Title says it all . Second semester baby nurse in clinicals at a major hospital.
Patients = Awesome
Most Nurses = Very sweet and helpful
Some nurses are rude, terse, horrible with patients, horrible with students and horrible with each other.
To those nurses I say this, please retire.
Its only a matter of time before management figures out they can live without you and hire some very hungry and very competent new grads that want to be there to fill your dusty shoes....
word...
sadly the vast majority of the time these happen to also be charge nurses....in charge of what? Misery?
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
the main point i was expressing in most of my posts is a recurring theme i see on the forums all the time. i suppose this post and thread was finally my breaking point to say something but it had more to do with a lot of the replies that i see in majority of posts where someone speaks up against these types of personalities. excuses are constantly made for these type of people, people get hyper-defensive about it as if they know they are guilty of the same thing or behavior. i don't disagree at all that the op did not go about things in a favoring manner at all. i am not going to presume to know what her motives are and if she is genuine or not or just wanted to start drama or anything of the sort.
the conversation following though was an opportunity for me to speak up on something i keep seeing. i have every "excuse" to be bitter and nasty and mean and ugly to people with what i have always had to put up with. i have had people like this be the same way to me for 31 years. mostly people that shouldn't and it's pretty much been consistent my entire life. if i were to be one of these bitter people i would bet a lot of people that know me would understand. but i'm not. i am a positive enthusiastic person that is respectful and kind and caring and treats people the way i hope to be treated. so i don't put up with all the bologna excuses why it's ok or understandable.
so anyway, my posts were more geared towards the overall topic at hand.
we see many, many posts where someone -- and usually it's either a student or a new nurse with no experience -- complains that the nurses they work with are mean and nasty to them. they go on to say that they always treat everyone with kindness and respect no matter what, they're always super caring and super compassionate to their patients and that everyone always likes them. it's the other nurse who is mean and nasty; they're not like that.
the thing is, many of us -- and i'm not throwing out any names here -- do not understand how others perceive us. i might think i'm being kind, caring and respectful but someone else thinks i'm mean and nasty. or maybe they think i'm being sarcastic. or perhaps they think i'm too cheerful to possibly be able to understand the gravity of the situation. someone might even think i'm overmedicated. i tend to believe that someone who posts that they're always unfailingly polite, respectful, kind, caring, compassionate is probably missing something somewhere. none of us are always perfect. heck, most of us are rarely, if ever perfect. red flags go up when someone tells me it's the other person who is the mean one all of the time or when someone insists that they always treat everyone the way they want to be treated.
maybe that other person doesn't want to be treated the way you want to be treated.
i don't believe that most failures in communication occur because one of the parties is always right and the other is always wrong. i believe that most failures in communication occur because people not only don't understand each other, but operate on their assumptions rather than try to understand one another. people's communication styles are different. you might think susie is being abrupt; she might think you're being vague.
i try very hard to be courteous, kind and caring. i'm a fairly direct person, though. i say what i mean and i mean what i say and i'd much rather someone tell me what they're thinking than talk in circles and hope i figure it out. or worse, go tell everyone else what they're thinking . . . . there are many people -- too many, i think -- who cannot handle direct communication and believe that anyone who gives them feedback without sugarcoating it is just plain mean. so an experienced nurse who is honestly trying to teach them something not only does not get credit for trying to help them out, but is knocked for failing to communicate with them in their preferred style. at at the same time they're flagellating that mean, nasty old nurse who won't help them, they're lamenting that no one wants to teach them anything. meanwhile, no attempt is made to communicate with that other person in her preferred style. failure in communication.
my bias -- and i'm admitting that i have one -- is that the person who insists they're unfailingly wonderful to everyone around them -- is probably not recognizing that there are times they're not unfailingly wonderful to everyone around them. and someone who refuses to recognize that they're not always perfect yet insists that everyone ought to always be perfect to them annoys the hell out of those of us who recognize that we're sometimes tired or cranky or short tempered and that sometimes other people are, too.
Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
I completely agree with most of what you are saying. As I have stated I know sometimes people have bad days, lord knows I have had them. Get short and snippy and what not. I know when it's me, after the situation I usually recognize I was a bit harsh or rude or whatever it was and I go and apologize when it was unwarranted. I can be rather rude to someone being mean and for that I won't apologize.
I too am an upfront person. I know not everyone likes me and I won't pretend they do. I have a very strong personality. But I do tend to give people the benefit of the doubt, I do treat people how I hope to be treated, I am a kind and caring person and I try to always be. I recognize I am not perfect. I don't want things sugar coated and I tend to take constructive criticism well. I know this stuff isn't only in my head because I am told the same thing by people that meet me. By Co-Nurses, Preceptor, CI and so on. I just had an HR lady I have never met in person speak very highly of me from just our phone conversation. Now generally I would never sit here and "brag" about myself. But I am just trying to make a point.
I also get that people take thing differently. I also get tired of the whining and crying and so and so was mean. I felt my nursing program was good and the instructors were good. My favorite instructors were some that others felt were to harsh and mean and so on and I would sit there like WHAT?!?! Really? Because I felt like they didn't coddle but they taught and taught well and you actually learned and retained.
So I actually agree with you on most of the way you feel. But it's also very true that these "bitter, mean, ugly (as in personality) hateful, negative" exists. That the student isn't always in the wrong or exaggerating. These people aren't limited to nurses and I would bet that I could point out 2 in my class that will end up being these very nurses. I think it's a personality thing, not a profession thing.
These are not people that just had a bad day or week. These are people that are constantly like this. There is no sometimes about it. Like I stated in a previous post about my own experience seeing this; when other people right away know exactly who you are talking about, it's not just a perception issue.
Not all students or new nurses that come here to vent about these people are at fault, or confused or in the wrong. I have seen veteran nurses vent about these same people as their co-workers.
ETA: I do also agree communication might help fix some of this. Although I don't think communication will help chronically negative nasty people. But I do feel some of these people that are just more bullies then anything, if someone stood up to them it might actually stop. The nurse I mentioned that a classmate had that was very much a bully. My preceptor had commented that he needed a preceptee like me, because I would be the one to stand up to him and not tolerate it. I don't think I am "tough" or "special" but from going up like I did (which I know you get) you tend to learn to stand up for yourself and not be treated like that. I wouldn't have put up with him being that way to me student or not and I would have pulled him aside privately and attempted fix it.
Being a nurse can be stressful at times...so many things go on at one time, people expect you to know everything, so many different patients, families, doctors to deal with. And you never know what people are going through that makes them bitter. You don't know what goes on with them outside of work. Maybe they are just tired, stressed out, or something.
Depending on how long you have been a nurse and what situations you have experienced I guess sometimes you may get lost in the real reason you became a nurse...I do know that I love helping people and I want to make a difference in the lives of others and give a little piece of me to someone who needs it....I just think that some of the more experienced nurses have seen and dealt with situations that many other nurses have not yet encountered....However, I do believe that if they are bitter and angry that should not be taken out on the patient afterall, they are the reason that we became nurses and they need us,..With that said I will not pass judgement on anyone until I have walked a mile in their shoes...We all have one goal and that is to care for the sick with compassion and empathy and give hope to those that may have lost it...I give kudos to all the nurses out there and hope that we all remember every patient is someone's mother, daughter, husband or wife and they are counting on us to ease their pain....
Really interesting thread. The one thing that the OP stated that hit me like a brick between the eyes was the statement that he/she left their previous management position because of the disconnect between personal and corporate values. I truly believe that if you were experiencing moral and spiritual turmoil in today's non-health care corporate world, being a manager in a health care setting may drive you to consider suicide. I can't count the threads I've read here on AN about the reality shock new nurses and new nurse managers experience when they realize the ideals and values nurtured in school turn out to be some really ugly realities...that per management we're here to make money, not hold hands and comfort, no matter how much we want to or try to do so. Compassion fatigue and burnout are so prevalent in nursing because we expect ourselves and those we work with to be saints all the time- and that is such an impossibility. I had my moment of clarity about 3 years into my nursing career and accepted that I and those I work with are all deeply flawed in many respects and so are my patients. Seeing everyone as human beings makes the inevitable failures and disappointments much more bearable. I encourage the OP to weigh in again when they have 2 years of experience as a bedside nurse. I know I would be very interested to hear their outlook then and see if any opinions have been formed or changed. Good luck and god bless.
This thread is like a good book I can't stop reading.
Sometimes students just can't "win" here. They get reamed for posting their opinions when experienced nurses vent. Yet when they vent in their own thread people come in reaming them for that too. (usually the same ones that don't want them ruining their vents) A lot of this stuff being vented about is not even isolated to nursing. Yet unless they have been a nurse for 10 years they can't have an opinion about people being mean and nasty. They have to empathize why that person is mean and nasty.
Your posts, not just the aboved mentioned quote, made me reevaluate my initial response to the OP's post. I did not acknowledge enough that --YES-- there are indeed nasty nurses out there. In fact, thinking back to nursing school, there was a fellow nursing student(now a nurse) that was a complete creep. She would ridicule people in class, behind their backs of course, and was generally a mean, nasty person. She wasn't friendly to anyone except those in her "clic". I obviously wasn't one of them. Anyway, my point being, no, there is not an excuse for being nasty. But, I realize that there is a difference between being downright nasty and being bitter. Someone can be bitter and a little blunt with people; that does not make them a nasty person. If that is the type of person the student is complaining about, than I would argue the student needs to toughen the skin a little and SUCK IT UP. Work as a nurse yourself and then stop wondering why nurses aren't waltzing around with a hugh on their face. If it is the nasty, horrible person that treats patients and co-workers like crap, then yes...I could see the OP's point of view. But the original title "Bitter dried up nurses that need to RETIRE" immediately puts nurses on the defensive because well, it is, in and of itself, ironically, mean.
I truly believe that if you were experiencing moral and spiritual turmoil in today's non-health care corporate world, being a manager in a health care setting may drive you to consider suicide.
Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
This thread is like a good book I can't stop reading.
Your posts, not just the aboved mentioned quote, made me reevaluate my initial response to the OP's post. I did not acknowledge enough that --YES-- there are indeed nasty nurses out there. In fact, thinking back to nursing school, there was a fellow nursing student(now a nurse) that was a complete creep. She would ridicule people in class, behind their backs of course, and was generally a mean, nasty person. She wasn't friendly to anyone except those in her "cliche". I obviously wasn't one of them. Anyway, my point being, no, there is not an excuse for being nasty. But, I realize that there is a difference between being downright nasty and being bitter. Someone can be bitter and a little blunt with people; that does not make them a nasty person. If that is the type of person the student is complaining about, than I would argue the student needs to toughen the skin a little and SUCK IT UP. Work as a nurse yourself and then stop wondering why nurses aren't waltzing around with a hugh on their face. If it is the nasty, horrible person that treats patients and co-workers like crap, then yes...I could see the OP's point of view. But the original title "Bitter dried up nurses that need to RETIRE" immediately puts nurses on the defensive because well, it is, in and of itself, ironically, mean.
Completely agree!! We had a couple of those in class too. I had 2 very close friends in Nursing School and we got the "pleasure" of having one of these girls in our clinical. I remember telling my best friend how bad I felt for her Co-Nurse and what will eventually be her patients and co-workers and especially those "under" her. It was amazing that I could be on a unit for 3 weeks and have a great experience and get along with everyone. Yet of course when she spent one day there she was saying how mean and rude and nasty the nurses there were. I have no doubt her attitude was a major contributing factor there. She was also one of those students that felt they should just test out because they know more then everyone.
I do think the truly mean, bitter, negative nasty people are a very very small minority. But they are there, in all walks of life and they are that way all on their own no matter what someone does.
I have for the most part had great patients. There were a few that I got a bad handoff; as in the nurse and student with them had nothing but bad things to say about the patient and what a PITA they were. I tried to problem solve right off the bat on what was causing this and I didn't have any of the same experience with the patient. Sometimes you do have to take a step back, realize it's not personal and maybe even see what you can do to help. Not just with patients but co-workers. 9 out of 10 times in my experience it works and the person either realizes how they are being and changes, or your positive attitude rubs off on them and they loosen up. Once in a while there is that one person that is just content on being miserable and sucking the life out of those around them.
Be very careful that in your quest to provide good customer service you don't provide bad patient care. That can and does happen. The customer isn't always right when they are the patient and you need to be mindful of that. Something that could make the patient very happy could also have dire health consequences. Be open to learning from those with more experience. Good luck in your new endeavors.
Some of the nurses that provide the best customer service in my unit I wouldn't let take care of my dog.
The patients love them, but patients don't care about the quality of care they receive, they only care about the quality of service.
It's our job to make sure the CARE is good, but unfortunately, non clinical management types are making that near impossible.
Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.
. . .the thing is, many of us -- and i'm not throwing out any names here -- do not understand how others perceive us. i might think i'm being kind, caring and respectful but someone else thinks i'm mean and nasty. or maybe they think i'm being sarcastic. or perhaps they think i'm too cheerful to possibly be able to understand the gravity of the situation. someone might even think i'm overmedicated.
i love it when things like that are sorta slipped into posts and more when the topic is otherwise so serious. :)
i will say that at least the confrontational tone pivoted almost immediately to a conciliatory approach was a manipulation but pretty much admitted it with two posts in the first 15 here. perhaps there was nothing good on tv when she took a break from studying so decided to come on over and poke the allnurses anthill as it were and go pop some lotta butta popcorn in the microwave. as i mentioned before - the problem with that sort of entertainment is that it requires you have enough people angry or offended to bother to respond - and well - to me it just isn't cool to want to do that to people because i'm bored.
. .its only a matter of time before management figures out they can live without you and hire some very hungry and very competent new grads that want to be there to fill your dusty shoes....
word...
aaahhhhhhh . . . pleeeaaaase don't eat your old you very hungry and very competent nursing student you've driven the icepick of fear into my soul! :chair:
by the way - not sure what you meant but you certainly don't strike me as a "baby nurse" but the juxtaposition of that appeal to be mothered and protected against the tone of your first post is pretty jarring.
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Anyway, my point being, no, there is not an excuse for being nasty. But, I realize that there is a difference between being downright nasty and being bitter. Someone can be bitter and a little blunt with people; that does not make them a nasty person. If that is the type of person the student is complaining about, than I would argue the student needs to toughen the skin a little and SUCK IT UP. Work as a nurse yourself and then stop wondering why nurses aren't waltzing around with a hugh 
on their face. If it is the nasty, horrible person that treats patients and co-workers like crap, then yes...I could see the OP's point of view. But the original title "Bitter dried up nurses that need to RETIRE" immediately puts nurses on the defensive because well, it is, in and of itself, ironically, mean.
:redpinkhe:yeah:
Ruby Vee, BSN
17 Articles; 14,051 Posts
we see many, many posts where someone -- and usually it's either a student or a new nurse with no experience -- complains that the nurses they work with are mean and nasty to them. they go on to say that they always treat everyone with kindness and respect no matter what, they're always super caring and super compassionate to their patients and that everyone always likes them. it's the other nurse who is mean and nasty; they're not like that.
the thing is, many of us -- and i'm not throwing out any names here -- do not understand how others perceive us. i might think i'm being kind, caring and respectful but someone else thinks i'm mean and nasty. or maybe they think i'm being sarcastic. or perhaps they think i'm too cheerful to possibly be able to understand the gravity of the situation. someone might even think i'm overmedicated. i tend to believe that someone who posts that they're always unfailingly polite, respectful, kind, caring, compassionate is probably missing something somewhere. none of us are always perfect. heck, most of us are rarely, if ever perfect. red flags go up when someone tells me it's the other person who is the mean one all of the time or when someone insists that they always treat everyone the way they want to be treated.
maybe that other person doesn't want to be treated the way you want to be treated.
i don't believe that most failures in communication occur because one of the parties is always right and the other is always wrong. i believe that most failures in communication occur because people not only don't understand each other, but operate on their assumptions rather than try to understand one another. people's communication styles are different. you might think susie is being abrupt; she might think you're being vague.
i try very hard to be courteous, kind and caring. i'm a fairly direct person, though. i say what i mean and i mean what i say and i'd much rather someone tell me what they're thinking than talk in circles and hope i figure it out. or worse, go tell everyone else what they're thinking . . . . there are many people -- too many, i think -- who cannot handle direct communication and believe that anyone who gives them feedback without sugarcoating it is just plain mean. so an experienced nurse who is honestly trying to teach them something not only does not get credit for trying to help them out, but is knocked for failing to communicate with them in their preferred style. at at the same time they're flagellating that mean, nasty old nurse who won't help them, they're lamenting that no one wants to teach them anything. meanwhile, no attempt is made to communicate with that other person in her preferred style. failure in communication.
my bias -- and i'm admitting that i have one -- is that the person who insists they're unfailingly wonderful to everyone around them -- is probably not recognizing that there are times they're not unfailingly wonderful to everyone around them. and someone who refuses to recognize that they're not always perfect yet insists that everyone ought to always be perfect to them annoys the hell out of those of us who recognize that we're sometimes tired or cranky or short tempered and that sometimes other people are, too.