I know this an old beast BUT ...

[StudentOfHealing]

I know this an old beast but if I cannot vent and speak my mind freely here (within reason); where else can I?

I am quite annoyed; I have several friends who are in a BSN program and it's evident that their course load is extremely light; it's evident that they are babied and quite frankly... it ANNOYS ME.

I was flat out told by professors that they are here to break us down and build us back up. In fact, one professor told me in private that they strive to make exams are ridiculously hard as possible.

In my theory class we had (at one point of time) the class average was a 50%. It's not because we're not studying; I see how we study... we studied hard... it's THOSE exams.

Then after I find out I get ALL C's ... my friend in (BSN) student tells me how she got 2 B's and an A thanks to receiving (wait for it)... bonus points... (HOLD UP... bonus points? what is this... grammar school?)

We get no bonus points, we get NO rounding of grades. My other BSN friend was surprised to hear that professors don't round. (Seriously? Your professors round? this is a professional school; there's NO rounding).

She was also surprised to here we do 2 care plans the night BEFORE ... they do ONE care plan ... and get an entire WEEK.

The part that truly infuriates me is that she says that her classmates truly believe that ADN's are the equivalent of a CNA.

Don't get me wrong; nothing wrong with being a CNA... it just makes me angry because I've spent nights studying (sleepless nights). I've gone to clinical with 1 - 2 hours of sleep.

BOTH are in 3rd semester and have already taken Medsurg 1 & 2 and pharm... and do NOT know the relationship between Mannitol and HF (why it's Contraindicated) ... okay, I guess I can't knock them for not possessing recall knowledge but for the love of the Big Guy, I don't think it's rocket science.

They can talk to me about theories and Florence nightingale but not how the physician will most likely fix Dig Toxicity and what their nursing responsibilities would be.

They can tell me about Barton but not about WHY we check potassium before administering insulin to our DKA patients.

and THEY are preferred to be hired rather than me?

Well FINE... have at it...

when I graduate and am refused a job (I WILL be working on my BSN prereqs) because I don't already have a BSN ... you will lose someone who will:

NOT be scared to get down and dirty

NOT be scared to defend my patients health

GLADLY learn new thing (otherwise I wouldn't bridge to BSN)

GLADLY do the "lowly" task

GLADLY perform the complicated procedures AFTER I understand the rationale and pathophysiology behind my interventions.

Just to add some wood to the fire; my clinical buddy was doing clinical and she floated to another floor b/c her original floor had too many new grads who were shadowing...

she floated to a floor with students from a BSN program and ALL they did was sit, chat, chew gum, and TEXT...

We get sent HOME for having our phone. We get sent home for having a speck of mud on our shoes.

I'm not sure what exactly the studies say about BSN prepared nurses but I think it's malarkey.

I'm sure it can help with management but honestly; you're going to say my hard work has earned me a CNA position?

)= I needed to vent...

[StudentOfHealing]

Don't worry about offending people! We should all have tough skin with the job we do.

Don't ever feel bad about standing up for your achievements, your education, or your scope.

To be honest, your post surprised me a little because in conversations on other threads you have always been very rational, motivated, and confident. I can appreciate that you must have been very frustrated to vent as you did. And it's good you got it out!

I'm glad and appreciate I have a place to vent. There is NO room for unprofessionalism in academia or the clinical setting. I carry a poker face in the hospital (but a smile with patients obviously!) outside from there ... I am a neutral sly cat.

I am human and I needed to vent. I have just completed an extremely tough semester (the toughest in the program they say), and I don't need to repeat the story but hearing remarks of that nature just....

just upsets me.

I recognize this wasn't the best approach ... and I would never express myself in such manner in life.

I admit it. I was real hurt. I admit it, needed to vent. I admit it, it felt good. I also admit that I'm not right in everything I said; heck I'm a student ... what do I really know? My post was based on FEELINGS and not rational thought process.

[StudentOfHealing]

I would be careful about speaking in absolutes.

Mannitol can be given to people in heart failure. Depends on what kind of heart failure and their volume and renal status.

Hopefully you are checking more than a potassium before giving insulin to someone in DKA.

If you don't know what the studies say about entry level into practice, how do you know they are malarkey?

It was an example... that these particular girls weren't taught some basic material.

ok?

[gabriellegoss]

Couldn't agree with you more. Just had a conversation today. Spoke with some BSN students from a nearby school saying they thought that they needed more than a year to learn pediatrics.. Meanwhile my school (ADN) program had a month to learn the same material.. And didn't complain about it once

[gabriellegoss]

Not a year, a semester*

[Anbo3882]

Please do not assume that all BSN programs are that way. I am enrolled in a BSN program and I experience sleepless nights regularly. We have two 12 hour days of clinical a week and a new care plan due each day of clinical in which we have only the night before to prepare them. To top that off we must receive a 90% or above on the care plan in order for it to be considered passing. We also have 6 hours of theory a week. It is an accelerated program and each class that has a clinical attached it only 8 weeks long. That means 8 weeks of medsurg, peds, OB, etc. Yikes! It is hard and time consuming. My friends in ADN programs are experiencing similar issues except their classes are a semester long. BSN programs are similar to ADN programs. The only difference is the BSN prepared nurse has received additional education in leadership, community health management, and research. Nursing school is hard in general no matter what degree you receive at the end. I chose a BSN program because I knew that I wanted to go on to NP and a BSN would better position me to do so. No matter the education pathway you choose the end result is the same: those two coveted letters at the end of your name. We should not look down on ADN or BSN educated nurses, because they are just that; Nurses.

[Chilled1121, BSN]

I don't quite understand why if someone makes a disclaimer that they had to vent, why continue to read the post if it is going to bother you. Not sure if there is a need to pick apart the OP examples or how they may need a change in attitude.

We all have our days and appreciate you sharing and opening up about your frustrations you had in your nursing student journey!

[Esme12, ASN, BSN, RN]

There are good schools and bad school at all levels. This argument will not end anytime soon.

StudentOfHealing I feel your pain....((HUGS))

[bopeep82]

I will have to say that I completed all my prereq's for the BSN program (all non-nursing classes for a 4 year), yet was accepted into an ADN program first. Hell, I'm 31 and I'll take what I can get. So, for me, my education when I'm done with my ADN program will be on par in terms of requisites with someone with a BSN. I know that what I have done is phenomenal and I'm proud of myself. I learned in the Marine Corps that "an empty can rattles the most". If someone must insult another then they really have personal esteem issues that I'd personally rather stay away from. Take pride in yourself and to hell with worthless opinions. At the end of the day, you must do what fits into your lifestyle. ADN programs are great, as they allow for us that don't have a lot of money or who live in rural areas to attain a degree. If it wasn't for the ADN program, I would have to move over 2 hours away from my husband, 3 kids and home just to attend a damn school. So, THANK YOU ADN programs!

[Jennybrie]

When I was doing research on the local schools as far as retention ratings, NCLEX passing and placement scores I found only one BSN program that was similar in statistics to the ADN program that I am currently enrolled in. In the end all that matters is that licensure and job placement after graduation. I think sometimes the non-accelerated BSN programs are at a disadvatange when preparing for NCLEX because the amount of time between learning the material and taking the test (eg. fundamentals freshman year and NCLEX 3.5 years later). I don't really hear good/bad things between ADN and BSN just differences between the nursing programs so this is an interesting insight into a controversy that I didn't even know existed. Thanks for the rant and good luck!!

[nurseprnRN, BSN, RN]

Don't assume all BSN programs are that way.

Got that right, in spades. Mine surely wasn't. And actually, you don't know that hers is either-- you just know that she's a bit lacking in the interpersonal relationships thang.

[BostonFNP, APRN]

In the end all that matters is that licensure and job placement after graduation.

There are many things about nursing that matter to me far more than licensure and job placement. Little things like.....patient safety, improved outcomes, furthering the profession, bettering myself, etc...

[itsnowornever, BSN, RN]

I can say the very same thing about the ASn Student in my ER and L&D when I was there. Both busy floors with plenty to do (and yes I was a BSN grad). They stand around talking or hiding in the break room. Though I am a new grad, I LOVE students and can't wait until I can precept! I grab them and take them to my IVs, take them to listen to heart and lung sounds, ask if they want to do meds, try and show them how to talk to our psych patients---and they stand there looking at me like I'm crazy. What do they do? They talk to their professor about sewing. Really?

It's not the program you go to, or they go to, it's the PERSON and their DRIVE to work. That simple.

Posting from my phone, ease forgive my fat thumbs! :)