Is it fianally time to retire NETY?

Wuzzie · Jun 9, 2017

There is no need to retire the acronym "NETY;" just modify it:
Nurses
Engage
Their
Young:

LOVE this!!!!

allnurses Guide · Jun 9, 2017

NETY means "Nurses eat their young." The great majority of what is claimed to be "NETY" is merely incivility or even well-deserved negative feedback. Bullying, which does exist but not to the extent claimed, seems to be just as likely to from the "young" toward the senior nurse. (Claiming falsely to be bullied by one's preceptor just to deflect legitimate negative feedback is in fact bullying.) Therefore, I think it's way PAST time to let go of NETY.

I agree that NETY . . . Nurses . . . Eat . . .Their . . . Young . . . should be retired.

It has always bugged me that a generalization about nurses is allowed to continue.

None of us are saying that true bullying shouldn't be addressed but this phrase doesn't tell the real story. The story NETY tells is only old nurses bully young nurses. That's a silly stereotype that needs to end.

So yes, every time someone uses it here on AN or anywhere else, I will continue to stand up for nurses as a whole who for the most part do not bully each other. And I'm grateful for the other nurses here who do the same.

FolksBtrippin, BSN, RN · Jun 10, 2017

I have been hearing the tale about NETY the older nurse who takes great joy in making new nursesfeel so bad that many leave the profession after an encounter with her. For the record I have never been bullied during my career especially when I was starting out. I had great preceptors who were always willing to teach me and show me interesting things.
I my own experience as I have gotten older I find that so-called collateral violence seems to occur more often from younger nurses towards older nurses. We have all encountered a new, fresh out of school nurse who thinks they know it all and has nothing to learn from those of us who fall into the crusty old bat category. They are jaded before they even start!
One observation that I have seen in the past few years is that we as a culture have raised a generation of people who are offended by just about everything. It used to be if someone had a difference of opinion with you it was just that - we shrugged our shoulders and moved on. Now we feel compelled to tell others how offended and bullied we are for being different.
In my career I have encountered a few rather unpleasant personalities. Sometimes they have done/said things that were not very nice but It has never risen to the height of actual bullying mainly because I confront such behavior. Being in recovery has taught me a lot about letting go of fear and resentment. In one case a rather jerky nurse said out loud in the nurse's station " I heard your a drunk! Is that true?" I could have chosen to walk away but instead I just looked at him and said "That's drunk in recovery to you - I'll be happy to talk to you later in private if you want." Turned on my heel and went about my duties.
I don't let things fester and stew - I don't have enough room in my head to let other people rent space there. In fact I often don't think of work at all when I am not there.
So can't we just retire NETY and move on with the knowledge that there are jerks everywhere.
Peace and Namaste
Hppy

NETY is still a problem some places. People will stop talking about it when it stops happening to them.

allnurses Guide · Jun 10, 2017

NETY is still a problem some places. People will stop talking about it when it stops happening to them.

Big deep sigh . . .

Did you read this entire thread?

Again, NURSES EAT THEIR YOUNG is a generalization and should not be allowed to continue.

Some nurses, old, medium, young . . . can be bullies to other nurses who are old, medium, young.

It does not hinge on only being old equals being a bully to only young nurses.

There are some bullies in nursing, as there are in any job you can think of and probably bullies in people who are unemployed.

But old nurse always bullies young nurse . . . NETY . . . needs to be retired as the OP mentioned.

nehneh14 · Jun 10, 2017

I have been hearing the tale about NETY the older nurse who takes great joy in making new nursesfeel so bad that many leave the profession after an encounter with her. For the record I have never been bullied during my career especially when I was starting out. I had great preceptors who were always willing to teach me and show me interesting things.
I my own experience as I have gotten older I find that so-called collateral violence seems to occur more often from younger nurses towards older nurses. We have all encountered a new, fresh out of school nurse who thinks they know it all and has nothing to learn from those of us who fall into the crusty old bat category. They are jaded before they even start!
One observation that I have seen in the past few years is that we as a culture have raised a generation of people who are offended by just about everything. It used to be if someone had a difference of opinion with you it was just that - we shrugged our shoulders and moved on. Now we feel compelled to tell others how offended and bullied we are for being different.
In my career I have encountered a few rather unpleasant personalities. Sometimes they have done/said things that were not very nice but It has never risen to the height of actual bullying mainly because I confront such behavior. Being in recovery has taught me a lot about letting go of fear and resentment. In one case a rather jerky nurse said out loud in the nurse's station " I heard your a drunk! Is that true?" I could have chosen to walk away but instead I just looked at him and said "That's drunk in recovery to you - I'll be happy to talk to you later in private if you want." Turned on my heel and went about my duties.
I don't let things fester and stew - I don't have enough room in my head to let other people rent space there. In fact I often don't think of work at all when I am not there.
So can't we just retire NETY and move on with the knowledge that there are jerks everywhere.
Peace and Namaste
Hppy

BBM This is a tired trope. People have been offended for millennia, and have been offended by everything, and have been telling others about it. This is nothing new. I think it's a massive simplification to claim that in contemporary society, which can be extrapolated into the experience of nursing, it's "differences of opinion" over which people are offended. Or, that people complain over being bullied and/or offended for being different. I think it's healthy that we, as a society, are having to grapple publicly with the consequences of old cultural norms of being able to treat people who may fall outside of those cultural norms with bigotry, prejudice, racism, intolerance and derision. A difference of opinion is a matter of how to hang a roll of toilet paper. But speaking up for one's self (as you did) should be celebrated and what we need is more pushback against those who have felt entitled to bully and abuse in order to maintain the status quo. Railing against "PC culture" is harkening to an era when people felt entitled to abuse, bully and demean others with impunity. We should all want those days to be over.

OrganizedChaos, LVN · Jun 10, 2017

NETY is still a problem some places. People will stop talking about it when it stops happening to them.

Bullying is an issue, period. Why focus on just one faucet of it? Why is it *so* much more important than any other types of bullying? When someone answers me that with a legit & logical answer, "NETY" can stick around.

Susie2310 · Jun 10, 2017

Bullying is an issue, period. Why focus on just one faucet of it? Why is it *so* much more important than any other types of bullying? When someone answers me that with a legit & logical answer, "NETY" can stick around.

It's not more important than other types of bullying. It (NETY) just gets talked about quite a lot on here, but people talk about other types of bullying too. All types of bullying are important.

amzyRN · Jun 10, 2017

BBM This is a tired trope. People have been offended for millennia, and have been offended by everything, and have been telling others about it. This is nothing new. I think it's a massive simplification to claim that in contemporary society, which can be extrapolated into the experience of nursing, it's "differences of opinion" over which people are offended. Or, that people complain over being bullied and/or offended for being different. I think it's healthy that we, as a society, are having to grapple publicly with the consequences of old cultural norms of being able to treat people who may fall outside of those cultural norms with bigotry, prejudice, racism, intolerance and derision. A difference of opinion is a matter of how to hang a roll of toilet paper. But speaking up for one's self (as you did) should be celebrated and what we need is more pushback against those who have felt entitled to bully and abuse in order to maintain the status quo. Railing against "PC culture" is harkening to an era when people felt entitled to abuse, bully and demean others with impunity. We should all want those days to be over.

I disagree with some of what you say. PC attitudes (without real genuine concern) and "snowflake" like behavior is a more recent phenomenon (Millennials) than in older generations. When I went to college we didn't have "safe spaces" and "trigger warnings" and all that crap. We could have a real conversation and not be worried that an offended party would try to get us kicked out of school because we did not use the correct pronoun by mistake.

I am not saying prejudice, racism, sexism, ageism, or any other flavor of discrimination should ever be tolerated, which is why I can understand some "older" nurses are offended by a generalization such as "NETY". Bullying needs to be addressed, should not be tolerated by employers or workplace culture and it takes a collaborative effort to do it.

guest974915 · Jun 10, 2017

How can we as nurses be patient advocates if we don't stand up for ourselves. It's like not calling a rude doctor because something is wrong with the patient. I think it's challenging to stand up and refuse to accept disrespect, but is often necessary. It used to be very difficult for me to stand up to physicians, but I made myself do it for patients and if I can advocate for patients, I can advocate for myself. Advocating for respect for yourself does not have to be this big deal and can be done very respectfully and is a skill that is learned by practice.
Additionally, not taking small slights personally is also a skill, like accepting criticism. Another poster mentioned that there is a difference between a strict preceptor who might not be warm and fuzzy who wants their student to succeed versus someone who is trying to make their student fail. I had a really strict preceptor who was not very "nice" but she was helpful and wanted me to succeed and so she pushed me. At times I wanted to cry because it was so hard. She was one of the best nurses clinically that I have ever worked with. I learned a lot from her and I am a better nurse from the experience. My point is that there is a difference between strictness, straight forward communication, not being warm and fuzzy and blatant disrespectful undermining behavior which creates a hostile work environment.

amzyRN, I agree to a point with you and do feel that we, as professionals, should be able to stand up for ourselves. However, in a depressed economy with limited other available nursing positions, that single parent is probably going to think twice about being so bold in confronting such behaviors from a tyrant doctor or bully nurse who both may yield a great deal of power. The act of not turning the other cheek, perhaps justified, may ultimately be his or her ticket to the unemployment line. I've found as with so much of life, there is the way it should be and the way it really is.

OrganizedChaos, LVN · Jun 10, 2017

It's not more important than other types of bullying. It (NETY) just gets talked about quite a lot on here, but people talk about other types of bullying too. All types of bullying are important.

Bringing "NETY" up constantly & consistently makes it seem that it is more important than any other form of bullying. Why is "NETY" brought up all the time & not just bullying or harassment in general? Where is all the discussion about that? Where are the threads about that? All I see are threads after threads about "NETY". What does that say?

amzyRN · Jun 10, 2017

amzyRN, I agree to a point with you and do feel that we, as professionals, should be able to stand up for ourselves. However, in a depressed economy with limited other available nursing positions, that single parent is probably going to think twice about being so bold in confronting such behaviors from a tyrant doctor or bully nurse who both may yield a great deal of power. The act of not turning the other cheek, perhaps justified, may ultimately be his or her ticket to the unemployment line. I've found as with so much of life, there is the way it should be and the way it really is.

I think a lot of it is communication skill. To tell someone, a doctor for example "I needed to call you because I'm worried about a patient or I'm trying to advocate for my patient" or something else to that effect, I have found through experience, usually causes a pause in a negative tone. I have had a cardiologist come up to the floor where I was working and apologize to me because he was rude on the phone. I explained to him that I needed to be able to talk to him about patients because that was my job and if he has a negative attitude that makes it difficult.

A simple statement like "your comments make me feel uncomfortable, can you please (insert desired behavior)" bringing it back to patient care (patient care suffers in a hostile environment). If these very neutral statements are enough to get someone fired it's time to find a new job anyway. Most places who have these toxic environments don't want to lose any staff at all, so I don't think it's a huge risk to demand (or politely request) some respect.

If a person is really working in a toxic environment where they are truly being bullied, undermined, and targeted, I would highly suggest getting out ASAP.

Sometimes just a heart to heart in private with someone alone to explain how their behavior made one feel can be enough to give someone pause and can cause changes in behavior. It's worth a try.

Susie2310 · Jun 10, 2017

Bringing "NETY" up constantly & consistently makes it seem that it is more important than any other form of bullying. Why is "NETY" brought up all the time & not just bullying or harassment in general? Where is all the discussion about that? Where are the threads about that? All I see are threads after threads about "NETY". What does that say?

My guess is NETY is brought up often because it is what the posters believe they are experiencing and they want to discuss this/ask for help, or they want to educate themselves about this particular type of bullying.