes in NICU.

He is 100% correct,having worked to unify as a collective bargaining group I have seen all those passive aggressive behaviors.It is even worse with certain cultural groups.Look up the Chicago murder of a bunch of nurses by one psycho. Women have to "learn" in order to fight back.They need to be taught strategic planning in order of to fight off active shooter.Unify ! dont give up.

Specializes in Wound care; CMSRN.

Thanks for the evidence based heads up on NNLV (usually called NETY).

Broad generalizations about the behaviour of groups based on sexuality, race, income, trade,etc. can be grossly misleading and worse yet, turn people off to discussion altogether. Stick with the evidence.

Anecdotally, my strongest teachers and mentors in this field have all been women with years of nursing under their belts. Historically many of the strongest labor and political organizers in this country have been women, whether they were appreciated or not.

Specializes in ER.
Oh my, where do I start?

Wanna change nursing? Change HEALTHCARE. No, I'm not talking about lobbying for more care for the sick, I'm talking about a wellness model. KEEP people well. Advocate for alternative therapies, promote naturopathy, clean food and water, advocate for livestock health and small farms, advocate for personal choice in healthcare, model wellness to your patients. We need to change the sickcare model. You work in an INDUSTRY that operates for PROFIT and it is no different than any other, I am sorry to say. Why would you expect any more? If you lobby your state officials, perhaps you should think bigger and stop worrying so much about teeny tiny changes that frighten the beast but keep him going.

And on that note, I'm going for a run.

Yes. I completely agree with you here, especially the part about going for a run.

The problems destroying the integrity of our profession go far beyond staffing levels and have nothing to do with petty infighting. The escalation in detached, uniformed micromanagement of our environment is driven by business and profit. Our government has failed to bring constructive change for decades. Heath insurance companies are reporting double digit increases in profit this year as they continue to jack up their premiums while keeping medical costs "well controlled" = denying claims and squeezing labor.

3 million nurses, the ancillary staff who work with us, and the medical profession that would back us if we stand with the right agenda, coupled with the support of the angry masses, would bring government to its knees. Bypass their inept process. Start a movement, formulate a clear agenda (I'm still working on it), and stage "A Day Without Nurses" to force the issue.

We have the lives of this nation directly in our hands. It's a huge bargaining chip. Business and government have always banked (literally) on us not wielding this power. But there is enough anger over our failed, expensive, unjust and increasingly dangerous system, that a movement may well emerge to force change.