You can always tell when I've been hanging out on the Allnurses.com forums too much -- I get up on a soap box. I'm amazed, though, at how many new nurses are grasping at straws to find "reasons" to quit their first jobs because they're unhappy and they're just positive that things are going to be better elsewhere. Even if there is no elsewhere in the immediate future. It's not THEIR fault that they're miserable -- it's the job. Or their co-workers are all mean and out to get them. (Probably because of their incredible beauty.) Staffing is a nightmare, the CNAs are all hiding and they're afraid they're going to "loose" their license. They'd better quit RIGHT NOW, so they don't "loose" that license. (I wonder if that one is as transparent to spouses who are looking for a little help with the rent -- not to mention those school loans you've racked up -- as it is to some of the rest of us.) The job is ruining their lives and their mental health -- they're seriously worried for their mental health if they don't quit right now. Where did all of these fragile people come from?
Seriously, folks. The first year of nursing sucks. You have the internet and all of that -- how could you not know that the first year of nursing sucks? It does. We've all been through it. The only way to GET through it is to GO through it, but there's a big group of newbies every year who are SURE that doesn't apply to them. No one as ever been as miserable as they are. No one understands. They HATE going to work every day. Management is targeting them and they're sure they're going to be fired. They're concerned that their mental health might be permanently damaged by the trauma of staying in that job ONE MORE DAY. Given the inevitability of "loosing" that license and permanent damage to their mental health, it's all right to quit that job tomorrow, isn't it? Or maybe it's that their DREAAAAAAAAM job is opening up, and they've been offered the job. It's OK to quit this job to take their DREAAAAAAAAM job, isn't it?
How do they even know their dream job is hiring if they have every intention of making their first job work out? What are all those job applications doing out there, floating around if they're serious about this job? You DID intend to keep this job for one to two years when you took it, didn't you? If not, shame on you!
The first year of nursing sucks. You're going to hate going to work every day, and some of you are going to cry all the way to work and all the way home. You'll be exhausted, both mentally and physically and your normal hobbies and activities may take second seat to the job. You'll be constantly afraid of making a mistake, and you will MAKE mistakes. You'll feel incompetent. You may lose sleep because you're worrying about your job. Switching jobs isn't going to miraculously make you confident and competent. It's just going to delay you on your path through that first miserable year. It may even look bad on your resume, paint you as a job hopper. (I'm always shocked by how many new nurses are on their third or fourth job in less than two years who will assure me that they're not job hoppers. Honey, if you're on your third job in less than two years, you're a job hopper. Really.)
Don't people have bills to pay? Or is it that no one feels responsible for paying their own bills anymore? How is it that so many people feel free to just up and quit a paying job without another one in sight? I guess I'm getting old, because I really don't get it.
I dont get this mentality many older nurses and parents have..."I had it hard, so should you!" Very unnatural. Shouldn't we want things to be better for future generations? Isn't it a human instinct to want the younger ones to thrive and not struggle?
I am not a mother, but when I have kids, I want them to have better (not necessarily easier). If the entire human race had the mentality of some of the seasoned nurses, we would still be in dark times where humans didn't progress or advance.
Well, I am a mother, and I do have adult offspring (children no longer), and I told them I did not have them to stay at home and be dependent. I had them to go out into the world and make it a better place by hard work. I have seen what happens to people who never have to struggle, whose snowplow parents (you know, the ones that remove all obstacles) deprived them of the opportunities to fail and try again, who believe their parents and other older people owe them an easier (or better) life. They come up against the realities of life -- not everybody cares what you think, you have to make it on your own merit and effort, nobody owes you unconditional support and admiration, you don't deserve a better life just because you're here -- and the shock of it all is disorienting and, for some, crushing. Many are paralyzed, and really have no idea what to do or how to start. This, I submit, would not be a functional way for the human race to progress or advance.
My kids have never been crushed by disappointment or failure in the way I hear so many younger nurses describe. They, like their mother, say, "Oh, well, whiskey-tango-foxtrot, let's try that a different way, guess I need to look at that differently, guess I need to learn something else to apply to that kind of situation..." They are raising their kids the same way. And we all get on with it.
Personally, I don't think people should HAVE to suffer their first year as a nurse. It's unfair and speaks negatively to the nature of this profession that it's accepted that after all the hard work to become a nurse, you're going to absolutely dread going to work everyday. How about people start demanding better work environments rather than just quitting?
Suffering is subjective. Suffering is a result of the meaning you attach to feelings and experiences. As a purely physical example, some people live with chronic pain but they do not suffer from it. They get on with and enjoy life despite their pain.
Moving to the topic at hand, I think a large part of the assumption behind this opinion is that uncomfortable, challenged, and situationally insecure means suffering. I felt all of those things as a new nurse, but I never once made the leap into "Oh, these feelings must mean I am suffering, and moreover, it's somebody else's fault that I suffer."
I do believe that any new nurse who doesn't feel uncomfortable, challenged, and insecure at the beginning of practice lacks the self-awareness to progress to a higher level of competence.
No, they don't have bills to pay. I know several 22-26 year olds who work full time jobs, but live at home rent-free, drive cars their parents bought them and have never made a payment on, and get meals cooked for them daily.
I'm not hating though, if that were an option for me, I'd be pretty tempted.
I think a lot of new grads freak out and quit not only because they are stressed and don't like their jobs, but also feel like they are BAD at their jobs and shouldn't be there. Not just because of entitlement issues.
But honestly, those people that just hate their jobs and think it's so awful, I don't mind it when they quit. I'm usually sick of listening to them whine. I know it costs money, I'm just saying, I'm not usually sad about it when they leave.
^^^^^THIS!!!! I abosolutely agree!!! I have been following this thread since it has started. This is the first comment I have read that brings this thread into a whole different perspective.
Thank u!!!!
"Be the change you wish to see in the world." - Gandhi
Nurses need to stand up from themselves, because no one else is going to do it. The degrading work conditions and horrible staffing is not entirely the fault of management - who can blame them for trying to cut costs? A large part of the blame falls on nurses who, instead of banding together and refusing to accept it, resort to attacking each other. I for one will not stand for being treated in an unprofessional manner, whether it be a fellow nurse, manager, physician, etc. I wish all nurses would do the same - no one will give you respect unless you demand it.
There are so many qualified nurses and people looking for work - there's no good reason why anyone should ever have to work short-staffed for 1980's wages
Nursing pay in the 1980s, taking into account frenetic bonuses, constant pay increases, free insurance (yes, there once was such a thing), profit sharing, retirement account contributions, and not to mention that tuition amounted to no more than what books cost today, was actually probably 50% higher or more than it is today, in actual purchasing power. It's shocking to see RNs today being paid less than the equivalent of what LPNs used to be paid, in real numbers, even compared to 10 years ago, much less 30. Also, how many seasoned nurses in here had their BSN education paid for fully by their employers, way back in the old days?
As far as having the resources to prevent anyone from having to suffer- you can't argue with that point. Greed had taken a firm grip on much of this country, and doesn't seem to have any counter balance to even slow it down.
OOPS! I forgot to mention paid vacations, personal days, and paid holidays at 2 or 3 times base rate. But these are terms that would be foreign to most nurses nowadays, so I won't try to explain them.
Specializes in Oncology; medical specialty website.
Okay, so a list of things to do in order not to disappoint the Crusty Old Bat Society: stay at job for at least 1-2 years, do not job hop, do not make spelling or grammatical errors on Allnurses, do not post about how waiting for NCLEX is anxiety provoking, do not complain about co-workers (unless they are new/young nurses), do not complain about the first year of nursing. After all, following the COB society's rules are of top priority because it is the only way one can become a GREAT nurse like they all are [sarcasm]. We know by now that posting a thread on one of these topics will cause a big long chain of responses along the lines of "we used to have to test in a big center for two days and wouldn't find out if we passed or failed for months. If we failed we had to wait to test because testing only happened twice a year, blah blah blah".
I don't need to "find a reason" to quit my job, I will quit if I want to. I am an adult and will accept the consequences of my actions, whatever they may be. I will not stay at a job for two years that I am miserable at- I don't care if you say that will make me a bad nurse because I know that staying there would make me a worse one. There is not only one way to become a good nurse.
It does always entertain me how the older generations complain about how selfish, ungrateful, and disappointing the generations that THEY created are. When in reality so many things in the world have changed each generation how can it be expected that the people not change? Believe it or not the "older generations" are not perfect, all generations have their strengths and weaknesses....
I think some are taking this "Crusty Bat" moniker a bit too seriously and personally. I explained in a previous post how that came about...from an insult from a new nurse. I would be willing to bet if you polled the people here who call themselves "Crusty Old Bats," not one would approve of nurses being abused and berated. This is true for any nurse, not necessarily just the new ones. We all should be treated with respect and kindness at work. Unfortunately, it doesn't always happen because there are mean, miserable people out there of all ages and experience levels who want to make life miserable for others.
If someone wants to job hop, it's no skin off my back. There can be consequences to being a job hopper, and we have had threads about that very issue. People have to weigh the pros and cons about leaving a job when they're only a few months into it. Nurses here with experience (sometimes earned through the school of hard knocks) can offer advice, but in the end, we're not the ones who have to live with the decisions that are made.
There are experienced nurses here who frequently take the time to offer clinical and professional advice. Nurses like Ruby, GrnTea, Esme, LadyFree and others can be counted on to do this. They wouldn't have to, but this site would be diminished without their expertise.
It's easy to remember the people who were impatient with you, but hard to remember those who gave you their time and shared their knowledge.
FWIW, the "older generation" doesn't have the lock on rudeness. Rude nurses come in all ages, can be male or female, experienced or new.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
Yes, thank you! I can't stand nurses who are always saying they're all "for the patients" and "so compassionate" but they can't manage to direct any of their supposedly amazing people skills and compassion toward their co-workers.
It takes the same amount of energy to say something nicely as it does to say it in a nasty or harsh way, and "it's because I care so much about the patients!" is not an excuse for being an ass to your co-workers.
No one is advocating being an ass to your co-workers. What we ARE saying is that the patient comes first, and if I have to give you some immediate negative feedback to keep you from harming your patient, I will do so. I'll try to be nice about it, but the patient comes first.
The same should be said for new nurses who vent about the "battleaxes" that precept them; the "old hags" they have to work with; the "dinosaurs" who make it dreary to go to work since they don't socialize at work; etc., etc., etc. Those "old hag" nurses have feelings, too.[/quote']
Those insults are very hurtful and I would never dream of projecting them onto my more experienced colleagues. I find it unlikely there's an overbearing contingent of new nurses insulting and bullying the older nurses out the door. I've never even heard of that (usually it's management forcing the older nurses out, but that's a different story). Regardless, if someone is bothering you, you don't respond to it by bad-mouthing and teasing them. Images of explaining "schoolyard ethics" to a pouting middle-schooler come to mind. I now feel stupid giving a child's advice to fully grown adults.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
"Loose" as in... this ring is loose on my finger.
"Lose" as in... I'm afraid to lose my job or license.
I'm going to lose some weight so my clothes will be loose.
Thank you. I understand the difference -- that's why I put it in quotes. I'm just quoting a number of posters here who are constantly in fear of "loosing" their license. (Just tighten your grip, folks.)
Thank you. I understand the difference -- that's why I put it in quotes. I'm just quoting a number of posters here who are constantly in fear of "loosing" their license. (Just tighten your grip, folks.)
I read an article on medscape that discusses some of our real generational differences. I think it would fit in well with this discussion. We are all different. Our age, experience, and upbringing do impact our professional practice.The article is well worth the read.
A nurse manager, desperate for more staff, telephones 4 of her nurses to ask whether they will pull an extra shift.
• The first nurse says, "What time do you need me?"
• The second nurse says, "Call me back if you can't find anyone else."
• The third nurse says, "How much will you pay me?"
• The fourth nurse says, "Sorry, I have plans. Maybe next time."
According to Bonnie Clipper, author of The Nurse Manager's Guide to an Intergenerational Workforce,[1] these different responses are typical of the 4 different generations of nurses currently working side by side in nursing.
In the same order as the responses above, these generations are:
• The "traditionalists" (also called the "veterans");
• The "baby boomers" ("boomers");
• The "X generation" ("Xers"); and
• The "Millennials" (also known as the "Y-generation" or "nexters").
Social scientists maintain that this is the first time in history that 4 generations of nurses have worked together. In previous years, earlier retirement from nursing and shorter lifespans kept the workforce to 3 generations. Recently, however, many nurses have continued to work long past the conventional retirement age of mid-60s, some well into their eighth decade of life.
However, because the youngest nurses of the traditionalist generation are now 71 years old, this generation is shrinking rapidly and will soon be replaced by a new, as-yet-unnamed generation of nurses born in this century. Generational differences have become another type of diversity adding complexity to the nursing workforce.....
To the person who can't understand why mothers don't want more for their children, you are way off base. I want more for my son, that's why I teach him manners, work ethic, and how interact in he world. I heard from a school principal that kids don't grow up nowadays until the age of 26. 26!!!! I was out and on my own at 18. I want my son to grow up and be able to take care of himself and his family someday. Not relying on me and his dad his whole life. I'm teaching him values and how to be a productive citizen, not rely on the government for handouts. He will do better than me and not because everything is handed to him either.
and to the person who wants to make excuses for anxiety and depression, I'm sorry but you can't use that as a cop out. I am so tired of hearing, well, I have anxiety and I'm depressed so the whole world she treat me like a queen and tip toe around me. I have been sexually assaulted and abused and I have depression. No one at school or any of my jobs knows about it and I don't use it as an excuse. I take the same tests as everyone else and I work just as hard, if not harder than others. It all depends on how much you want it. If you want something work hard and get it!!!
nurseprnRN, BSN, RN
1 Article; 5,116 Posts
Well, I am a mother, and I do have adult offspring (children no longer), and I told them I did not have them to stay at home and be dependent. I had them to go out into the world and make it a better place by hard work. I have seen what happens to people who never have to struggle, whose snowplow parents (you know, the ones that remove all obstacles) deprived them of the opportunities to fail and try again, who believe their parents and other older people owe them an easier (or better) life. They come up against the realities of life -- not everybody cares what you think, you have to make it on your own merit and effort, nobody owes you unconditional support and admiration, you don't deserve a better life just because you're here -- and the shock of it all is disorienting and, for some, crushing. Many are paralyzed, and really have no idea what to do or how to start. This, I submit, would not be a functional way for the human race to progress or advance.
My kids have never been crushed by disappointment or failure in the way I hear so many younger nurses describe. They, like their mother, say, "Oh, well, whiskey-tango-foxtrot, let's try that a different way, guess I need to look at that differently, guess I need to learn something else to apply to that kind of situation..." They are raising their kids the same way. And we all get on with it.
You are the captain of your soul.