ER dropping the ball?

Nurses General Nursing

Published

Well, once again I've been sent a patient that is just a complete mess and I have no idea what is going on with him. This seems to happen more than a lot lately.

This patient came in because his wife found him on the floor and when he came to he was confused and weak. He had chest pain in the ambulance that was relieved by nitro.

When he got to the ER they did a lumbar puncture, EKG, CT of chest, abd, and head that were all negative except the LP. They were unable to get that because of bone spurs apparently. His vitals were stable, but white count was 23.9 and he had some respiratory acidosis. The man wears oxygen at home due to copd and smoking 3 ppd. He has sleep apnea but will not wear a cpap, so they sent him up on 2L. I ended up having to get him a mask due to him breathing through his mouth and being knocked out cold from morphine he got in the ER.

So anyways, I talk to the wife and she says he has been throwing up every morning and sometimes through out the day for 9 months, also having malaise, fevers, urinary retention, and just not feeling well. Apparently he had been confused more over the last three days. Turns out he had a pretty significant cardiac history with stents and was a recovered alcoholic. There was no mention of this by the ER nurse.

I soike to the MD and she said he was over sedated from meds he takes at home and possibly had gastroenteritis. She said she was going to order a repeat LP for the am.

First of all, I was only told that he came in confused for 3 days and had an elevated white count and unsuccessful LP. The nurse said he had no other tests done, did not mention any of his history other than HTN and COPD, and didn't say anything about fevers or vomiting. Second, he had been in the ED for 12 hours and didn't even have his EMS stick replaced, had no temperatures recorded except right before coming to the floor, and hadn't been given any fluids, just 1 dose of vanc and ceftin.

Im very confused as to how they can get away with not recording vitals. I figured she had only given me his last set because he just got there. She could've given me a range if he'd been there an entire shift already!

I had to call that nurse back when I got the patient to ask why there were orders for fluid boluses and to get the results of tests that she said he had never had. She denied he ever had a fever or that there were orders for a bolus when she had him. She was very rude and acted as if I was overreacting, but the Dr told me the patient needed to be in ICU. There were just no beds. Then the nurse finally said she thought he had meningitis and to just wear a mask. Ugh!

Also, in the doctors h/p it said nothing about any of his symptoms except for chest pain and elevated white count. I'm so confused and probably too exhausted to be thinking about this right now. All I know is this patient is sick and would be better off going somewhere else if the ER doesn't even have a clue what's wrong with him after he's been there for that long.

Specializes in Medsurg/ICU, Mental Health, Home Health.
The ER did. This is what I was told by nurses who have worked there longer than me .

Weird. Very weird. Who cares if the ED is "mad," this makes for better care for the patient! I don't think I like your facility very much...

Specializes in Cardiac and Emergency Department.

feelix,

I think she was referring to changing out the plug for a pigtail which screws into the actual catheter in the vein in order to draw blood from the site. I will change the plug for a pigtail and change the dressing to one we can assess the site while administering fluids, vasoactive, antibiotics, etc. I will NOT take the time to change the plug to a pigtail if we drop another line, do a straight stick for blood cultures, etc. It is not common for me to take the time to do this without a very good reason.

The OP was blaming the entire ED department, no individual person or profession. Yet people are acting like these are personal attacks.

What is even more troubling is that EXCUSES, EXCUSES, EXCUSES, (ad nauseum) are made for unacceptable and dangerous care.

Do you want to know why the government institutes EMR? Just look at what happened here...

Do you want to know why we have Obamacare with all its meaningful use,” ACOs, etc? Just look what happened here...

libbyliberal has it right; let's call it what it is and stop making excuses. ACA, EMR, etc. is NOT going to fix the system, but something had to be done. Someone had to try something. As long as excuses continue to be made, just imagine what ELSE big government and big business can come up with.

…and who do you think that they are going to blame?

The more strife and the more dysfunction, the more money the consultants will make and the more hoops they will dream up for the floor staff to jump through.

Specializes in ER.
And leave their other patient unattended? No way.
Seriously? Don't make me laugh.

I take it that the ICU nurses drag both patients to a diagnostic test? Clearly since they can't leave one alone (which really means have someone help cover their patient)? I also take it they never leave the unit to go grab lunch downstairs? Or do they drag them to the cafeteria? I do assume that you guys do take your ICU patients to tests and not leave them alone while they're getting tests.

Trust me, it's hectic everywhere...and I think some ED RNs should hang out a bit to see what happens in the ICU after the patient is brought up there. I'm not disagreeing with you, just saying that we all need to see the other side once in a while.

It actually helps improve the communication. Also, usually when we get up there, the other ICU nurses are helping in the room. By both taking the patient upstairs, it improves the communication and respect because it forces both ER and ICU to work together. Believe it or not, it really does improve the working relationship of the ICU and ER nurses. ER nurses don't trash ICU as much and ICU doesn't trash ER as much. Even the ICU nurses admitted that it helped foster a better understanding and working relationship with the ER. Both the ICU and ER nurses would transport the patient so you get 2 RNs.

@ Birdy2,

..."Then the nurse finally said she thought he had meningitis and to just wear a mask. Ugh..."

A serious breach in infection control measures occurred for sure.

There is simply no getting around putting other patients and fellow nightengales at risk of infection. At the very least, the need for Isolation and an Isolation bed should have been communicated.

Specializes in ER.
@ Birdy2,

..."Then the nurse finally said she thought he had meningitis and to just wear a mask. Ugh..."

A serious breach in infection control measures occurred for sure.

There is simply no getting around putting other patients and fellow nightengales at risk of infection. At the very least, the need for Isolation and an Isolation bed should have been communicated.

Actually, a slightly funny story. So my section was closing and I had to switch over to another section of five new patients. I reported off to my charge and picked up the new patients. I was busy working with those patients. About an hour or so later, charge asked if I could call report. I overlooked the patient went for a CT because the results weren't back and the charge never informed me. Apparently the doctor was concerned that there was a chance the patient had TB but didn't really think he had it. So that never was passed along (and technically, he should have been moved to an isolation room while in the ER). Oops.

Specializes in ICU.

It's not funny when everyone exposed has to be screened and treated for tuberculosis or meningococcal meningitis .

Seriously? Don't make me laugh.

I take it that the ICU nurses drag both patients to a diagnostic test? Clearly since they can't leave one alone (which really means have someone help cover their patient)? I also take it they never leave the unit to go grab lunch downstairs? Or do they drag them to the cafeteria? I do assume that you guys do take your ICU patients to tests and not leave them alone while they're getting tests.

Lol, yeah. We had to travel with our patients, leaving the other one in the unit to be covered by coworkers or our unit manager. Every day someone was having to travel. I always hated that. The whole time you are gone, you are worrying about how behind you are now getting with the other patient.

Specializes in ER.
It's not funny when everyone exposed has to be screened and treated for tuberculosis or meningococcal meningitis .

Except that it wasn't and therefore no one had to be screened.

Lol, yeah. We had to travel with our patients, leaving the other one in the unit to be covered by coworkers or our unit manager. Every day someone was having to travel. I always hated that. The whole time you are gone, you are worrying about how behind you are now getting with the other patient.

And ER nurses don't have that issue? Although I strongly recommend trying it. It improves the working relationship a lot. More facilities should switch to this kind of format because it really, really helps. That way if the ICU wants something done or thinks something should be ordered prior to the floor, they can make their own case too. The ICU nurses have realized that sometimes the physicians really say no to something they want and it's not us not asking. Plus look at it this way, it's a lot safer to have two nurses going than a nurse and a tech. And if you take 2 ER nurses, you're leaving between 6-10 patients without a nurse and potentially increasing 1-2 nurses workload down there. If both take a nurse from their departments to go downstairs, the other ICU staff will have to deal with 1 patient whereas the ER may have multiple critical patients. I remember one time in the ICU they were talking about the 2nd ICU patient in ER and I was like "that's mine too." Never mind that I still had 3 other patients to tend to. So I had 2 ICU admits and 3 med-surg patients.

Specializes in Med-Tele; ED; ICU.
and I think some ED RNs should hang out a bit to see what happens in the ICU after the patient is brought up there.

This is one of the reasons that I work in the ICU float pool in addition to my primary ED gig. I've got a first hand view from inside all the ICUs as well as the ED.

I often say that I think it would be beneficial for nurses from various units to float to the others for a few a weeks in order to learn what it's really like.

This is one of the reasons that I work in the ICU float pool in addition to my primary ED gig. I've got a first hand view from inside all the ICUs as well as the ED.

I often say that I think it would be beneficial for nurses from various units to float to the others for a few a weeks in order to learn what it's really like.

I've said this before, we've done this. It was amazingly eye opening. The staff that was too junior or new to participate in this also benefitted, as we seasoned nurses came back to our floors with totally different attitudes.

Hey ER nurses:

Please quit suggesting people come down and see what we actually do. Last thing I need is somebody looking over my shoulder while I surf the web as my patients deteriorate. I am mostly sitting around eating bon bons until the floor takes report. Once word gets out, there is going to be one heck of a lot more competition for ER jobs.

As far as nurses from other departments being critical of lazy incompetent ER nurses:

Where else are we supposed to work? We aren't smart enough for the ICU, not hard working enough for the floor, and not compassionate enough for long term care.

Be happy we are down in the ER and not mucking things up in your unit.

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