MA saying she's "the same as an RN"

[RedSox33RN]

At my job, we are offered classes each month for our CEU's as LNA's. We were at one the other day for some psych training, and we were asked what we wanted to be doing in 5 years. Myself and another woman said that hopefully we be all graduated and working as RN's, since we're both in nursing school.

Another woman said that she was graduating next week from an Medical Assistant program, and how it was "exactly the same as being an RN", but she got her degree faster, but won't get the same money (and she proceeded to b!tch about that).

Now, I've seen the debate here in the General Nursing discussion, but this just chapped my rearend. I think MA's are great - as are LNA's and LPN's and RN's and everyone that works in healthcare. A friend of mine is an MA, but she does not pass herself off as a nurse. Another friend is a Surgical Tech, and while she doesn't say she's an RN, her son calls her a nurse, saying his mom told him she did "more" nursing in the OR than the nurses do. I've corrected him twice about it, but don't anymore. It just bugs me that I'm busting my hump to become an RN, yet anyone that works in healthcare feels they can call themselves one.

I'm so careful, I don't even call myself an SN while at work, and don't call myself an LNA while in clinical!

I don't know why people can't be proud of what they are. Some of the best tips and knowledge I've gotten on the job has been from the LNA's, many of which are career LNA's. THey're damn good at what they do! It's bothersome that some feel it all comes down to you're either a nurse, or have to claim to be one to be recognized.

Anyway, I kept my mouth shut when this LNA/MA was going off, but I so wanted to say, "So if you're the same as an RN, why won't the hospital or the state recognize you as one? Why? Because you aren't. You may as well call yourself an astronaut. You aren't one of those either!"

Okay, back to the regularly scheduled programming.

[allthingsbright]

The MA at my sons school passed herself off as a nurse until I specifically asked her what her degree was in. *sigh* She then proceeded to tell me she "can do everything a nurse can do." Scary.

[Achoo!, LPN]

The MA at my sons school passed herself off as a nurse until I specifically asked her what her degree was in. *sigh* She then proceeded to tell me she "can do everything a nurse can do." Scary.

In a sense that may be true because the definitions basically state that the MA can work under the doctors liscence, so I suppose they really could perform brain surgery if the doctor felt that they were capable and took on the liability.

This is one of the reasons why people are pushihg for liscensure for MA's. They need a better defined scope of practice.

[SuesquatchRN, BSN, RN]

It doesn't bother me that someone wants the same title I earned. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. If it makes her feel good to call herself a nurse when she isn't what do I care?

[momx4]

In the state of Pennsylvania, MA are not required to even have to attend school. They can be hired on and provide training at the office. I really beg to differ that they are the same as a RN. All this craziness ,BS, family neglecting,crying,anxiety,swearing,studying and hoop jumping I am doing is allowing me to EARN (hopefully,just a student) the title of a RN.No disrespect for MA's at all,very important job but certainly NOT a Registered Nurse. Isn't that illegal to claim to be a RN,when not?

[AmyORlpn]

i am a cma (certified medical assistant) in oregon. i graduated from a 9 month program back in 1999. i'm currently enrolled in a lpn program which is 13 months.

before i started this program i can say that i compaired myself to an rn. i must say though that the cna's do know alot more that they are given credit for.

i've worked for a couple of hospitals in the urgent care depts. there is absolutly no critical thinking skills that we were taught in the ma program. most of the ma's i've worked with just do the bare min. to get the job done. i do like to learn what the orders are that we are given from the dr. ma's work directly under the dr.

ma's can draw blood, vitals, ecg's, injections, give meds, and can even take x-rays if licensed.

i'm learning so much in the lpn program and do not see how cma's or cna's can say they are nurses. i've called a couple of my co-workers out and have always corrected patients when they have called me a nurse.

call her out on it!!!!

amy

lpn student in oregon

[Scrubz]

There's a girl who I work with. She's a little older than me (I'm 20, she's probably 25 or 26). She's been a CNA for about 3 years while I've been a CNA for about 4 months or so. We're also in nursing school together. Anyway, I was orienting at the hospital under her. She's a really cool person but she kind of thinks she knows a lot about everything. She does know a lot, but she acts like she knows more than she does and thinks that anyone who's been hired after her automatically knows less than she does... I don't know, it just gets on my nerves sometime.

Oh, I throw this on in there. One time we were dealing with poop... I'll just leave it at that. For some reason she comes off and says, "We're going to have to get you to stop being afraid of this." I was like, what the crap, I don't mind poop and I never have (when working.. you know how it goes). I mean, if it needs to be done then it needs to be done. Just remarks like that get on my nerves. But I don't work with her all the time, so it's okay. Plus I just deal with it by not caring what she says most of the time.. Other than that she's pretty cool.

[core0]

Having read through these posts I think that people are missing the point, although pedsnursetobe and couple of others have danced around it. RN's have a license and independently practice nursing. MA's (and CST's for that matter) fall under the heading of unlicensed assistive personnel (UAP) or Unlicensed Health Care Provider (UHCP) (since UAP is sometimes used only for delegated nursing practice). This is the same title that most states put CNA's under(although some states put CNA's under UAP and MA's under UHCP). UAP's work under someone elses license usually the physician. I was unaware that MA's could work under a nurses license, but it does make sense. There is really no critical thinking skills taught as there is in nursing, but some get pretty good after a while. They definitely should not introduce themselves as nurses.

Here is a department of labor description that is pretty good and unbiased:

Medical assistants

As to why they are used instead of nurses, it is a matter of money. Even with the poor pay for office nurses you can hire two MA's for the price of one nurse. You also can use the MA's for other duties such as scheduling or filing. Also in some states MA's can get limited scope X-ray certification which is helpful in a small office. Realistically do you need an RN to do most stuff in a typical office? Now I would prefer an RN, but when you ask most Doc's are they willing to take a 24k pay hit for that, most won't. Now if you are using someone to run a triage line for example I would much rather have an RN than an MA doing this job (see the critical thinking part above) and I've seen it attempted with MA's.

I think that MA's do a fine job in a typical practice as long as they aren't pushed beyond their scope of practice (the most typical problem I've seen).

David Carpenter, PA-C

[CityKat, BSN, RN]

Nurses are paid for their skills and their critical thinking. MA's are comparable, but in no way should they represent themselves as RN's. I have a friend who is an MA and she regrets not getting her RN because she is making much less than I will be making upon graduation. She doesn't have the critical thinking skills that I have either. Although she's learned a lot, she said the RN is still far ahead in many regards.

Soo..

[damarystx]

I worked as an MA in Il at an immediate care associated with a hospital....no schooling, not even a cna. All of my experience came from on the job training. I started in a doc's office in the lab & learned phlebotomy and basic lab tests, then went to work as a dialysis tech. 6 week training for that and then to IC as an MA where I would do vitals, labs, ekg's, physicals, drug screens, breath alcohol tests, suture removal (but not staples) set up for suturing assist with pelvics and plastics when they were called in for certain lac's. Also did filing, got juice and crackers for patients, made coffee, answered phones, did NOT call in scripts..... never called myself a nurse and as an LPN I correct people that assume that I am an RN and if they don't know what that means I tell them. Now that I am in nursing school and working as an LPN I see even more what I didn't know as an MA. I now work with CNA's and our clients will sometimes call them nurses ( we are hard to differentiate b/c we get to wear street clothes including jeans and even sweats if we want, detox is a very different environment ) the CNA's will not always correct the clients but I will. I don't think that they always realize just how much more responsibility it is being the nurse. And I work with incredible cna's would not detract from the fabulous job they do by any means but they are not nurses.

[atwtrn]

I'm not a MA. But let me tell you. I go to a very busy GI doc's office. The nurses are great. But the MA there RUNS THE OFFICE. She schedules, gets authorizations, helps patients get insurance and drug coverage. She's great! I'm not saying an MA should claim to be a nurse. But this MA is a lifesaver and has learned her skills on the job. Both MAs and nurses deserve credit. After all, we all have the same goal: patient care. Can't we all just get along? :)

[rn/writer, RN]

I'm not a MA. But let me tell you. I go to a very busy GI doc's office. The nurses are great. But the MA there RUNS THE OFFICE. She schedules, gets authorizations, helps patients get insurance and drug coverage. She's great! I'm not saying an MA should claim to be a nurse. But this MA is a lifesaver and has learned her skills on the job. Both MAs and nurses deserve credit. After all, we all have the same goal: patient care. Can't we all just get along? :)

We can if everyone agrees on scope of practice and truth in labeling. And then sticks to it.

[damarystx]

I'm not a MA. But let me tell you. I go to a very busy GI doc's office. The nurses are great. But the MA there RUNS THE OFFICE. She schedules, gets authorizations, helps patients get insurance and drug coverage. She's great! I'm not saying an MA should claim to be a nurse. But this MA is a lifesaver and has learned her skills on the job. Both MAs and nurses deserve credit. After all, we all have the same goal: patient care. Can't we all just get along? :)

Sounds like she does a lot of clerical work which is in the scope of practice for an MA.