In the last staff meeting, NM states Dr. A has complained because the female nurses make eye contact with him. We were instructed to respect his (and other doctors) culture and NOT make eye contact or appear assertive. When asked to clarify assertive we were told assertive was "asking or suggesting something for the patients".
Excuse me! I am American and I am living in America! How come these doctors don't have to respect my culture? How come they don't have to respect me (I am a woman)?
Of course I will continue to make eye contact and I will continue to request things my patients need and I will continue to suggest things that the patient needs. I will continue to advocate for my patients. If the doc doesn't like it... tough crap. I live in America and have the rights afforded American women. I am not giving them up to stroke the ego of a bigot.
If he doesn't like it then maybe HE should look down! Also besides that idiotic request.. Who on Earth does he think he is asking a nurse to bite her tongue regarding her patients care! He should be reported and this nonsense put to rest. Regardless of his "culture" he is most definitely not God! He works on a team that includes nurses. They are all responsible for the patient at hand.
Instead of everyone always spewing to respect other peoples cultures I wish they would just agree when in the face of someone who has separate beliefs, instead of caving to theirs and disregarding yours..for the time being just be agree to be neutral. Why is that so difficult?!? You know, sort of an agree to disagree.
Kudos to you sunshineintheforest!!!! As I've stated before, when in Rome, do as the Roman's do! Again, rude is rude!!! NO EXCEPTIONS!!!
i disagree with you; as the fact is any dr/rn invited to come to usa to practice receives an entire packet of information on what is and what is not acceptable. to say that it takes time to adjust to certain changes is true, but not with regard to simple manners. rude is rude in any culture. i have seen too many dr's who think it is acceptable to treat people (women especially) unprofessionally and rude. there is never a reason to excuse such deplorable behavior. if i were to go to another country to practice, you bet i would be fully aware of what to expect. it is people with attitudes that "allow" exceptions (such as yourself) that allow such dr's to get away with unacceptable behaviors. shame on anyone who witnesses any rude behavior towards anyone; especially towards one of our sister rn's. .
exactly the point i was trying to make in a previous post.
i was going to work in i think the aue/saudia arabia at one time (this was a while ago), went to the conference for info and we were given a whole booklet on what we must/must not do culturally. for example, to not wear a head covering is seen as offensive; hair must be covered up, long sleeves to be worn, etc. also if you are sitting at a table you couldn't point the bottom of your foot at someone - over there, it was seen as like giving someone the finger in our culture. if i had gone i would have definitely followed cultural traits. why is that so wrong to expect others to to do the same?
i get tired of kowtowing to people from other cultures sometimes; i will not change for other people just because they 'feel a bit unfomfortable'. i have felt uncomfortable nursing patients who won't/refuse to speak english, have abused me in their language and nothing was done because management doesn't want to 'offend' anyone. i will be an aussie, i will speak australian and i will talk about my culture and my cultural traits in front of people who 'don't like it' or who don't speak english. if you are from another country and it offends you, well tough. get over it and move on!
Dr. A has complained because the female nurses make eye contact with him. We were instructed to respect his (and other doctors) culture and NOT make eye contact or appear assertive.
I told my wife this story while laughing at the absudity of it all, and promptly received the smack in the head meant for Dr. A and the OP's administration!
America is in trouble- every other country out there knows who they are and what they stand for. Cross thier borders you get shot-- you go visit- you best try to speak thier language.... However from Obama down- we have no idea who we are now--- we have become so watered down= the illegals are like crushed ice cooling off water. Now doctors that think we have to obey their customs? Somehow this must stop. Thsi country was founded on Christian Principles and we were all on teh same page... now we are of many books and getting very confused. Somehow a movement must come together and stop this.
Wow, way to project a singular problem into a systemic one!
We were never on one page....we had a war back then because we weren't on the same page (Civil War). Most countries have a dominant cultural/heritage group (ie, in Italy there are mostly folks of Italian heritage, in Ireland, mostly folks of Irish heritage). We've always been a mosaic. Yes, we have our own cultural norms (which vary wildly by region by the way) but the idea that we started "all on the same page" is just fiction.
North America is a melting pot for cultures! He/She is free to be HIS/HER culture after work. But when he.she is working taking care of patients, he obeys our rules. If we were in HIS.HER country, we have to abide by theirs.
Lets not get on our high horse about womens rights here in North America! Thats similar to a person running out of excuses, then uses religion as their excuse aka sign of desperation, they lost their battle!
If the dr continues this behaviour, he should be reported to the supervisor aka NM or higher, if no satisfaction.
wow, way to project a singular problem into a systemic one!
we were never on one page....we had a war back then because we weren't on the same page (civil war). most countries have a dominant cultural/heritage group (ie, in italy there are mostly folks of italian heritage, in ireland, mostly folks of irish heritage). we've always been a mosaic. yes, we have our own cultural norms (which vary wildly by region by the way) but the idea that we started "all on the same page" is just fiction.
i think we need to look at curiousme's point, as its well taken by many. if one comes to america it's for many reasons, however it's not to make american's bow down to "another's" culture. before going to another country, one should be intelligent enough to understand america's norms, culture etc (as you would when going to live, visit in any other country - it's called respect!) yes, we all need to respect one another; but when certain people decide that their faith, culture, etc is the superior one (i.e., don't give eye contact etc, etc.) that's where american's need to draw the line. it is never correct to force one's own beliefs, culture, norms etc. on anyone; especially in one's own country. mosaic is fine, but when in rome, do as the roman's do! again, it's called respect for other's.
This doctor is out of his freaking mind apparently and so is your NM for even suggesting that you go along with that nonsense. If the docs don't like assertive American women, then they should leave America...very simple b/c we American women are actually afforded certain rights in this country and that's not changing anytime soon. And I must agree with one of the previous posters that if he doesn't like women making eye contact with him, then he should look down...lol.
Just a quick question and I'm out. Eye contact making with starngers is considered rude in america believe it or not,esp on the New York metro. Anyone who has ever been on one can tell you. Its extremaly uncomfortable making eye contact with strangers and it doesn't happen like many here say it happens. Sure in the middle of Montana you could do it but not too much New York,because you will get asked "what ya looking at?
I am one who looks away and I don't keep eye contact too long. I'm in a subculture of America and I notice whem dealing with other races they don't look you in the eye. Its not as common as people think.
Just a quick question and I'm out. Eye contact making with starngers is considered rude in america believe it or not,esp on the New York metro. Anyone who has ever been on one can tell you. Its extremaly uncomfortable making eye contact with strangers and it doesn't happen like many here say it happens. Sure in the middle of Montana you could do it but not too much New York,because you will get asked "what ya looking at?
I am one who looks away and I don't keep eye contact too long. I'm in a subculture of America and I notice whem dealing with other races they don't look you in the eye. Its not as common as people think.
Oh, well now...the NYC subway is a whole other animal. I remember one time I was there, during the day, in business attire, and I turned towards a similarly attired man wearing a watch standing about 10 feet away from me on the platform to politely ask, "Excuse me, sir, do you know what time it is? He turned away and walked about 20 more feet from me. On that same day, I remember saying, "bless you" to a similarly dressed man when he sneezed as we, and a gazillion other people, were walking up the short set of steps from the subway onto the street. He turned briefly and glared at me.
That's how I learned not to look at or speak to anybody on the NYC subway...EVER.
Just a quick question and I'm out. Eye contact making with starngers is considered rude in america believe it or not,esp on the New York metro. Anyone who has ever been on one can tell you. Its extremaly uncomfortable making eye contact with strangers and it doesn't happen like many here say it happens. Sure in the middle of Montana you could do it but not too much New York,because you will get asked "what ya looking at?
I am one who looks away and I don't keep eye contact too long. I'm in a subculture of America and I notice whem dealing with other races they don't look you in the eye. Its not as common as people think.
Good point. Cultures differ in ground rules, not just from country to country, but also from region to region. And who's to say which cultures are right, and which wrong?
kty1
131 Posts
Kudos to you sunshineintheforest!!!! As I've stated before, when in Rome, do as the Roman's do! Again, rude is rude!!! NO EXCEPTIONS!!!
Thanks for the great post!
:yeah: