A friend of mine was recently looking at utilization review positions and ran across this:
BSN from a 4 year program required.
So that means of course that an ADN who chose to advance their education to a BSN, will be excluded, even though they come with years of experience.
There will be no reason for ADN's to advance their education if they do not have any opportunity in other fields.
I'm sure this is money driven. Why else would an employer limit their applicants to 4-year program BSNs who may be new grads with little to no experience?
To me, the job posting is clearly stating that they do not want any nurses who obtained their nursing education via a "accelerated" or fast track program. Many organizations - mine included - are avoiding these grads due to previous issues.
I thought an ABSN was technically a Bsn?
I do not see a difference between an ABSN program and a regular Bsn program except most who enter ABsn already have the pre-reqs?
Sorry if someone has already pointed this out - but I think that the OP may have misinterpreted the job posting.
To me, the job posting is clearly stating that they do not want any nurses who obtained their nursing education via a "accelerated" or fast track program. Many organizations - mine included - are avoiding these grads due to previous issues.
So - if you have obtained your BSN via a typical completion program, you have invested MORE than 4 years in your BSN... you'd certainly be eligible.
I forgot about the Accelerated BSN programs. I also wonder what their viewpoint is on direct entry MSN programs.
Unfortunately, many figureheads view nurses who went to community colleges for their initial training as lower class people than youths who attended traditional baccalaureate nursing programs.
It's the fear of the "high school dropout" mentality. Certain groups tend to have high numbers of individuals with this mentality, and they include nurses who were adult learners, community college students, former LPNs, former CNAs, and people who actually did drop out of high school in their teens. Meanwhile, BSN students tend to not have this high school dropout mentality. They went to school straight out of high school, usually, and made it into competitive nursing programs immediately.
They also like traditional BSN graduates more because they are more likely to be youthful, former frat girls/boys who with high aspirations -- such as anesthesia school or management.
Not saying I agree with any of this (I am an ADN to BSN completion nurse), but just expressing my perception of the reality.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
I thought an ABSN was technically a Bsn?
I do not see a difference between an ABSN program and a regular Bsn program except most who enter ABsn already have the pre-reqs?
Many recruiters and nurse managers differentiate between traditional BSNs and ABSNs.
In some hospital systems, ABSN graduates and DEMSN (direct entry master of science in nursing) degree holders possess a certain type of reputation, and it isn't terribly positive.
I've listened as some unit educators, nurse managers, recruiters and other folks in the nursing profession gripe that ABSNs and DEMSNs have trouble comprehending the concept of the 'worker bee.' I've listened as nursing instructors and professors stereotype ABSNs and DEMSNs as individuals whose first careers failed to launch.
I will emphasize that there are many excellent nurses who earned ABSNs and DEMSNs. Unfortunately, some hospital systems give hiring preference to traditional BSN degree holders due to preconceived notions conflated with previous negative experiences.
Males are given preferential treatment in my area and others in (yet another) attempt to further promote nursing as a profession. Even newly graduated males get swooped up by employers very quickly, because there is a 'demand' for male nurses.
I also don't doubt that this may be the case in your area but that has certainly has not been my experience as a male RN. This is not to say that I have not faced discrimination: I am certain that I have, but I believe that it is age, rather than sex related.
While age isn't expressly listed on your resume, other things that must be shown provide a very easy way for recruiters to pretty accurately determine your age. In theory, I should be at least a reasonably attractive candidate for a nursing position since I have multiple degrees, including an AAS, BA, MBA and BSN, a very stable work history with a Fortune 50 company, a long record of volunteer experience in health care and am a decorated military veteran. Yet when I was in the RN job market, the number of job interviews that I got could be counted on one hand, with a couple of fingers left over. Of course, my lack of success could be due to other factors but age seems at least to me to be the most likely culprit.
Specializes in Certified Med/Surg tele, and other stuff.
Many recruiters and nurse managers differentiate between traditional BSNs and ABSNs.
In some hospital systems, ABSN graduates and DEMSN (direct entry master of science in nursing) degree holders possess a certain type of reputation, and it isn't terribly positive.
I've listened as some unit educators, nurse managers, recruiters and other folks in the nursing profession gripe that ABSNs and DEMSNs have trouble comprehending the concept of the 'worker bee.' I've listened as nursing instructors and professors stereotype ABSNs and DEMSNs as individuals whose first careers failed to launch.
I will emphasize that there are many excellent nurses who earned ABSNs and DEMSNs. Unfortunately, some hospital systems give hiring preference to traditional BSN degree holders due to preconceived notions conflated with previous negative experiences.
That is the biggest misconception I have ever heard. Who are these idiots? I work with many direct entry BSN that have no desire to place themselves on committees or even work an extra day. They are happy pulling their 3, 12 hr shifts and be done with it. It's the RN-BSN, or BSN-MSN that I'm seeing on committees (such as myself), driving PnP.
Many of the direct BSN feel they have done their work, and are finished. The RN-BSN usually has an agenda in mind, IMO, and are more willing to change their workplace. Gosh, every one of our nurse leaders, such as charge nurses, nursing supervisors, such as myself, are RN-BSN, or BSN-MSN nurses.
We are employees of the year, Daisy award winners, some of the BSN-MSN are even published.
I'm happy I work with a very large national organization that not only encourages the RN-BSN route but also many non traditional schools.
Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Many recruiters and nurse managers differentiate between traditional BSNs and ABSNs.
In some hospital systems, ABSN graduates and DEMSN (direct entry master of science in nursing) degree holders possess a certain type of reputation, and it isn't terribly positive.
I haven't noticed ABSN's in my area having a problem with image or reputation. However the DEMSN's sure do! The large heath system I work for won't even consider them for employment as new grads. Doesn't sat that on the hospital's web site but it's real.
When DEMSN was new there was a lot of excitement to hire them. After some real world experience with them the excitement faded rapidly and then grew to dislike among our nurse managers.
I think there are plenty of fine nurses who come from DEMSN programs. However I think they are paying the price for the attitude and actions of the early graduates.
Specializes in Certified Med/Surg tele, and other stuff.
What exactly is a DEMSN? Is this someone who went directly for their Masters without prior nursing experience? Educate me please. :)
I guess I should be glad I live where I do and educational snobbery isn't rampant. When we meet new nurses, nobody asks their educational background. Nobody in 20 some years of nursing has ever asked me if I was an ADN, BSN or MSN, and my corporation doesn't either, nor does any hospital in my surrounding area.
Specializes in Case mgmt., rehab, (CRRN), LTC & psych.
What exactly is a DEMSN? Is this someone who went directly for their Masters without prior nursing experience?
Typical DEMSN (direct entry master of science in nursing) candidates are persons who already possesses non-nursing BA/BS degrees. They want to bypass the BSN degree and earn the MSN degree as their entry into nursing.
Specializes in Certified Med/Surg tele, and other stuff.
Oh, interesting. So no nursing experience for the most part? I think if anyone is going to be my boss, they better have bedside experience that is fairly recent. Nothing worse than a person who has no idea how to run a floor telling experienced nurses what needs to be done.
Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Oh, interesting. So no nursing experience for the most part? I think if anyone is going to be my boss, they better have bedside experience that is fairly recent. Nothing worse than a person who has no idea how to run a floor telling experienced nurses what needs to be done.
That is exactly what part of the problem we experienced with DEMSN grads. Some of them thought that they should be in charge since they were masters grads after all. many expressed dismay when they found themselves working side by side and being paid the same as their ADN and BSN fellow new nurses.
However the real problem is the DEMSN APN programs. They spend a year or so being educated as RNs, then enter the APN portion of their program/ They are expected to work for a year or so after becoming RNs but before the APN portion. Many of these people took jobs in specialty units and accepted very expensive training knowing full well they intended to skip out on the unit right when they were about to actually become useful.
smartnurse1982
1,775 Posts
I thought an ABSN was technically a Bsn?
I do not see a difference between an ABSN program and a regular Bsn program except most who enter ABsn already have the pre-reqs?