Do crnas deserve that much salary?

PG2018 · May 23, 2016

Who cares? They guy a good job. Let him have his beans.

Better question, why os the anesthesiologist administering the anesthetists meds? Texas regulation?

Kooky Korky, BSN, RN · May 29, 2016

I think CRNA's deserve a minimum of $200,000 a year gross income in 2016's economical situation. I think if they open up their own practice they should make just as much as any other anesthesia provider in a private practice.
If they are now required to obtain a doctorate which essentially puts their total education at 7 to 8 years. Are in student loan debt of typically >$100,000. Evidenced based research shows the exact same outcomes between themselves as fellow counterpart anesthesia providers. My instinct is to say that MDA's deserve more money but then I can't seem to logically find a reason they should or evidenced based research that would back up why they would, if they literally provide the same service and outcome. They did have to do a miserable (5 years?) residency which pays very little and demands a lot of your time, I feel for them on that.
Although they would probably prefer that option to the 4 years I worked in the ICU anywhere from 40 to 60 hours a week building my resume and clinical experience to even get accepted into CRNA school. I put my hands in orifices without blinking that would send them packing. While they brainstorm excitedly about what ways to hemodynamically stabilize a patient I'm running around the room implementing all the actions to actually keep them alive while also internally (sometimes verbally) brainstorming about the next step to keep them going.
I'm friends with the residents and talk with them candidly, trust me, they would prefer their low paid residency experience over having to do everything I did as an ICU RN.
I suppose we all have our cross to bear.

Don't doctors do orifices, too? What are you talking about?

Kooky Korky, BSN, RN · May 29, 2016

This thread and a bunch of the posts in it are what's wrong with this profession. People make comments that are ignorant and without actual evidence to back up their opinions. What you see and what actually goes on is very different. A simple search online and doing some of your own research could easily answer your question as to why CRNAs get paid what they do.

OP has seen things done a certain way where she works. Things are done differently in different places.

MurseJJ · May 29, 2016

Funny, this poster posted the same thing found in the OP over at SDN, yet his status over there says "attending physician"...lmao.

lifelearningrn, BSN, RN · May 31, 2016

you dont need rigorous education to do that job, because crnas dont do anything without anesthesiologists, guess you didnt read my post or you didnt understand it

It is kind of hard to understand your post the way it's written. Why question someone's salary? You obviously do not understand or appreciate they work they're doing.

An aide that has never gone to nursing school may make a similar argument.. Why do nurses get paid as well as they do when all they do is pass out medications and hang IVs all day? Anyone can be trained to do that!! Right???

SRNA4U, BSN, DNP, RN, CRNA · Jun 4, 2016

As a new CRNA, the responsibility of taking care of the patient is on the same level as the anesthesiologist. A regular nurse could not do the same job as a CRNA. What you are observing on the periphery of what a CRNA does, prevents you from seeing what the CRNA is thinking while taking care of the patient. The physiology, pharmacology, pathophysiology, and the anesthesia courses are what separates the RN from an CRNA. You have to know how that patients co-morbidities and medications are affected by your anesthesia medications and gases. Would an RN know how to manage a patient that has Local Anesthetic Systemic Toxicity from the medications injected by the surgeon? Would an RN know what medication is used for this toxicity? Would an RN know how to treat a patient with pheochromocytoma? Would an RN know the differential diagnosis between pheochromocytoma, Malignant Hyperthermia, Serotonin Syndrome, and Neuroleptic Malignant Syndrome. A lot of these syndromes have similar presentations but a CRNA would have the training to differentiate them and the medications used to treat them. So while you may see a CRNA going through the motions, you have no idea of what they're thinking and why they base the decisions of what med to give based on a patients medical history.

After having worked as an ICU nurse I thought I knew it all but until I went to anesthesia school and learned how drugs work at the cellular level, I have come to realize that I didn't know as much as I thought I knew. Also, going from the RN role to the CRNA role you are taught to practice as a provider and make decisions on your own, after all, some states allow CRNAs to work independently without an anesthesiologist.

As you mentioned about the doc coming to push drugs, where I work, the docs only supervise us 70% of the time so I get to do my own inductions by myself. Every practice is different. So yes, I think I deserve the salary I receive because I have the awesome responsibility of having someones life in my hands and the knowledge and training I have received has prepared me well for my job. Also, RNs can't float swan catheters but I can as a CRNA when doing hearts. Our anesthesiologists do not even gown up. I place the swan catheter myself. So I'm just a little confused on how you can say an RN can do the job of a CRNA. Can an RN manage a patient that has Aortic Stenosis or Mitral Regurgitation. There is so much you just don't know. I have learned so much in 28 months that I know I still have so much to learn.

Good luck to you.

rlwood1 · Jun 18, 2016

It is hard not to get very angry reading this post. The OP obviously has no idea what a CRNA does. Stock the room and prepare meds??? IF that was the case then anyone could come into the OR and "take vitals and do paperwork." A CRNA is an advanced practice nurse, if you think all CRNAs do is manage vitals and do paperwork then you need to do some more research before making such an ignorant statement.

pixiestudent2 · Jun 18, 2016

As a new CRNA, the responsibility of taking care of the patient is on the same level as the anesthesiologist. A regular nurse could not do the same job as a CRNA. What you are observing on the periphery of what a CRNA does, prevents you from seeing what the CRNA is thinking while taking care of the patient. The physiology, pharmacology, pathophysiology, and the anesthesia courses are what separates the RN from an CRNA. You have to know how that patients co-morbidities and medications are affected by your anesthesia medications and gases. Would an RN know how to manage a patient that has Local Anesthetic Systemic Toxicity from the medications injected by the surgeon? Would an RN know what medication is used for this toxicity? Would an RN know how to treat a patient with pheochromocytoma? Would an RN know the differential diagnosis between pheochromocytoma, Malignant Hyperthermia, Serotonin Syndrome, and Neuroleptic Malignant Syndrome. A lot of these syndromes have similar presentations but a CRNA would have the training to differentiate them and the medications used to treat them. So while you may see a CRNA going through the motions, you have no idea of what they're thinking and why they base the decisions of what med to give based on a patients medical history.
After having worked as an ICU nurse I thought I knew it all but until I went to anesthesia school and learned how drugs work at the cellular level, I have come to realize that I didn't know as much as I thought I knew. Also, going from the RN role to the CRNA role you are taught to practice as a provider and make decisions on your own, after all, some states allow CRNAs to work independently without an anesthesiologist.
As you mentioned about the doc coming to push drugs, where I work, the docs only supervise us 70% of the time so I get to do my own inductions by myself. Every practice is different. So yes, I think I deserve the salary I receive because I have the awesome responsibility of having someones life in my hands and the knowledge and training I have received has prepared me well for my job. Also, RNs can't float swan catheters but I can as a CRNA when doing hearts. Our anesthesiologists do not even gown up. I place the swan catheter myself. So I'm just a little confused on how you can say an RN can do the job of a CRNA. Can an RN manage a patient that has Aortic Stenosis or Mitral Regurgitation. There is so much you just don't know. I have learned so much in 28 months that I know I still have so much to learn.
Good luck to you.

This reminds me of something I heard about being a surgeon.. I forget where I heard it.. Maybe Grey's lol

But it went something along the lines of you can teach anyone where to cut to take a gallbladder out, the difference between them and a surgeon is when something goes wrong.

donnalaka · Jun 18, 2016

Ignorant or misinformed? CRNA are soooo in "charge" of that pt. I have been in MANY acute circumstances in 27 yrs critical care nsg that my patient was intubated, anesthetized, resuscitated, recovered by a CRNA! Open heart surgery Pts. are managed in the OR by CRNA ( specifically hand picked) they manage B/P with a plethora of med choices, each one accomplishing a different goal, they monitor neuro-status, oxygenation, in addition to ..... Wait for it....... anesthesia!! A VERY important componant! Do you want to wake up in the middle of an operation? Oh, not to mention all the "on-call" hours that are also part of the responsibility. IF you are even in the biz you need to educate yourself & realize there are many facets regarding different nursing roles, most especially the role of a CRNA. They deserve what they get for sure & probably more as most nursing positions! We need to stand strong together NOT belittle another nursing profession.

macanes, BSN, MSN, DNP, CRNA · Jun 18, 2016

You are sorely misinformed.

I am not trying to be disparaging when I say you are clueless on this subject. But, you have clearly not done your homework. Your institution is not the standard, nor do I think things are exactly as you perceive them to be, even at the location you observe every day.

please do some research, talk to some people, then come back and decide if yours was a valid question.

I don't recommend using this tone if you decide to question a military CRNA on is subject. Respect would be better.

Have a nice day.

ckmankins · Jun 19, 2016

A CRNA is still an advanced degree NURSE. So, stop acting like they are above and beyond the Physicians. And to the CRNA who hasn't seen an

MDA in 10 yrs, if you are practicing in the state of Texas, you are providing anesthesia under a Physician. So technically, you ARE NOT in SOLO practice. Come down from your High Horse, it takes the whole team to get a job done!!

Bluebolt · Jun 19, 2016

A CRNA is still an advanced degree NURSE. So, stop acting like they are above and beyond the Physicians. And to the CRNA who hasn't seen an
MDA in 10 yrs, if you are practicing in the state of Texas, you are providing anesthesia under a Physician. So technically, you ARE NOT in SOLO practice. Come down from your High Horse, it takes the whole team to get a job done!!

CRNA's are made of Stardust. You can not simply become a CRNA, you were born into the greatness. #destiny