expelled for academic dishonesty

Published

If a person gets expelled from a nursing program for academic dishonesty, what are the chances fo being accepted into another program. The teacher saw a cell phone on th desk but the screen was locked and blank after passing by she came back and asked the student to open the phone and it showed the student had opened the browser with information for notes relatd to the test.

Cheating is looked down up, especially in those of the healthcare professions.

1) We are dealing with people's lives here. If you can't be bothered to study and learn how to be a competent nurse, and someone dies as a result of that lack of knowledge, it places a black mark on the nursing profession. Nursing teachers have the obligation to protect the public by failing incompetent nursing students.

2) This sort of unethical behavior breeds more unethical behavior. If they get away with it this time, then these kinds of people are more likely to falsify documentation and cover up medication errors. Again, more trouble that can be avoided by disqualifying these kinds of people.

Ethics is probably one of the main standards of the nursing profession. If someone fails that standard, nursing teachers have every right to deny them entry to the profession. Of course that cheating student has the right to apply to another program or college, but the chances of getting in are slim, with that student being on probation upon admission.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

So does anyone know if this person was actually cheating? Of course it was a stupid mistake, but maybe they were studying before class on their phone and that was the last screen on. I know my phone stays on the last screen, so I could see that potentially happening (other than having the phone out because mine is always put away during tests). It just seems like people are a little too judgy and maybe it was a stupid mistake.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Private Practice- wellness center.
So does anyone know if this person was actually cheating? Of course it was a stupid mistake, but maybe they were studying before class on their phone and that was the last screen on. I know my phone stays on the last screen, so I could see that potentially happening (other than having the phone out because mine is always put away during tests). It just seems like people are a little too judgy and maybe it was a stupid mistake.

Then why even take the chance of having the phone ON YOUR DESK? Sorry, but to quote Forrest Gump here, "stupid is as stupid does." NO ONE in the right minds has anything on their desk that would make it appear as if he/she were cheating. Heck, in my class, I can't even have my water bottle on the desk while taking a quiz or exam. Only #2 pencils- this was explained to my class in NO uncertain terms. It is also spelled out in every syllabus that we get that NOTHING is to be on our desks while taking an exam, and that academic dishonesty will result in expulsion. If someone, be they 21 or 51, doesn't have the foresight to think of that, then I sure don't want them using their judgement on ME as a patient of theirs.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

Emily, I have to have a fee more posts before I can reply to your pm, however I don't mind posting it here and hope you won't mind either ( hopefully we won't be blacklisted lol)

I find this forum is just like any other on the Internet. It is a GREAT forum and has a wealth of intelligent conversations and helpful information. Because it is written instead of spoken it is hard to judge emotion and intention. It isn't enough sometimes to write "yes I see your point and find it valid, however here is my opinion and I hope you have the same respect"

Just to clear it up once again! Emily and I are NOT trying to say that cheating is excusable. By college level all students should understand there will be harsh consequences for their actions. We were trying to make the point that sometimes there are REASONS that people cheat (stress, poor planning, whatever). Although there are REASONS it STILL doesn't make it excusable!!! EXAMPLE: when I was 20 I let car insurance drop. REASON: I didn't have the money to pay it. REASON: I spent the money on something stupid. RESULT: I had to pay a 225 flag on my license. LESSON: manage money better to avoid not having proper finances to cover necessary expenses.

I never once thought "omg but I had a reason I didn't pay it!!!!" I fixed it and learned my lesson.

Can we please just stop with the back and forth and attempt to have an adult conversation and express ourselves like the mature professional people we are supposed to be?

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med/Surg, Academics.
Just to clear it up once again! Emily and I are NOT trying to say that cheating is excusable. By college level all students should understand there will be harsh consequences for their actions. We were trying to make the point that sometimes there are REASONS that people cheat (stress, poor planning, whatever). Although there are REASONS it STILL doesn't make it excusable!!! EXAMPLE: when I was 20 I let car insurance drop. REASON: I didn't have the money to pay it. REASON: I spent the money on something stupid. RESULT: I had to pay a 225 flag on my license. LESSON: manage money better to avoid not having proper finances to cover necessary expenses.

I never once thought "omg but I had a reason I didn't pay it!!!!" I fixed it and learned my lesson.

I understand where you are coming from. Too often, however, reasons for doing something stupid are offered up as excuses in order to get special treatment these days. Often, a person who breaks a rule will say, "Yes, I knew what the rule is, and I knew what the consequences are, but...." There is always a "but."

No one wants to live with the consequences anymore. Everyone wants the consequences changed because they're just so special. Just look at what a previous poster wrote. A student plagiarized, then got a lawyer involved because the university-wide policies and nursing program policies were different. In that scenario, there probably was no doubt that the student plagiarized. What did she learn from that? Whine, get a lawyer when you're clearly at fault, and things will go your way.

The talk of "reasons" behind bad behavior starts to wear on people when discussing certain subjects like cheating.

Can we please just stop with the back and forth and attempt to have an adult conversation and express ourselves like the mature professional people we are supposed to be?

I see one person beginning to respond to posts with thick sarcasm. Everyone else is just disagreeing or agreeing with points others make.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in ER/ICU/STICU.
So does anyone know if this person was actually cheating? Of course it was a stupid mistake, but maybe they were studying before class on their phone and that was the last screen on. I know my phone stays on the last screen, so I could see that potentially happening (other than having the phone out because mine is always put away during tests). It just seems like people are a little too judgy and maybe it was a stupid mistake.

This person not only had a phone, but a phone that was on and when unlocked had information pertaining to the test on it. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

Gahhh!!!! I don't think I'd be able to go home and face my family if I ever did that. I'd just crawl under a rock and wither away. When we take tests phones have to be off and put in our bags and our bags are put to the side of the class. Nothing on the desk except what is needed for the test (pencil, eraser, eye glasses).

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Labor and Delivery.

This is the most bizarre thread I have read in awhile. This issue is black and white, this garbage over brain chemistry and morals of nursing is pointless. If you're a nursing student or business major if you are caught cheating you're caught cheating and whatever the stated consequences are they are. If someone thinks a younger student has abnormal brain chemistry and are unable to make appropriate decisions then they shouldn't be in the nursing profession anyways, what kind of clinical decisions are they going to be making with the same chemistry? People make one bad decision and suffer consequences all the time, thats life-time to grow up and think before you act and take respondsibility for your actions. Also if teh student hadn't prepared and was so desperate then they could have tried to post-pone the test or make up the poor grade another way. Either way it was a stupid choice they shouldn't have made so I don't get where there's any arguement???????

Up Vote Up Vote ×

One thing I will agree with you on is that people will try to get out of punishment. Of course they would, they have a lot to lose! They clearly didn't plan ahead to study enough, so why would they plan to accept consequences for any action that is so impulsive? I, however, don’t think that the moral tide of our society is any different with regards to cheating. It’s always been around, it’s just easier now with technology. Now more than ever people are expected to be all things to all people. "Desperate people resort to desperate measures." What irked me is the way this thread started to castigate this person, who didn't even admit to cheating. We can argue until blue in the face about the severity of cheating and whether or not it is a harbinger for something larger. I think the real question is do you think this person deserves a second chance, if they cheated or not. Whatever your opinion, though, no one was saying that this person should be an exception to any rule. The job of lawyers is to see that the law is applied justly. I don’t see any reason why someone shouldn’t be given a chance to defend themselves in this situation, either, as a previous poster mentioned. Anecdotal stories of students getting off scott-free from cheating is just an appeal to emotion. I’m not convinced that all people are like this.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med/Surg, Academics.
One thing I will agree with you on is that people will try to get out of punishment. Of course they would, they have a lot to lose! They clearly didn't plan ahead to study enough, so why would they plan to accept consequences for any action that is so impulsive?

If you believe this, then...

What irked me is the way this thread started to castigate this person, who didn't even admit to cheating.

...why would an admission of cheating be required before a punishment is imposed?

I think the real question is do you think this person deserves a second chance, if they cheated or not. Whatever your opinion, though, no one was saying that this person should be an exception to any rule.

If the policy of the school from which the student was dismissed gives no second chances, then a second chance should not be given.

As for admission to other schools, that, too, is up to their policies and/or their admission review committees. The student in question has to live with the decisions of the schools.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

It is wrong to expel a person based on an assumption or "circumstantial evidence". period. WISH ALL OF YOU THE BEST and I hope none of you finds yourself in a situation where you are guilty until proven innocent.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

Wow. I agree with another poster that this thread is bizarre.

I have 2 sons, both of whom have ADD. They have made errors of judgment while not being on medication. (Can't get it as young adults w/o insurance.) I can testify that no one gives a flip about their "disability". They did what they did....period...and they suffered the consequences. A TRUE brain chemistry issue didn't get them out of their life altering misstep, why should this student get a pass?

My mother always said, "Life is not fair", "No one ever guaranteed you fair", and my personal favorite, "Find fair in the Bible and I will give it to you!"

Cheating is not a 'mistake' - it is a character flaw. If this person was willing to cheat on an exam, this person may also have been willing to cheat on documentation, treatment, et. al. Nursing is a profession of integrity. This person has shown a serious lack of integrity and poor judgment.

Nursing school is to be 'unforgiving' for a reason! A mistake is what my oldest daughter made....she turned in her NS app via mail on the deadline date (postmark makes it "by the deadline"). Late that night she saw that she forgot to include a copy of her transcripts (which the school actually has but won't look up). She called the next day (day after deadline) to plead her case. No go. She didn't turn in everything per the app, she will not be considered. No, it isn't catastrophic, just frustrating. She will live with the consequences and learn. They didn't make an exception for her for something innocuous.

If such a 'minor' thing cannot be excused, we certainly cannot excuse a cheat.

Most crimes in this country require the element of intent to garner a conviction. This student showed the intent to break the rules, broke the rule and was expelled.....the consequence clearly outlined in the college or syllabus.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
+ Join the Discussion