A coworker was stunned to go into a room and find a parent watching an pro-terrorism, anti-America, anti-Semitic video. Allegedly, it was calling for the destruction of the president, America, Jews. She was horrified at the content and even more so horrified that the parent was watching in front of the child, and didn't seem to care if she heard.
She called Risk Management who said there was nothing to do, because it would be a violation of HIPAA.
I felt DCS should have been called because it is emotionally abusive to subject a child to hate speech. (we're talking actual hate speech, here). She was going to consult with a social worker on this aspect.
I also suggested she make an anonymous FBI and/or Homeland Security tip.
Many christian parents indoctrinate their children with their beliefs from a very young age yet no one raises an eye brow
Oh, I know. I have had school classmates (when I was younger of course) and young family members that were indoctrinated with views that I disagree with. It is super frustrating, but it is not my place to step in when a parent is teaching his/her child to be homophobic, or, heck, even preaching anti-Semitic rhetoric.
Specializes in Psych, Addictions, SOL (Student of Life).
I agree with you, but I just think there is a difference between animated violent video games, and an actual person encouraging actual violence against an actual specific person or specific group of people. I am going to research, but I don't believe this type of speech is actually constitutionally protected.
It is actually constitutionally protected - Free speech cases that reach the supreme court are decided on a case by case basis there is plenty of case law going all the way back to the 60's with regard to this. Also did you know that free speech protections do not carry into the private sector. I found this out last year when a friend was fired for saying something about our employer on the internet and she tried to argue free speech and lost.
Teens are going into schools and killing their peers, and doctors caring for gymnasts are abusing them.
Who can tell which ones are really dangerous and who is safe?
Until anyone has an answer for that, suspicious behavior should be monitored and reported. Unless you are one of those people who don't get concerned about a backpack left on a train.
Until it explodes of course, and the everyone blames everyone else for not reporting it.
We are talking about something a lot different than the unattended backpack on a train, or someone looking at instructions for how to build a bomb.
Better examples:
I was watching an episode of Law and Order SVU with a friend. On that episode, a male high school student just over the age of consent had sex with a female classmate who was just under the age of consent. When interviewing the male, the detective said "no, that means you are a pedophile and a sexual predator..." (I certainly don't want to get into a debate of whether or not the guy's behavior qualifies him as a "predator," but it is a crime.) One of the people I was watching with, a friend of a friend, said, "that is ridiculous. I understand the they have to go after him, but it was just 2 high school students being high school students." If we go by the "be on the safe side" standard, I should probably report him for advocating statutory rape. It's probably nothing, but it is true that we would all feel terrible if this guy ends up being a pedophile and we didn't report it.
Another example...a patient is watching news coverage of a neo Nazi rally. Someone from the rally is interview and advocates violence towards Jews. As he says this, the patient grins and nods his head. Do we report the patient? It's a terrible thought that the pt agrees with this goon on TV, do we consider that as advocating violence (or a threat of future violence)?
I just think saying "well, you never know what someone will do," is not enough to report someone based on otherwise circumstantial evidence.
What if the patient is an historian, and they are reading "Mein Kampf "?
What if the patient is an historian and they are reading "The Gulag Archipelago"?
What if the patient's parent doesn't actually believe in the views they are watching, but are trying to get a sense of how the "other side" thinks?
I have patients who are on the other side of the aisle from me, politically. I think some of their beliefs are foolish and despicable. Do I get to shut off their TV and radio?
At what point have we crossed the line into censorship and thought control?
My job as a nurse is to give quality care regardless of my agreement with the patient's every belief.
A coworker was stunned to go into a room and find a parent watching an pro-terrorism, anti-America, anti-Semitic video. Allegedly, it was calling for the destruction of the president, America, Jews. She was horrified at the content and even more so horrified that the parent was watching in front of the child, and didn't seem to care if she heard.
She called Risk Management who said there was nothing to do, because it would be a violation of HIPAA.
I felt DCS should have been called because it is emotionally abusive to subject a child to hate speech. (we're talking actual hate speech, here). She was going to consult with a social worker on this aspect.
I also suggested she make an anonymous FBI and/or Homeland Security tip.
Please discuss.
We are all allowed to watch whatever we want. We can listen to whatever we want. Its disturbing. I'm also disturbed when people are watching Fox News, but I don't do anything other than provide the care they need.
1. You can't really control what a family member does, other than asking them to leave the room...and even then, you'd have to have a stronger case than "I didn't like the video they were watching." However, if this issue bothers you to the point that you feel it would affect the patient's care, you can ask to be assigned elsewhere.
2. Risk management really can't do anything in this case unless, as another member was saying, said family member was actively planning a terror attack or constructing a DIY bomb.
3. You said it yourself:
I think it is subjective on whether it is emotionally abusive or not to subject children to it.
Considering that you can tune to most channels on television, fire up YouTube, or grab a popular video game and be subject to something full of hate, sex, drugs, violence and gore, at times so graphic it's bordering on an X-rating, where does the line get drawn? When does it go from being entertainment--however questionable--to abuse? When there's a certain level of these elements present? When the characters in the show based on real people instead of fictional and/or cartoon characters? When someone--you, me, anyone--is offended?
It IS subjective. For every one who thinks that one of these is potentially abusive to the child, there's another who doesn't think that in the least. And both can provide good arguments as to why it is or isn't. But who is right?
If you are TRULY concerned about the potential actions of this family member and the child's welfare, nothing is stopping you from contacting CPS/Homeland Security/whoever.
Specializes in Med/Surg/Infection Control/Geriatrics.
More importantly, I would have notified Law Enforcement and given them a heads up. They always want to know about stuff like that. As far as HIPAA goes, I'm not so sure about that. It's not like you are telling them a diagnosis, or demographics, or medical information. This is a safety and security issue.
I'd be curious to know what station aired that. Those are the folks that law enforcement would probably want to speak with.
We are constantly told that if you see something, say something. With all the bombings, school shootings, etc, I would report it.
I agree. If you are overreacting, the authorities can inform you.
There is a lot of media fueled extremism these days. Many losers will only gain acclaim via the internet if they do something shocking and outrageous. It's feeding into all these unbalanced and angry men and their delusions. The public needs to be on guard.
Specializes in Mental Health, Gerontology, Palliative.
So how do you tell the difference?
Teens are going into schools and killing their peers, and doctors caring for gymnasts are abusing them.
Who can tell which ones are really dangerous and who is safe?
Until anyone has an answer for that, suspicious behavior should be monitored and reported. Unless you are one of those people who don't get concerned about a backpack left on a train.
Until it explodes of course, and the everyone blames everyone else for not reporting it.
Its a case of being damm sure before you act.
I would imagine incase of the lad who got taken in for investigation for downloading an al qadea training manual it could have been easy to find out what he was studying and where the material was downloaded from.
I would also imagine a certain amount of racial profiling was going on. Eg all someone saw was a lad who was a young adult, of muslim descent who was accessing al quadea material there for he must be a budding terrorist
What if the patient is an historian, and they are reading "Mein Kampf "?
What if the patient is an historian and they are reading "The Gulag Archipelago"?
At what point have we crossed the line into censorship and thought control?
My job as a nurse is to give quality care regardless of my agreement with the patient's every belief.
I'm not going to go run and "tell".
This is not about reading historical books, its about propaganda, which is focused on initiating terrorist activity.
I've read The Gulag Archipelago and also other books that are accounts of life in concentration camps, such as books by Corrie ten Boom and Deitrich Bonhoeffer.
The key word here is 'history' the are accounts of bad things that happened in the past.
The pro-terror video is about the future and planning bad things.
And as regards your comment about NOT running to tell -
If you use public transit, every network has a public safety message that states "If you see something, say something."
Bombs explode when people don't follow that advice.
I spent decades in Europe and have seen the outcome for myself.
The "its none of my business" theory allow bad things to happen and it costs lives.
We are mandatory reporters, if you suspect (not have proof or confirmation just suspect) abuse of a patient you are required to contact DCF. This is not a HIPPA violation and can be done anonymously. It's your ethics call to decide if you suspect abuse. If you report something to social work and they don't follow through, your reporting mandate has not been fulfilled. You are responsible for assuring authorities are notified.
But it's not a he said she said kind of thing... DCF can't do anything with a report of what you told them your coworker told you... it's up to her to report it if she believes it should be based on what she witnessed. This is why social work rarely reports suspected abuse claims... it is a very rare legitimate case of "it's not my job".
You can't delegate this. As for the department of homeland security... they already know, don't worry.
psu_213, BSN, RN
3,878 Posts
Oh, I know. I have had school classmates (when I was younger of course) and young family members that were indoctrinated with views that I disagree with. It is super frustrating, but it is not my place to step in when a parent is teaching his/her child to be homophobic, or, heck, even preaching anti-Semitic rhetoric.