doctors vs nurses

curlysin · Aug 28, 2006

Hannah it sounds like you have had a really bad week. I do try to remember that at this time of year all of the doctors have changed, you house officers are brand new out of med school and are trying to come to terms with the changes in their responsibility the SHO may well be on his first senior job and feeling a little insecure. I don't know what level doc your experience was with and I would not try to justify bad manners or poor practice but there may be an explanation for his behaviour.
Firstly I work as part of a surgical team, consisting of a consultant, SPr, me SHO and HO I wonder if your doctor knew where to find the aprons and inco sheets, also he may not have considered using an inco he probably has never had to change a soiled sheet so may not have even thought of it.
If my patient was undergoing a procedure on the ward I would have no problme in explaining the procedure to them, in fact I think that sometimes nurses can explain better in a way that the patient understands and feels reassured by.
I always worry that as healthcare profesionals we are very quick to critisie other professions without trying to understand the pressures that other jobs entail, and this is not exclusive to nursing, I hear docs critisise nurses, nurses critisise physios, physios critisise doctors etc etc.
and it concerns me that there is little tolerance left in the NHS when we are all trying to achieve the same thing - best care for the patient
I hope your week gets better

mabel i fear you are an old school nurse would that be right? i think if you are ,you are without a doubt more tolerant to doctors behaviour than the new age of nurses thats the way you where taught.

i have no problem in the world whatsoever helping any doctor or indeed carrying there workload whether it be cannulation, venepuncture, ecgs, etc etc BUT its all about respect and if the doctor doesnt have the manners i will not go out of my way to assist them i mean why should i, i too have a massive caseload!!!!!!!! i would also have no problem explaining a procedure to a patient, if i had the time to do so yeap no bother at all!

you are right people are becoming less tolerant but il tell you why for years nurses quite frankly have suffered abuse at the hands of every other professional in the hospital and for many years the profession( that we struggled so hard to even get recognised as one!! ) has been treated like a dogs body and thats exactly where it all went wrong letting people treat us like that. so in this new age of nursing i hope to see more nurses fight for the respect they so rightly deserve!!!!

ps i am all about the patient and if everyone gave each other the respect they deserved, all working relationships would be better and that would directly effect the patient care in a good way!! so again heres to respect!!

d4e5f6 · Aug 28, 2006

Heres to respect! Couldnt agree more! :)

madwife2002, BSN, RN · Aug 28, 2006

mabel i fear you are an old school nurse would that be right? i think if you are ,you are without a doubt more tolerant to doctors behaviour than the new age of nurses thats the way you where taught.
i have no problem in the world whatsoever helping any doctor or indeed carrying there workload whether it be cannulation, venepuncture, ecgs, etc etc BUT its all about respect and if the doctor doesnt have the manners i will not go out of my way to assist them i mean why should i, i too have a massive caseload!!!!!!!! i would also have no problem explaining a procedure to a patient, if i had the time to do so yeap no bother at all!
you are right people are becoming less tolerant but il tell you why for years nurses quite frankly have suffered abuse at the hands of every other professional in the hospital and for many years the profession( that we struggled so hard to even get recognised as one!! ) has been treated like a dogs body and thats exactly where it all went wrong letting people treat us like that. so in this new age of nursing i hope to see more nurses fight for the respect they so rightly deserve!!!!
ps i am all about the patient and if everyone gave each other the respect they deserved, all working relationships would be better and that would directly effect the patient care in a good way!! so again heres to respect!!

You are so right doctors, in the Uk doctors are much less tolerated when they behave badly or are rude and we expect them to behave in a certain manner on our ward/unit. Nurses do have control of the wards and do have the autonomy to advise the doctors that their behaviour is not acceptable. Here in the US you may find a big difference in some hospitals. I keep saying the nurses have a different role to the UK.

curlysin · Aug 28, 2006

You are so right doctors, in the Uk doctors are much less tolerated when they behave badly or are rude and we expect them to behave in a certain manner on our ward/unit. Nurses do have control of the wards and do have the autonomy to advise the doctors that their behaviour is not acceptable. Here in the US you may find a big difference in some hospitals. I keep saying the nurses have a different role to the UK.

yeah im finding that kinda worrying to be honest as at times no matter how you stick up for yourself doctors can still be very rude, bad manner and have you going home nearly in tears!!! i wish there was'nt such a big gap between us in society you know how doctors vs nurses are perceived at the end of the day we are all trying to do the same job which is the best for our patients!!!

that nightingale one caused alot of our problems you know with her the doctor is alway right phrase and nurses are there to be servants!!!

Geena, BSN, RN · Aug 29, 2006

Well to those who are coming to the US-enjoy shouting at the doctors because you wont be doing it here :chuckle

lol my God what are you saying... we cannot shout at them in the US? :rotfl:

RGN1 · Sep 2, 2006

I have never shouted but just today I calmly took 2 docs down a peg or three (well in truth one is on my list for tomorrow as you'll see) - it was FUN!!!!

Cut a long story short.... pt has paralytic ileus in my opinion - bile green vomit - 1,100mls yesterday (when I was off) 600mls today. I make her NBM & get fluid written up by resident doc. Her son is a Junior doc somewhere & not happy mum can't eat!!!! Complains to consultant who comes in to visit & demands to know what business I had putting her pt NBM. I calmly (honest I was really calm) explain that she has no bowel souinds that I can hear & she has vomited as above.

End of story..... consultant agrees :smokin: & I'm SURE looking forward to seeing doc son tomorrow. GLOAT, GLOAT, GLOAT!!!:rotfl:

Silverdragon102, BSN · Sep 3, 2006

I have never shouted but just today I calmly took 2 docs down a peg or three (well in truth one is on my list for tomorrow as you'll see) - it was FUN!!!!
Cut a long story short.... pt has paralytic ileus in my opinion - bile green vomit - 1,100mls yesterday (when I was off) 600mls today. I make her NBM & get fluid written up by resident doc. Her son is a Junior doc somewhere & not happy mum can't eat!!!! Complains to consultant who comes in to visit & demands to know what business I had putting her pt NBM. I calmly (honest I was really calm) explain that she has no bowel souinds that I can hear & she has vomited as above.
End of story..... consultant agrees & I'm SURE looking forward to seeing doc son tomorrow. GLOAT, GLOAT, GLOAT!!!:rotfl:

thats the way to do it... shouting isn't the answer :rotfl:

ayla2004, ASN, RN · Nov 11, 2006

lol my God what are you saying... we cannot shout at them in the US? :rotfl:

one of my first experinces as a student was a sister(old school not address by her first name) telling me doctors are nor gods espically house officers she then went on to give the SHO who had just rotated firm order about how to treat her staff and about the neede to contribute to the coffee money, and when the Reg was too slow in clinc sent the rest of us out and had words.

been on rounds with a Reg who when talking about a stroke pt having no short/intermediate memory, i advoacted for my patient that at times no and maybe she can't remember him as she doesnt see him as often but unfortuale for me she remebered my name and used too often.

Ruby Vee, BSN · Nov 12, 2006

lol my god what are you saying... we cannot shout at them in the us? :rotfl:

i've shouted at my share of them here in the us, but i've found that there are better ways to get your point across. although, if all else fails, shouting can be somewhat satisfying . . . .

sara20 · Dec 29, 2006

You know it saddens me to talk about this topic, because I love nursing and everything our university taught us about this career...until they threw us into hospitals, and into interacting with doctors..it's true we can't generalize, but some doctors come with a "superiority complex" or ego they think they know it all and they always act in the best interest of the patient when us nurses are the ones who are more knowledgeable about the patients b/c we spend hours nursing them. Doctors assume that they know more just b/c they studied medicine and learned about tons of diseases and conditions..however they miss the most important fact that not all patients are alike..just b/c you know all diseases and conditions doesn't mean you know all your patients..you need a patient centered care which nurses provide..I see doctors only showing up for rounds, and check charts and if the patient is lucky or has some really concerning status change then they'd come to have a look..otherwise the wards are pretty much run by nurses..needless to mention, some of these doctors really require to be educated in ethics...I am sick of doctors who forget to drape their patients after physical exams..i wonder if they'd appreciate it much if some doctor were to leave their parents undraped while performing a physial...we make doctors lives easier yet they don't appreciate us as they should...sometimes I think about changing my career and going to medical school just so that I can be a better role model for these doctors...have you noticed that doctors who were previously nurses or physiotherapists, etc..treat you better? they are more willing to listen and consider alternatives! It's just sad....that's all I have to say...

allnurses Guide · Dec 29, 2006

You know it saddens me to talk about this topic, because I love nursing and everything our university taught us about this career...until they threw us into hospitals, and into interacting with doctors..it's true we can't generalize, but some doctors come with a "superiority complex" or ego they think they know it all and they always act in the best interest of the patient when us nurses are the ones who are more knowledgeable about the patients b/c we spend hours nursing them. Doctors assume that they know more just b/c they studied medicine and learned about tons of diseases and conditions..however they miss the most important fact that not all patients are alike..just b/c you know all diseases and conditions doesn't mean you know all your patients..you need a patient centered care which nurses provide..I see doctors only showing up for rounds, and check charts and if the patient is lucky or has some really concerning status change then they'd come to have a look..otherwise the wards are pretty much run by nurses..needless to mention, some of these doctors really require to be educated in ethics...I am sick of doctors who forget to drape their patients after physical exams..i wonder if they'd appreciate it much if some doctor were to leave their parents undraped while performing a physial...we make doctors lives easier yet they don't appreciate us as they should...sometimes I think about changing my career and going to medical school just so that I can be a better role model for these doctors...have you noticed that doctors who were previously nurses or physiotherapists, etc..treat you better? they are more willing to listen and consider alternatives! It's just sad....that's all I have to say...

Wow it sounds like you have had some really bad experiences with you docs. I have to speak as I find I work really closely with our surgical docs and I rarely find that I have a problem. Yes there are one or two that I could quite cheerfully strangle especially when they think that they are right and I know they are not, I usually smile at them, say yes doctor and then pick up the phone to thier SPr to ask them to review. If I get no joy from the reg I go to the consultants. We are very lucky where I am and apart from one consultant they are all really approachable and listen to the nurses.

I am going to sound really old but I do remember when it was very different, the house officers did come out of training with absolutely no respect for nurses and the sister of the ward made a tray of tea for the consultant before he did his ward round. As junior nurses we were expected to go to the sluice or treatment room and stay out of the way until after he left. I also remember standing when the consultant entered the room.

I find that now the junior doctors have much more respect than they used to and the senior medics most of them really value the nurses on thier wards. It is very different to when I started nursing. (Where's my zimmer ;))

I have never shouted at a doctor - or any other member of staff for that matter as I find it achieves very little and just causes hostility.

Silverdragon102, BSN · Dec 29, 2006

Wow it sounds like you have had some really bad experiences with you docs. I have to speak as I find I work really closely with our surgical docs and I rarely find that I have a problem. Yes there are one or two that I could quite cheerfully strangle especially when they think that they are right and I know they are not, I usually smile at them, say yes doctor and then pick up the phone to thier SPr to ask them to review. If I get no joy from the reg I go to the consultants. We are very lucky where I am and apart from one consultant they are all really approachable and listen to the nurses.
I am going to sound really old but I do remember when it was very different, the house officers did come out of training with absolutely no respect for nurses and the sister of the ward made a tray of tea for the consultant before he did his ward round. As junior nurses we were expected to go to the sluice or treatment room and stay out of the way until after he left. I also remember standing when the consultant entered the room.
I find that now the junior doctors have much more respect than they used to and the senior medics most of them really value the nurses on thier wards. It is very different to when I started nursing. (Where's my zimmer ;))
I have never shouted at a doctor - or any other member of staff for that matter as I find it achieves very little and just causes hostility.

Have to agree here, walking stick coming out, before I left secondary care and began working in primary care I found the doctors more approachable than in the 1980's when you had to hide on ward rounds and eat breakfast in the toilet In some ways things have improved and thankfully that is one of them. Sorry you are having problems with your doctors