i would like some opinions on my experience. I am filing a grievance with my school because I am being failed for clinical. This was my first semester of nursing for an associates degree. I passed all written test with a B and the final skills again however I was failed for clinical.
I had a feeling right from the beginning that my instructor did not like me for some reason. The way she talked to me. On our first day of clinical my instructor failed to explain certain rules such as where to use our phones if we receive an important call she said to take them “off the floor”. She said that what”happens in clinical stays in clinical “ whatever that means and sent an email to our group stating this. I was having an issue with doing an assignment and my instructor was not around the second week of my semester and I asked another instructor for help. The instructor told me that my instructor was not doing the assignment correctly and she asked to speak with the instructor when she came in. I am not sure if I got my instructor in trouble or not. That was not my intention. She later sent out an email that night stating that what happens in clinical stays in clinical . I felt like this might have started the getting off on the wrong foot type of thing. I was using my phone one day and my instructor told me that I was using it in the wrong area and was very upset with me. I apologized and told her I thought I was off the floor and I didn’t know where I should be using it. My instructor pulled me aside the next day and told me I was failing clinical. When I asked what for she told me that it was for using my phone in the wrong area , for being late once (I was), and also because I seemed “disinterested” . I thought that was a very subjective reason to fail me so I asked her is there anything I did wrong to make her feel that way. She told me she saw me sitting down in lab one day for a few minutes. I explained to her that I have a chronic illness and my legs hurt from time to time and we had been standing that day for five hours without a break. She said “ok well we all have our problems I just need to see more interest from you”. I felt we response was harsh and not very understanding and I just got a bad feeling and thought she was treating me this way in relation to the assignment I might have gotten her into trouble for so I asked to meet with the nursing director.
I met with the director and told her about what was going on . I told her I didn’t like the way my instructor spoke to me condescendingly and also how when I told her about my issue with my legs she didn’t respond very compassionately. The director told me to make sure I am on time in the future and to maybe explain in more detail to my instructor what is going on with my health and she would also talk to my instructor about her treatment towards me. I thought that it was none of my isntructors business about my health , I had already given her enough information and I did not want to make it seem like I was throwing a pity party. But I did get an accommodation from my school, even though we aren’t required to stand in lab, that said I would need frequent breaks for my legs. I never heard back from the director about her meeting with my instructor but I was told about two weeks later that I was getting a clinical warning. I showed up to the meeting and was given a warning for :
1) being late once
2) being on my phone in wrong area
3) sitting down in lab and it says I was on my phone (I don’t remember exactly what I was doing but I know I was taking a break) apparently we can’t have phones in lab I did not know this
4) a patient I had was found with “her pants around her ankles and I could not be found anywhere “
i said that I accepted the other three things but this was the first I was hearing about this patient. I asked if there was a call light left with the patient and if it was verified if the patient pulled her pants down herself. The director looked at my instructor and asked her this and my instructor shook her head no and threw her hands up like she didn’t know. I then said well why should I be given a warning for something not verified? The director then said that I need to still take responsibility for my patients even if I did not pull her pants down. I thought this was ridiculous. She also said perhaps I should tell someone where I’m going if im going to be away from the patient for a long time. I told her that I was never told this and patients are left alone for sometimes half an hour and I was gone 10-15 mins at most . Nothing was said and I was still given this warning.
I was given a second warning because a patient complained about me and a cna having an innapropriate conversation. The cna was talking to me about her boyfriend getting a vasectomy in front of a patient and I did not know what to do or say so I kept changing the subject. I did not report this because I did not want it to come back on to me from the cna and receive any kind of retaliation from the CNA. My instructor went to speak with the patient I believe and then notified the director of this. I explained that I was not told what I should do in this type of situation and it wasn’t until later in the semester that we were told to report these things to our instructor . I was told it was common sense to have reported this or told the cna she was behaving innapropriately. I disagreed.
Another patient complained that I “didn’t know what I was doing” and didn’t want me back. The previous day I had been caring for this patient heavily medicated on narcotics and she was in a very bad mood. She wanted me to leave her alone most of the time, would not let me assess her completely, kept asking for pain medication when it wasn’t due, and became upset when a bandage she had been getting from a cna was not given to her by me. I couldn’t give it to her because the bandage needed an order and the cna was giving it without one. I spoke to the nurse on duty and she said the bandage was innapropriate for her foot which just had dry skin on it. I told her this and she became upset. I told my instructor how can a patient claim to know that I don’t know what I’m doing if their not a doctor or nurse? I told her her complaint was vague and that she just wanted something I couldn’t give her. My instructor said well I will get more information. She came back and told me well the patient said that you didn’t assess her fully and really if your patient was in a bad mood like you said you should have came to me. I said “well you never told me to report on a patients mood this is the first I’m hearing of this so why should I be written up for this?” And she told me she had to report it anyways. It was true that the patient would only let me listen to her lungs to a certain extent because she was in a bad mood . I documented this on my clinical sheet but I did not report it to my instructor.
I met with the director again and told her that I was having issues communicating with my instructor still. I told her that she had become so rude that I didn’t feel comfortable speaking to her at all Especially when she was rude in front of my peers to me. I told her that I am being failed for things that were not communicated to me. She said well you are being given another clinical warning but you still have a week left of class and if you meet the objectives you may still pass. She didn’t say anything about how my instructor was acting and said she had a meeting to go to. I was given another warning. This time I brought a support person who was there for support but also really to be a witness to this all. He was from the school in a different department. He told me it seemed like they were failing me for petty reasons and for things that were not communicated to me.
I was walking in school one day and someone told me that I was not supposed to have mace on my key ring. A security guard came and took it away. I apologized and said I didn’t know because it was legal everywhere else. This week was the last week of clinical and my instructor said I did very well and met all the objectives. She told me I would pass clinical. I went for my clinical evelauation however and the director told me I failed! She said she had given it thought and decided that overall looking at the semester as a whole I had not met the objectives. They also brought up the mace. I said well I did not bring it to clinical and it was an honest mistake and I was also told that if I met these objectives by a certain date I would pass! I was told sorry but the decision has been made.
I filed a grievance with the school and I also went to my clinical location. I asked to see the complaints against me. I was told by the director there that she only deals with the school because of HIPA and also that the complaints are verbal and that nothing was written down. I think that I shouldn’t be failed based on basically hearsay then if that’s the truth! My aunt who is a nurse said that the director there could have been telling me the truth because incident reports are only written over serious things but she also said maybe you should go back and have a witness to hear her say that they don’t write things down on patients complaints. I still have the other things against me which I don’t know if that’s enough to fail me over but am I right to think that they can’t fail me if these things weren’t written down? I know that the way it happened with the complaints is that a nurse passed a message on to staff for the following day about the complaint. The staff that day then told my instructor about it . Then I believe my instructor spoke to the patient . Then my instructor called the director or texted her about it. There could possibly be a text about what my instructor heard from the patient that was sent to the director but that’s it! Unless this director of the clinical is lying to me and it is written down somewhere . What do you think?
As someone said above, you got off on the wrong foot and stayed there. As I read your account, I, too, am uncomfortable with your performance. Everyone (other nurses, your instructors, etc.) are just people and no one is perfect. None of the people you work with: you future managers, etc., are going to manage you perfectly, like a TV lawyer. You need to bring your own common sense and not rely on others to tell you exactly how to behave professionally.
Your instructors are acting on how uncomfortable your performance is making them and their efforts to get you off the floor are imprecise and not exactly perfect. I would not want to be responsible for managing you and would not trust you to care for my loved one, and no one at your school is interested in taking on that kind of liability. There is literally no good reason for them to support you at this point.
Yes, expectations were poorly communicated: "what happens on the unit stays on the unit" was not clear to you. Unfortunately, telling you to grow up, take responsibility, be engaged, and behave professionally is also vague and probably not helpful to you. But that is how life is.
I get what you all are saying about the phone. However I saw other students using their phone and they were not being reprimanded. I didntt ask where to use my phone I just saw where other people were using their phone and followed what I saw others were doing. I apologized for using my phone in the wrong area when I was told I was in the wrong area. It was apparent that the instructor was treating me differently but then I had to prove it. In one of the meetings in which I brought a person as a witness I said to the instructor “I feel like you are treating me differently than other students. You have yelled at me in front of my peers. You don’t do that with other students. Other students have also been late and I don’t see you yell at them but you have yelled at me for being late once “. The director turned to the instructor and said “well now, you won’t be doing that to her anymore now will you?” And my instructor said “no I won’t”. I took that as her acknowledging that she was treating me differently. The person I brought with me to the meeting also noticed this. As far as the woman being left in a wheelchair I don’t feel like I was gone for as long as this instructor claims I was. I think I was trying to help a few other patients and perhaps while this instructor was looking for me she had missed me.
I understand about what one poster is saying about telling my instructor about the problem with my legs before hand. I don’t think I would need to tell anyone as my legs only start hurting after several hours of being on my feet. On this particular night lab ran for five hours instead of how long it had usually been running which was a couple hours. I needed to take a break. It doesn’t say anything in our handbook about the necessity of standing at all times during lab, but most people do choose to stand. I didn’t notify anyone about my Illness because I didnt want it to look like I was asking for special treatment. I saw the way my instructor was treating me and I didn’t want to make things worse. I think that as a nurse, my instructor could have easily asked “is there a reason your sitting down ?” Instead of assuming I am disinterested and writing me up for it. We were ironically learning about objective and subjective data that week. I was told by the person that wrote an accommodation about me taking a break that legally I don’t need an accommodation and the faculty are just giving me a hard time for no reason it seems, because it doesn’t state anywhere that anyone needs to stand in lab.
Yes I was late once and I took responsibility for that. I saw two other people who were also late and they weren’t reprimanded as far as I saw. As far as a patient complaining, my aunt is a nurse and she said that she would receive complaints all day from patients in nursing homes. I wanted to go down to the clinical and see the complaint for myself and decide if this was a legitimate complaint and see how it was worded. I went there only to find that the nursing home does not record patient complaints. From my understanding for a complaint to be used in court it needs to be documented. I think think the same would apply for dismissing someone from a program, but I’m not a lawyer. It would seem unethical and unprofessional to dismiss a student from a program based on an undocumented complaint.
Alex, I think you misunderstood what the instructor was trying to say when she said “what happens in clinical stays in clinical”. Yes, patient confidentiality is important and that should be the purpose of saying something like that. I was asking about an assignment however, that had nothing to do with HIPA. I found out that my instructor had been doing the assignment wrong when I asked another instructor about it . Let me point out that this was an assignment that other instructors were doing as well with students in other clinicals. She was reprimanded about this in front of me, I don’t know if she got into further trouble however. How was I supposed to know that my instructor was not doing an assignment correctly? I assumed that her saying “what happens in clinical stays in clinical” meant to respect HIPA. My instructor later sent out an email that night stating that we all had to do the assignment the way the rest of the school was doing it and reminded us “what happens in clinical stays in clinical”. So she was communicating that everything that happens in clinical stays in clinical. I spoke with someone else from another department about this email and they said that it is unprofessional to tell your students apart from HIPA to keep everything confidential from clinical because it implies that if you are having an issue with your instructor that she does not want you talking about your experience with others. I felt very much this way when she sent out the email, like it was a bit threatening.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
I don't think you get it, Misscruella. You are still making excuses. You got off on the wrong foot with your instructor, but you made the choice to stay on the wrong foot. Please read back over the responses you've gotten -- hopefully you will learn something that will help you going forward.
I understand thay I got off on the wrong foot. I think it’s also clear that the instructor behaved in an unprofessional manner. People do make mistakes, this is school after all. I was targeted after I made a couple mistakes and watched as other people made far worse mistakes and were passed. If I had to do it all over again I would have apologized to my instructor and assured her that I did not intend to get her in trouble. If she continued to treat me differently than other students, failing me after she failed to communicate certain things (and yes I think it should be communicated that I need to sign off with a particular person if I am away from my patient for a certain amount of time, I have never worked in the health care field before and I am a student) , then at that point I would have asked to be transferred to a different clinical location.
I think this post has gotten a little off track though, I am trying to do a grade appeal with the school. I would Iike it that my failing grade is not shown on my transcripts so I can get into other schools. I don’t think I want to continue at this school since the same thing could happen over again at this school. In order to do this I have to prove certain things. My instructor has said that there were patient complaints made, the perhaps biggest reason for the clinical failure and this complaint would constitute a failure based on safety. Having this on my transcripts would make it possibly unlikely for other schools to admit me. But there is no record with the clinical site of these patient complaints. I am wondering if the only record they have is my instructors correspondence with the director ,if they can still say I failed clinical for unsafe conduct. I am concerned that the complaints were not how the instructor claimed them to be. It is important for my future to figure this out so if someone could answer this question I would appreciate it
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
23 minutes ago, Misscruella said:
I understand thay I got off on the wrong foot. I think it’s also clear that the instructor behaved in an unprofessional manner. People do make mistakes, this is school after all. I was targeted after I made a couple mistakes and watched as other people made far worse mistakes and were passed. If I had to do it all over again I would have apologized to my instructor and assured her that I did not intend to get her in trouble. If she continued to treat me differently than other students, failing me after she failed to communicate certain things (and yes I think it should be communicated that I need to sign off with a particular person if I am away from my patient for a certain amount of time, I have never worked in the health care field before and I am a student) , then at that point I would have asked to be transferred to a different clinical location.
I think this post has gotten a little off track though, I am trying to do a grade appeal with the school. I would Iike it that my failing grade is not shown on my transcripts so I can get into other schools. I don’t think I want to continue at this school since the same thing could happen over again at this school. In order to do this I have to prove certain things. My instructor has said that there were patient complaints made, the perhaps biggest reason for the clinical failure and this complaint would constitute a failure based on safety. Having this on my transcripts would make it possibly unlikely for other schools to admit me. But there is no record with the clinical site of these patient complaints. I am wondering if the only record they have is my instructors correspondence with the director ,if they can still say I failed clinical for unsafe conduct. I am concerned that the complaints were not how the instructor claimed them to be. It is important for my future to figure this out so if someone could answer this question I would appreciate it
Perhaps you can talk to your instructor about what will appear on your transcript. I don't think there is any way to know without knowing what your instructor turned in for your grade.
As far as other schools, that sounds like a great idea.
If I could leave you with one more piece of advice, here it is: If people like you, they will forgive you more easily. I've seen people get away with huge mistakes that have gotten other people fired -- because the people that were fired weren't well-liked and the person that got away with it was liked. It's not fair, but that's the way it is in work, and in school. Make an effort to be friendly, kind and humble with everyone you meet at school and in your work. If you get off on the wrong foot with someone, talk to them about it. As suggested upthread, most people will give you another chance if you're honest. Behave as if you like everyone, even if you can't stand them. Keep your phone out of sight and make an effort to be visible and look fascinated in school, in the lab and at clinical. This is advice that I could have used when I was starting my nursing career -- and I hope I would have paid attention to it.
I was asking about an assignment however, that had nothing to do with HIPA. I found out that my instructor had been doing the assignment wrong when I asked another instructor about it . Let me point out that this was an assignment that other instructors were doing as well with students in other clinicals. She was reprimanded about this in front of me, I don’t know if she got into further trouble however. How was I supposed to know that my instructor was not doing an assignment correctly? I assumed that her saying “what happens in clinical stays in clinical” meant to respect HIPA. My instructor later sent out an email that night stating that we all had to do the assignment the way the rest of the school was doing it and reminded us “what happens in clinical stays in clinical”. So she was communicating that everything that happens in clinical stays in clinical.
The "What happens in clinical, stays in clinical" comment was for the fact that she knew how the assignment was suppose to be done, but chose to do it differently. She wanted the students to do the assignment her way and not say anything to other students outside the clinical or other faculty. You talked to another instructor and got your instructor in trouble.
The "What happens in clinical, stays in clinical" comment was for the fact that she knew how the assignment was suppose to be done, but chose to do it differently. She wanted the students to do the assignment her way and not say anything to other students outside the clinical or other faculty. You talked to another instructor and got your instructor in trouble.
Well, according to the standards to which we proudly proclaim to hold ourselves, no this incident does not represent the student [getting the] instructor in trouble.
The instructor made a choice - for what reason, we don't know. And when it was very incidentally discovered, the instructor found herself having to answer for that. That is all. Sheesh, she was an incredibly crappy example of how to behave when you discover you are mistaken, to boot. She sounds pretty novice to me, actually. Either that or just perpetually immature and insecure.
Separate from all of that...
Misscruella, regardless of the outcome of this situation, your potential future career as a nurse hinges upon you stepping up. All this phone business [... etc., etc.] is unacceptable. You aren't going to be told every right and wrong move to make as a nurse or as a human being. If you want to be a nurse, then you should be able to use a set of independently-acquired facts to determine that time spent on your phone during clinical is not well-spent unless there is an emergency that requires it. It is not unreasonable to have your aptitude for nursing judged at least to some extent on whether you can figure out simple things like that.
I suggest taking full responsibility for your missteps and talking with the nursing dean to acknowledge these things and see if you can sort of start afresh (beg for mercy). You could consult someone to see whether you have any legal rights/recourse regarding all of this, but it may very well be a waste given your portion of culpability in the matter.
I was a little surprised at all the supportive responses to the OP in the beginning of the thread. The entire post came off to me as a whole bunch of excuses and rationalizations for why you were doing things you shouldn't have been doing. The one thing I can agree with you on is the instructor using you seem disinterested as a reason to fail you. That is entirely subjective and not quantifiable. But using your phone anywhere you could be seen, being unavailable and not informing somebody you would be off the floor and sitting down in a setting where you were clearly expected to on your feet and engaged in some lab activity without first discussing it with your lab instructor are all valid reasons to fail on their own. Taken together I really don't think you have a good argument for an appeal. I could be wrong, but if not take this as a learning experience and improve your communication skills going forward.
Specializes in Mental Health, Gerontology, Palliative.
Unfortunately the instructors are the ones with the power, the students have no power. Shouldnt be like that, but it is
I had an experience in my second year, an instructor asked me what I would do if I was unsure about a doctors prescribing. I said something along the lines of I would ring the doctor, and ask for clarification "excuse me Dr I am calling to clarify the order for patient X, it appears you have charted ABC is that correct"
This instructor took this to mean I was ringing the doctor to tell them that I was wrong, and then proceeded to pull out a PIP that I had to do in order to stay in the program. I had always been taught that if you are unsure of a Drs order, always clarify, alas, thats not what that instructor heard. i forget what I had to do to complete the PIP but i did it and all was forgotten except I attempted to avoid this instructor like the plague, as she has a tendency to do this to other students. Failed a student on their careplan because they used the PEWS (paediatric early warning signs) scale instead of the EWS (early warning signs)
Unfortunately often nursing school is alot of putting your head down and playing the game, because if you attempt to challenge the system often all that happens is you get a large target on your back that puts your likelyhood of completing nursing school in jeopardy.
Other experience was failing my year two nursing care plan. When I took it to the marker prior to resubmitting it, she said and I quote "this is much better" which I took to mean 'this is a passing effort'. Long story short, I failed the resubmit as well due to some really petty reasons. As a good academic record no previous resubmits I applied for a second resubmit only to be declined on the grounds it was felt I had insufficentr knowledge for a year 2 nursing student, despite five clinical reviews by experienced RNS that said "Tenebrae has very good clinical knowledge for a year two nursing student".
Another classmate who was in the same position as me applied for the resubmit and got granted it
my experience of nursing school sucked. And when I realised that fighting against the system was only going to get me kicked out I just put my head down and learned how to play the game
There was a girl in my BSN program whose grade fell below a B average in one class and they asked her to leave the program. She went before the board and jumped through all the hoops and she was accepted into the cohort behind mine. She was still friendly with some of the students from my cohort and she asked someone to critique a paper for her and they did...the instructor ran it through “turn it in” and she got dinged for plagiarism...game over! She then applied and got accepted into an LPN program with the hope of bridging to RN and was doing very well (she knew a lot from previous classes). A fellow student in that program reported she was cheating, and the woman who reported her said she threatened her and was afraid, once again this girl ended up getting kicked out. Now she is starting an ADN program...if things would have worked out in the first place she would’ve been working as a nurse for almost four years now! I applaud her tenacity, don’t know all the details but trying to be successful and get through nursing school is no joke! It could always be worse! Good luck!?
What is the policy on purse/clinical failing , can you retake one course while in the program? Or are you dismissed from the program with this one failure?
Alex_RN, BSN
335 Posts
As someone said above, you got off on the wrong foot and stayed there. As I read your account, I, too, am uncomfortable with your performance. Everyone (other nurses, your instructors, etc.) are just people and no one is perfect. None of the people you work with: you future managers, etc., are going to manage you perfectly, like a TV lawyer. You need to bring your own common sense and not rely on others to tell you exactly how to behave professionally.
Your instructors are acting on how uncomfortable your performance is making them and their efforts to get you off the floor are imprecise and not exactly perfect. I would not want to be responsible for managing you and would not trust you to care for my loved one, and no one at your school is interested in taking on that kind of liability. There is literally no good reason for them to support you at this point.
Yes, expectations were poorly communicated: "what happens on the unit stays on the unit" was not clear to you. Unfortunately, telling you to grow up, take responsibility, be engaged, and behave professionally is also vague and probably not helpful to you. But that is how life is.