California 1st in nation to require vaccines for health care workers

[hppygr8ful]

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Today, the State of California is taking decisive action to combat the spread of COVID-19 and protect vulnerable communities – implementing a first-in-the-nation standard to require all state workers and workers in health care and high-risk congregate settings to either ...

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California Implements First-in-the-Nation Measures to Encourage State Employees and Health Care Workers to Get Vaccinated

[missej2002]

On 8/12/2021 at 12:11 PM, toomuchbaloney said:

You still have the right to refuse the vaccine. Your hyperbole and fears don't change that fact. 

The vaccines are safe and effective.  Your fears about long term side effects are driven by opinion and speculation...it's like a conspiracy theory. 

Choosing to share unfounded fears and thinking that encourages others to delay vaccination is dangerous.  You could be responsible for a person's choice to forgo vaccination and that could result in their infection and death. Your words are irresponsible.  We don't need to know why you've decided to gamble with a vaccine preventable disease.

Stop sharing your vaccine fears. 

Uh, this is an open discussion. To discuss our opinions and views. I have stated I'm happy that the vaccine is available for those who want it. If you want it great, if you don't want it fine, but it should be everyone's choice. But don't look down on my opinion or views, just because they're different than yours.  I've never looked down on anyone's choice to be vaccinated, or not. I see everyone else expressing their opinions for why people should or should not be vaccinated. Everyone has a thing called free will. 

Also my daughter is fully vaccinated. And you know what, that was her decision, I didn't look down on her. In fact, I drove her to get her vaccinations.  I'm proud, that she did her research and made a decision she was comfortable with. The majority of my family is vaccinated, I'm glad they had the choice. So no sir I'm not discouraging those who want to be vaccinated.

It's just sick that if you don't agree with the majority you're  classified as ignorant, poor, paranoid or reckless.  

[macawake, MSN]

38 minutes ago, missej2002 said:

It's just sick that if you don't agree with the majority you're  classified as ignorant, poor, paranoid or reckless.  

I can see why you feel that way if you think that you are encountering pushback simply because you disagree with the majority. That’s not the reason though. The reason anyone’s viewpoints gets criticized in these vaccine threads, is when they don’t align with science. It’s as simple as that. It doesn’t have anything to do with the majority not thinking like you. However, I must say that I am happy and relieved that so many people have understood the benefits of vaccines. If more people thought like you, humanity would genuinely be up that infamous creek, sans paddle. You might feel that’s a mean thing to say, but I’m just stating facts. Your decision impacts the rest of us, and if a majority had decided the same as you have, then this pandemic would have been destined to drag on for an unnecessarily prolonged period of time, at the cost of many human lives. 

[missej2002]

1 hour ago, macawake said:

I can see why you feel that way if you think that you are encountering pushback simply because you disagree with the majority. That’s not the reason though. The reason anyone’s viewpoints gets criticized in these vaccine threads, is when they don’t align with science. It’s as simple as that. It doesn’t have anything to do with the majority not thinking like you. However, I must say that I am happy and relieved that so many people have understood the benefits of vaccines. If more people thought like you, humanity would genuinely be up that infamous creek, sans paddle. You might feel that’s a mean thing to say, but I’m just stating facts. Your decision impacts the rest of us, and if a majority had decided the same as you have, then this pandemic would have been destined to drag on for an unnecessarily prolonged period of time, at the cost of many human lives. 

Goodness. If everyone thought like me, would this pandemic still be dragging out? Or would it just be more fully vaccinated patients that are covid positive with one of the many newer variants of covid?  Then who could we blame? 

[macawake, MSN]

1 hour ago, missej2002 said:

Goodness. If everyone thought like me, would this pandemic still be dragging out? Or would it just be more fully vaccinated patients that are covid positive with one of the many newer variants of covid?  Then who could we blame? 

I really can’t decipher what you mean. I think you need to clarify your line of thought. 

You’ve chosen to not get vaccinated against Covid-19? Is that correct? 

If a majority had chosen to not get vaccinated then more people would die. Are you suggesting that’s not the case? You only need to look at the current mortality rates in countries around the world with high transmission, and where very few people have had the chance to get vaccinated yet. Or look what’s happening in those of your own states, where vaccine uptake is comparatively low. 

And yes, the higher level of transmission we have and the longer we have it, the more opportunities the virus will have to happen upon a mutation that is advantageous. 

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

18 hours ago, jive turkey said:

One person provided factual evidence about how COVID vaccines were developed and their objection to that process.  They have a problem with using fetal cells from aborted babies.  You don't.  Just because you don't doesn't mean their concern is illegitimate. It means you disagree with them and have a different perspective.  That's fair and merits an intelectual discussion rather than insults and name calling.  

The reason I have not quoted statistics is because my original post had nothing to do with proving anybody right or wrong about the COVID vaccine's effectiveness. I'm not sure how many different ways I can help you and some others understand my concern in this particular thread is that people aren't being open minded, having their arguments clouded by anger and frustration.  

"Intelectual?".  An error of irony.

[toomuchbaloney]

5 hours ago, missej2002 said:

It's just sick that if you don't agree with the majority you're  classified as ignorant, poor, paranoid or reckless.  

LOL

The unvaccinated are ignorant, paranoid or reckless when they refuse to vaccinate for ignorant or paranoid reasons...that is reckless.  

[toomuchbaloney]

3 hours ago, missej2002 said:

Goodness. If everyone thought like me, would this pandemic still be dragging out? Or would it just be more fully vaccinated patients that are covid positive with one of the many newer variants of covid?  Then who could we blame? 

Maybe the problem is that you don't understand even the basic science behind a pandemic, your comments reflect a rather simplistic view of this public health crisis. 

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

5 hours ago, missej2002 said:

Goodness. If everyone thought like me, would this pandemic still be dragging out? Or would it just be more fully vaccinated patients that are covid positive with one of the many newer variants of covid?  Then who could we blame? 

Yes, Scarlett.  If everyone thought like you, we will never get out of this mess,  Do you need someone to blame for fully vaccinated people not becoming hospitalized with a newer varient of Covid?  All vaccinated people can take the blame for that one.  The highly vaccinated people in Provincetown still understimated the amount of precautions to take, but unlike those in the South, didn't buy a vent......like those things that DeSantis is asking for by the hundreds. Moronic criminal.

[Soloist, LPN]

it is interesting to contrast this with natural medication which historically has been shown not to work but nurses are taught to listen and not be judgmental of different religious teachings or health practices. 

The anti-vaccine position for it causing autism is well known to be fake, and nurses have had to deal with that for years but this sort of hate is always stated to be ineffective by all the professional nursing boards and state regulatory boards. Why change known professional behavior when social science has shown it only causes more harm? 

In this thread I've been said to be anti-science because I believe some connection to fetal cells is unethical. That has no connection with science other then the articles I posted. It's a religious opinion, not an anti-science view since it is factual and founded on scientific research. How would this be any different then a Muslim objecting to a vaccine being grown on pig? Or would you treat the Muslim the same way you speak of me? What about a vegetarian that didn't want a vaccine using animal products? 

None of those positions are anti-science other then simply being unpopular. Could you say its hateful and unloving? sure you could say that. It's not however anti-science. 

Do you call the Amish anti-science because they don't use powerlines to their houses? or do you call them anti-science because they use alternative medication? 

Has anyone actually seen the requirements to qualify for a religious objection or are you just speaking hate to say there isn't any that should qualify?  https://www.prinz-lawfirm.com/our-blog/2020/december/the-covid-19-vaccine-is-here-a-look-at-religious/

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Under Title VII of the Civil Rights Act of 1964, individuals have the right to be free from discrimination on the basis of religion. As part of their religious beliefs, many individuals object to vaccines. Employers are required to accommodate religious observances and practices, unless doing so imposes an undue hardship on the business.

Religion” is very broadly defined and encompasses not only organized religions, but also informal beliefs. “Religion” under the law can also encompass non-theistic and moral beliefs.

In Chenzira v. Cincinnati Children's Hospital Medical Center, 2012 U.S. Dist. Lexis 182139 (S.D. Ohio, 2012), the court recognized that veganism, in some circumstances, may constitute a sincerely held religious belief. That court exempted an employee from a flu shot requirement.

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Once an employer determines that a true religious exemption exists, the employer must make an accommodation for the employee. Such accommodations may include reducing a mask requirement, modifying work duties to comply with social distancing, adjusting an employee’s schedule, or allowing an employee work from home.

From other websites, I've seen strong suggestion from a legal point of view that hospitals do not have to accommodate if this results in undue risk. The majority of people out there are fussing about this vaccine purely from unfounded health fears or conspiracies. None of them would qualify for an exemption if this legal firm is correct. 

[Robmoo, ADN, BSN, RN]

On 8/14/2021 at 10:42 AM, toomuchbaloney said:

LOL

The unvaccinated are ignorant, paranoid or reckless when they refuse to vaccinate for ignorant or paranoid reasons...that is reckless.  

Perhaps you should resort to even more name calling.  Perhaps it will persuade someone if you keep acting like the South side of a North bound mule.

BTW Vaxxed during the Pfizer trial.  Your welcome.

[Robmoo, ADN, BSN, RN]

If you are unvaxxed at this point you have chosen to receive your immunity to COVID19 the old fashioned way.  COVID19 isn't going way.  When we have gained immunity by vaccination and repeat infection COVID19 will fade into the pantheon of other coronaviruses that cause the seasonal cold and occasionally push the elder and/or most at risk over the edge.  No, the vaccine is not perfect, but it is far safer than catching COVID19 without any resistance.  Yes, since COVID19 infects the mucous membranes the vaccine isn't going to prevent infection only serious illness.  It will give one a huge jumpstart on resistance to the more serious complications of infection.  If you still don't want the vaccine, what are you afraid of? (Robert Lowth was wrong)

If your facility or state has mandate vaccine then you have a career choice.  Don't complain about it not being fair.  Here it Texas the only fair that we get is in Fair Park annually and everyone is invited.  Life isn't fair.  So, make your choice and deal with it.

[toomuchbaloney]

2 hours ago, Robmoo said:

Perhaps you should resort to even more name calling.  Perhaps it will persuade someone if you keep acting like the South side of a North bound mule.

BTW Vaxxed during the Pfizer trial.  Your welcome.

Using accurate descriptors is upsetting for some people. Oh well. I'm sorry that you disagreed with my assessment but I'm not changing the words...they are accurate.