Ethical Question

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Hi everyone,

Let's say there is a psych patient that attempts suicide. Then a coworker takes a picture with his or her phone of the blood, sends it to another coworker, and then that coworker shows it to me at a later date.

Would I be ethically bound to report that to my immediate supervisor?

On 12/9/2019 at 3:13 PM, Tenebrae said:

Unless there is a clear clinical reason for a photo document eg documenting the progress of a wound or something else, people shouldn't be taking photos in the work place.

And if a person does take a photo, it should be with documented permission of the patient and only used by people who have involvement in the patients care

People do some stuff without thinking. I'm all for giving people a second chance. Personally my first approach would be to remind your co worker about this and that they need to delete the photo. If they don't, or do it again, then that's when you should take it up with chain of command

Why and how could OP make sure the coworker deleted the picture. How is this OP responsible to make sure the goofball coworker actually deleted it?

HR and Management would not give her a 2nd chance - not without a reprimand, at least, to go along with that 2nd chance.

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Specializes in Psychiatry, Community, Nurse Manager, hospice.

I couldn't tell you what I'd do without more information.

Why did the coworker take a picture of the blood and show it to you? Where was the blood? Was the patient in the picture?

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Specializes in Cardiac Telemetry, ICU.

Regardless of laws or policies, would you want someone turning the evidence of your lowest point into a form of entertainment and gossip?

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Specializes in PICU.

What was the point of the other coworker showing you the picture? In what capacity or conversation was this picture shown? How was the conversation initiated? Were you asking probing questions about the patient after you had taken care of them? If the picture was a completely random context and nothing to do with the care of the patient... Did you ask why the coworker had the picture and of what use was it? Did you tell the coworker that it likely was a ethical violation to have that picture?

I ask you these questions becuase the way you posed the questions leaves so many unanswered questions and potential for many mamy senarios.

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Veering to a side topic...I've been thinking of this for a couple of days so I'll put it out there; might get slammed. ?

We actually have not been told that there was an idea of sheer entertainment involved. I wouldn't be surprised if there was, but just the same let me ask a theoretical question:

Is this fundamentally different than someone saving/showing a couple of people one of those "worst day ever" printouts from crash cart monitor? Or holding onto the napkins upon which the timeline of trying to save someone's life had been hastily scrawled? I have seen people take a pic of a whiteboard with similar details. I was once shown a pyxis/omnicell print-out which had been used to try to reconcile/chart everything done in a particularly bad scenario; it was about a several-feet-long+ list of meds pulled over the course of a short period of crisis. What about hanging onto/showing a couple of other people a "brain sheet" from a particularly memorable/tragic day?

Is it fundamentally different than someone telling a couple of coworkers "there was so much blood..." or something similar?

Aside from "entertainment," bragging, etc., why would (often otherwise reasonable and compassionate) nurses ever do any of this?

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Specializes in PICU.

JKL33:

Exactly. Interesting thoughts.. sometimes I think we a nurses supress some of our feelings of grief, outrage, stress, etc in different ways. Maybe this coworker had care for this patient a while and was trying to cope with the incident.

I too do not think it was just for entertainement or mocking a patient, etc...

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Specializes in Mental Health, Gerontology, Palliative.
20 hours ago, Kooky Korky said:

Why and how could OP make sure the coworker deleted the picture. How is this OP responsible to make sure the goofball coworker actually deleted it?

How about something along the lines of "co worker, its not appropriate to take a picture of that, you need to delete it and dont do it again". People do dumb stuff, i'd rather not throw them under the bus without giving them a chance to rectify that

if the person chooses not to delete it , that is absolutely and utterly on the person who took the photo, and they need to be made aware of the consequences of repeating that action

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HR and Management would not give her a 2nd chance - not without a reprimand, at least, to go along with that 2nd chance.

And thats why I'm not a manager.

Like I said, i'd give a co worker a second chance, and ensure they know what they did wrong and let them know if they do it again, i'd have no choice but to esculate the matter

If they did it again I would escuate the matter.

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Specializes in Critical Care.

While strange, what was violated? Was HIPAA violated?

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11 hours ago, ArmyRntoMD said:

While strange, what was violated? Was HIPAA violated?

At an absolute minimum, I'd guess that 100% of employers have a policy against that sort of thing.

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