I have felt for a while that we should have universal health care here in the US, but I didn't know things were this bad. We really should be ashamed that GTMO Bay prisoners get free (and very good quality, from the looks of it) health care and 9/11 rescue workers are suffering from 9/11 related health conditions and have no coverage.
And hospitals removing their names from the pt bracelets of ill, unisured pts, and having cabs drop them on Skid Row?
And insurance company physicians admitting that they know they caused the death of pts by denying claims in order to save the ins company money?
What is the matter with us that our health care system is ranked #37 among industrialized nations?
To me, this is not about politics, not about personal responsibility, it's not about cost- it's just about what is right and what is wrong.
I know the Canadian and other universal health care systems have their problems, but they are not run on a foundation of greed and denial of care as ours is.
I am very fortunate that I have good health insurance, but this could change at any time. I am willing to pay more taxes so that all US citizens can get free or low-cost health care that is not connected with a job, and can move with the citizen and cover them wherever they are and whatever their circumstances are.
well we are in america and my dh had to wait a year after stent placement for back surgery, so he now has cardiac clearance, we called the orthopedic surgeon for an appointment and we cant get to see him for more than 8 weeks. probably about the same as in the uk, sometimes less. not that we are complaining, because we are patient people nd we have already waited for a year anyway.
Of course, the ones yelling liar are the ones supporting those he's calling out.
Hmmm.....
i really wonder what the guy that runs the anti-michael moore website had to say when he saw that movie and found out that the "guardian angel" who sent him the money to pay his wife's medical bills was none other than the man he spends all day hate blogging about. i bet he feels like a dummy.
I've never seen the movie. I don't want to. And I don't need to in order to be disgusted with our "system"..........that's been going on for a LONG time.
it really just cements what we already know, viva. it's heartbreaking. i've seen it numerous times and every time i watch it i still cry. it is honestly worth seeing.
Specializes in LTC, assisted living, med-surg, psych.
Well, as I said before, I don't care for Michael Moore or his politics, but healthcare is a subject near and dear to my heart, and watching this particular movie would make me mad enough to spit nails!!
Well, as I said before, I don't care for Michael Moore or his politics, but healthcare is a subject near and dear to my heart, and watching this particular movie would make me mad enough to spit nails!!
I avoided seeing Farenheit 9/11 for a long time, because I was already very angry ay Bush, and I just felt the movie would make me even angrier. Really, F/9/11 is mild compared to Sicko.
Several Canadians are interviewed in the movie and it is worth hearing what they have to say.
Remember "Damaged Care" on Showtime, I think it was?
It was written by a nurse who went to work as an insurance reviewer and the things she saw on her job- inappropriate denials of payment that caused people to die.
Really, unless a quack doc is asking for payment for some completely phony or totally unproven procedure- something like Chakra balancing, for instance- or futile tx- such as an organ transplant on someone who would be terminal with or without a transplant- I don't think insurance companies have any business denying anything.
well we are in america and my dh had to wait a year after stent placement for back surgery, so he now has cardiac clearance, we called the orthopedic surgeon for an appointment and we cant get to see him for more than 8 weeks. probably about the same as in the uk, sometimes less. not that we are complaining, because we are patient people nd we have already waited for a year anyway.
honestly, it takes me that long to get an appointment every time i need to see my ortho doctor... and i live in the us.
Specializes in Flight Nurse, Pedi CICU, IR, Adult CTICU.
moore ended the movie claiming that every european country offers free healthcare to their citizens via a single-payer system. two lies in this; 1. it's not free, and 2.many european countries have more than one payer system.
when moore was asked by entertainment weekly if he felt any need to get the other side of the story, he told them no.
oh, and it's the same interview where he acknowledged that he misrepresented canadian wait times.
he loved to praise the french health system, failing to mention that their high-quality system allowed 15,000 people to die in 2003 just because of a heat wave where temps barely broke 100 degrees (104 degrees on seven separate days). 15,000! five times the toll of 9/11. over 52,000 europeans died overall in their heat wave, but somehow the americans are chastized when a cat five hurricane drives over n. orleans and the death toll is 1/10th, and we are the targets of all kinds of global criticism. am i the only one who finds this hypocritical?
and if anyone thinks his cuban experience wasn't staged and fabricated, then maybe we can ask some of our cuban colleagues if moore was right about their healthcare system. oh, wait. castro controls the flow of information, and there doesn't seem to be any cuban providers here (wonder why), so here's the closest we can get; http://www.desdecuba.com/generationy/?p=332. since cuba is the second largest incarcerator of journalists, i suppose there is no reason to believe that cuba is lying about their statistics and infant mortality.
moore was nothing more than a poser when he sent the moorewatch fellow money; the fellow had already received all the donations he needed to cover his bills and had renewed his websites before moore decided to become an "anonymous donor."
there was a time when documentaries were 100% truthful; apparently those days are gone in the interest of ideology.
these are just a couple examples of his lies, but is surprises me that he can be just 'half-true' and win so many fans who eat up his propoganda as if it were the fifth gospel.
Every experiment in universalizing health care in the US (Massachusetts, Hawaii), either quickly collapsed, or immediately was identified as unsustainable.
I understand that this could be a reason to oppose universal health care, but it doesn't answer my question about unpacking the phrase "socialised medicine." I can understand why some people may take issue with Viva's quip about socialism being inherently evil, but the position that "universal health care is a socialist idea and therefore free of merit" bypasses logic and goes straight to an emotional response. I'm therefore intrigued that so many intelligent and often logical members use the phrase "socialised medicine" as a response in itself, and ask again about unpacking the phrase.
He loved to praise the French health system, failing to mention that their high-quality system allowed 15,000 people to die in 2003 just because of a heat wave where temps barely broke 100 degrees (104 degrees on seven separate days). 15,000! Five times the toll of 9/11. Over 52,000 Europeans died overall in their heat wave, but somehow the Americans are chastized when a Cat Five hurricane drives over N. Orleans and the death toll is 1/10th, and we are the targets of all kinds of global criticism. Am I the only one who finds this hypocritical?
While some of that toll is absolutely related to provision of health care services (as are the deaths in Australia during our heatwave this summer), other significant factors contributed to the death toll, including lack of public education, lack of preparedness and - most importantly - the fact that those temperatures were unprecedented. Australians find the idea of people dying in thirty-degree (86F) weather ridiculous, but add ten degrees (50F) to whatever the summer average is in your area and see how you go. That happened in the south of Australia this summer and it was dire, and we're a population used to dealing with the heat.
I'm pretty sure the furore about Katrina had to do with the preventability (perceived or actual) of many of the deaths, (perceived or actual) dealys in anything like a proportional and adequate response, and concerns about how the race of the majority of those affected may have influenced the (perceived or actual) delays and/or response. These aspects don't apply to the European heath wave. I seem to remember a great deal of internal criticism, also, some of it on this very site.
There was a time when documentaries were 100% truthful; apparently those days are gone in the interest of ideology.
Though some Old School philosophers believe there's such a thing as objective Truth (true for all people at all times), social scientists (and even many current philosophers) believe that truths are subjective. Certainly a topic as multidimensional as health care raises significant problems in arguing a position of truthfulness. We all have our biases, tend to give more weught to evidence that supports positions we already hold (and the converse), and if we're reflective and honest can at least acknowledge both the strength of our biases and truths that counter them.
cariad
628 Posts
well we are in america and my dh had to wait a year after stent placement for back surgery, so he now has cardiac clearance, we called the orthopedic surgeon for an appointment and we cant get to see him for more than 8 weeks. probably about the same as in the uk, sometimes less. not that we are complaining, because we are patient people nd we have already waited for a year anyway.