Ethical Issues

Nurses General Nursing

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Hey everyone. I have a question. There is a nurse that I know of who takes exotic photos, has an OnlyFans account, "models" in music videos & doesn't mind posing near naked in sexually suggestive positions on social media sites. (She doesn't hide ANYTHING!) That's her life BUT my question is: Can a healthcare employer fire someone for what they do outside of their career as a nurse??? I know we are pillars in the community & are held to a high standard but I want to know, technically, is this woman in the wrong & would or could her job or license be on the line........Thanks in advance for the feedback given! ?

Specializes in NICU.
On 5/27/2020 at 11:39 AM, RN2020scm said:

from inherited false privilege.

LOL

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Specializes in ICU, LTACH, Internal Medicine.
On 6/2/2020 at 5:50 PM, subee said:

I think she is hurting somebody....herself. Exhibitionism is never a joy for the person doing it. If she has such bad judgement about putting her genitals online, I woud counsel her for the sheer stupidity of it and the threat to her career.

Please once upon a time visit some less prudish and conservative country than the USA. One of EU, once they open. Just please. You'll have discoveries of your life!

(oh, Champs Elysees... Musee de Orsay... those who was there even once, will understand)

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Specializes in Psychiatry, Community, Nurse Manager, hospice.
On 6/2/2020 at 5:50 PM, subee said:

I think she is hurting somebody....herself. Exhibitionism is never a joy for the person doing it. If she has such bad judgement about putting her genitals online, I woud counsel her for the sheer stupidity of it and the threat to her career. What's the difference between her and Anthony Wiener? Here's a guy that was a well-liked politician in NYC and now? Do you really think he should have been declared good to go just because he didn't kill anyone? The guy has a mental problem which interfered with normal thinking patterns.

LOL, stick to anesthesia.

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Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.

I think she is hurting somebody....herself. Exhibitionism is never a joy for the person doing it. If she has such bad judgement about putting her genitals online, I woud counsel her for the sheer stupidity of it and the threat to her career. What's the difference between her and Anthony Wiener? Here's a guy that was a well-liked politician in NYC and now? Do you really think he should have been declared good to go just because he didn't kill anyone? The guy has a mental problem which interfered with normal thinking patterns.

On 6/4/2020 at 8:12 AM, FolksBtrippin said:

LOL, stick to anesthesia.

Explain, please. From posts I have read on AN, employers look at an applicant's posts uses them in deciding whether or not to hire that applicant. If someone wants to exhibit themselves online, it's a judgement call whether that is a "moral" call, but it certainly is a judgement call on the person who did it. All other things being equal, I would hire the person who decided to use discretion. That's just displaying a higher E.Q. and I would prefer to hire that person and feel a sorry for the other.

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Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
On 6/4/2020 at 10:35 AM, subee said:

I think she is hurting somebody....herself. Exhibitionism is never a joy for the person doing it. If she has such bad judgement about putting her genitals online, I woud counsel her for the sheer stupidity of it and the threat to her career. What's the difference between her and Anthony Wiener? Here's a guy that was a well-liked politician in NYC and now? Do you really think he should have been declared good to go just because he didn't kill anyone? The guy has a mental problem which interfered with normal thinking patterns.

Explain, please. From posts I have read on AN, employers look at an applicant's posts uses them in deciding whether or not to hire that applicant. If someone wants to exhibit themselves online, it's a judgement call whether that is a "moral" call, but it certainly is a judgement call on the person who did it. All other things being equal, I would hire the person who decided to use discretion. That's just displaying a higher E.Q. and I would prefer to hire that person and feel a sorry for the other.

Again...she engaged in a legal employment arrangement. Anthony Weiner sent unrequested and unwelcome images of his genitalia to women.

The differences between the conduct is night and day.

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Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.

And we have no idea what that employment arrangement was.

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Specializes in Rehab/Nurse Manager.

Since most employers can fire any employee for almost any reason, it's always possible she could lose her job based on outside-of-work activities. Seems more likely, though, that they would probably try and attribute the firing to work-performance issues, even if the real reason is because they find her various other activities to be unprofessional or to reflect poorly upon them. They might try harder to find performance issues, though, than they would with someone else. But honestly, whether or not her job is on the line is up to the individual employer.

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Specializes in Peds ED.
On 6/4/2020 at 3:16 PM, subee said:

And we have no idea what that employment arrangement was.

We DO know however that what Andrew Weiner was doing was nonconsensual.

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Specializes in Psychiatry, Community, Nurse Manager, hospice.
On 6/4/2020 at 10:35 AM, subee said:

I think she is hurting somebody....herself. Exhibitionism is never a joy for the person doing it. If she has such bad judgement about putting her genitals online, I woud counsel her for the sheer stupidity of it and the threat to her career. What's the difference between her and Anthony Wiener? Here's a guy that was a well-liked politician in NYC and now? Do you really think he should have been declared good to go just because he didn't kill anyone? The guy has a mental problem which interfered with normal thinking patterns.

Explain, please. From posts I have read on AN, employers look at an applicant's posts uses them in deciding whether or not to hire that applicant. If someone wants to exhibit themselves online, it's a judgement call whether that is a "moral" call, but it certainly is a judgement call on the person who did it. All other things being equal, I would hire the person who decided to use discretion. That's just displaying a higher E.Q. and I would prefer to hire that person and feel a sorry for the other.

Sure, I'll explain myself.

I said "stick to anesthesia" because you know nothing about psychiatry and have stated that the nurse in question has "mental problems." You are pearl clutching. Your disgust at someone else's behavior is not a diagnostic tool for psychiatric illness, or a means of "counseling".

Also, in your self righteousness, you have made several erroneous statements. You are wrong that exhibitionism is "never a joy for the person doing it." I'm not sure that the person OP is talking about here is an exhibitionist. Having sexually suggestive pictures of yourself online hardly qualifies as exhibitionism, but she may be an exhibitionist. In any case, an exhibitionist is someone who gets sexual pleasure from being seen. So that means they get joy from what they're doing. It's why they do it.

What is the difference between this person we know nothing about and Anthony Weiner? Well, Anthony Weiner was convicted of a sex crime involving a minor.

We have no basis for judging this person's "EQ".

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Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.
On 6/6/2020 at 8:07 AM, FolksBtrippin said:

Sure, I'll explain myself.

I said "stick to anesthesia" because you know nothing about psychiatry and have stated that the nurse in question has "mental problems." You are pearl clutching. Your disgust at someone else's behavior is not a diagnostic tool for psychiatric illness, or a means of "counseling".

Also, in your self righteousness, you have made several erroneous statements. You are wrong that exhibitionism is "never a joy for the person doing it." I'm not sure that the person OP is talking about here is an exhibitionist. Having sexually suggestive pictures of yourself online hardly qualifies as exhibitionism, but she may be an exhibitionist. In any case, an exhibitionist is someone who gets sexual pleasure from being seen. So that means they get joy from what they're doing. It's why they do it.

What is the difference between this person we know nothing about and Anthony Weiner? Well, Anthony Weiner was convicted of a sex crime involving a minor.

We have no basis for judging this person's "EQ".

From the original post, the woman is posting on multiple social media so her pictures MAY be seen by minors or anyone else. That's the rub for me in this situation. Post your nudies away but make sure an employer can't find them - that is the point. We've discussed sex. Now how do you feel about violence? Try this one I found on Google news feed today: https://www.pjstar.com/news/20200605/osf-nurse-suspended-after-facebook-post-about-protesters. Yep.. Right up there for the whole world to know that a RN was so stupid to post this. It's ashame that people like the one above in Peoria have a career modified or ruined because of a moment of stupidity and now, that she has lost her job, she merely serves now as a warning to others. That's my point. It just takes a moment of really bad judgement to change your life.

And let me add: it's true that I haven't held a formal psych RN position, but I did work with an addicted nurse's program for over 25 years and I I learned a lot about people's journeys with undiagnosed and untreated psych issues. And over those years, I can probably count on one hand the number of nurses whose judgement wasn't impaired because of the drugs and the issues creating the suffering before they started using.

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On 6/4/2020 at 10:35 AM, subee said:

employers look at an applicant's posts uses them in deciding whether or not to hire that applicant.

And one of the pluses to being in a high demand job is anyone who acts like that, you can just refuse to work for and find a better company tomorrow. I've had a lot of jobs in my life, and I've noticed that the companies that put more attention to things like your facebook posts, tend to be horrible companies to work for, where you have to worry that doing your job the right way can get you fired. Usually the best companies are the ones who have the policy that once you clock out for the day, that's your time to live how you want to.

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Specializes in CRNA, Finally retired.
24 minutes ago, TheDudeWithTheBigDog said:

And one of the pluses to being in a high demand job is anyone who acts like that, you can just refuse to work for and find a better company tomorrow. I've had a lot of jobs in my life, and I've noticed that the companies that put more attention to things like your facebook posts, tend to be horrible companies to work for, where you have to worry that doing your job the right way can get you fired. Usually the best companies are the ones who have the policy that once you clock out for the day, that's your time to live how you want to.

Not everyone may have the flexibility in changing jobs that you have had. RN jobs are not easy to get in many markets. And it may be tougher standards for license holders than non-license holders. But, nontheless, employers can do this and people should be aware that it could cost a job. One can live a life of freedom without posting on social media in a way that it is accessible to anyone.

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