Administering Tylenol to a friend

[Em31200]

Hi everyone, I'm a second semester nursing student and today in class my professor said something interesting I had never considered. We are learning about medication administration currently and her question was: "Your best friend is at your house and complains of a headache. She asks you for some of your Tylenol. Do you give it to her?" Almost everyone said yes that it was ok because it was your friend, not in your job setting, and she was a consenting adult capable of making her own decision to take the medication. Our professor said that was wrong and that you can't give any medication to your friend because you are not a licensed prescriber and you could lose your license if something happened your friend. She also said that same applies to your own children. So what are you supposed to do if your kid is sick and needs cough medication? You're always accountable if something bad were to happen?

[ixchel]

No they wouldn't. There is no law on the books anywhere that a parent, whether a nurse or not, cannot give their child an appropriate dose of an OTC medicine. It doesn't make her attempting to be "a prescriber" any more than Susie schoolteacher is attempting to be a "prescriber" when she gives her child an appropriate dose of children's Tylenol.

And if my child has a reaction to an OTC med that I gave her that (to my knowledge) she was not allergic to, how is a lawyer getting involved? I'm going to sue myself? My husband is going to sue me? Let him try.

This is just silly. There is ZERO liability for a nurse to give his or her own child an appropriate dose of an OTC medicine. That's why they are available over the counter!!!!

(It was meant to be silly. The poster said this in jest.)

[Libby1987]

I was at a soccer tournament years ago. One of the players on the team, 13ish, was having obvious seasonal allergy symptoms and was asking everyone if they had any kind of allergy med. We were traveling out of the area and her parents weren't available. I was the only licensed nurse in the parent group and the only one who had OTC allergy meds with me, being a sufferer myself.

What would you have given her, if anything?

[Horseshoe, BSN, RN]

(It was meant to be silly. The poster said this in jest.)

No, she didn't. She came back and said though she didn't agree, she wouldn't put it past some lawyers to try to make an issue of it.

[Bill E Rubin]

Many moons ago, when I was but a young college student with two cards(Red Cross 1st Aid and Red Cross CPR) in my wallet, the ink barely dry on them, I worked as a first aid team member at the local concerts and sports games. In those rooms, we had numerous supplies, among them the industrial-size bottles of Tylenol, ibuprofen, aspirin, etc., to include antinausea and other OTCs also.

We were told that if someone came in requesting "something for a headache", or similar, we were to put the box with all of these in it on the desk in between them and us.

That is, we were allowed to make various items available, but we were not permitted to advise which they should take, nor the quantity that was allowed. We were allowed to tell them to "read the bottle" (or to read it to them) if asked that.

Obviously, our training was not that of a certified or licensed professional, but the rationale of not dispensing medication was the basis. I'm not sure if that was based on an attorney's advice or just something someone thought was a good idea. That, however, was in a so-called healthcare setting, and for strangers, with whom we had not even a passing acquaintence, let alone an assessment, etc. They came in with a complaint and a request for some quasi-specific remedy, and we were allowed to make what we had available.

The very concept that as nurses we could not, if we chose to do so, do similarly for a coworker, friend, or even a visitor w/r/t OTCs is ludicrous at best, and ridiculous, that is, worthy of ridicule, is the mildest term I can conceive for a prohibition on medicating my own child.

As a student, I would not tell that instructor either to get bent or to pound sand, but I can guarantee that s/he would never make a statement in class that I would believe without independent verification, ever again.

SMH with facepalm

Bill

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

Checking a pulse ox is what a prudent nurse would do

I can see danger for the nurse in doing the pulse ox. I think doing so could be construed to indicate that the nurse is establishing a nurse-patient relationship, with all of the responsibilities attendant thereof.

Is she using her own machine? Perhaps the machine isn't functioning correctly and gives a false normal reading. Based on said reading, the person who is being checked decides not to self-medicate (like using Albuterol) or seek medical care, then suffers harm (turns out to have a PE, or is later found to have CA, or whatever). Has the machine been properly maintained/calibrated and is there a maintenance log?

I know of a case in which a nurse was, every shift they worked together (a few times each week), giving a requested OTC med to a coworker until finally the nurse suggested that the person see a doctor for the persistent c/o and told the coworker she was not comfortable continuing to give the OTC med. Fortunately, the coworker did see a doctor and the very serious condition that was found was able to be fully cured.

Said nurse was guilty of giving stock med that did not belong to her. I don't think she was diagnosing or prescribing, but a lawyer could probably make a case for that - or worse.

OK, flame away.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

That's generally true; people can sue others for whatever they want, despite having no chance of winning. There are exceptions however the law specifically makes someone not liable, good samaritan laws are one of these exceptions; no pay=no liability.

Are you saying that, for example, you stop at an accident scene, render aid, and do not bill the person you help for your services that you are protected from lawsuit for proven error/doing something a prudent nurse would reasonably do in the same situation and the behavior caused harm?

[Here.I.Stand, BSN, RN]

I was at a soccer tournament years ago. One of the players on the team, 13ish, was having obvious seasonal allergy symptoms and was asking everyone if they had any kind of allergy med. We were traveling out of the area and her parents weren't available. I was the only licensed nurse in the parent group and the only one who had OTC allergy meds with me, being a sufferer myself.

What would you have given her, if anything?

I'm guessing that the team had some protocol for medical treatment in the parents' absence. I personally wouldn't medicate someone else's child without permission, nurse or no. I'd defer to the team staff. I would liken that situation to how a school nurse is licensed and the healthcare professional in the school, but can't give a student meds without the parents' written permission.

[A&Ox6, MSN, RN]

Many moons ago, when I was but a young college student with two cards(Red Cross 1st Aid and Red Cross CPR) in my wallet, the ink barely dry on them, I worked as a first aid team member at the local concerts and sports games. In those rooms, we had numerous supplies, among them the industrial-size bottles of Tylenol, ibuprofen, aspirin, etc., to include antinausea and other OTCs also.

We were told that if someone came in requesting "something for a headache", or similar, we were to put the box with all of these in it on the desk in between them and us.

That is, we were allowed to make various items available, but we were not permitted to advise which they should take, nor the quantity that was allowed. We were allowed to tell them to "read the bottle" (or to read it to them) if asked that.

Obviously, our training was not that of a certified or licensed professional, but the rationale of not dispensing medication was the basis. I'm not sure if that was based on an attorney's advice or just something someone thought was a good idea. That, however, was in a so-called healthcare setting, and for strangers, with whom we had not even a passing acquaintence, let alone an assessment, etc. They came in with a complaint and a request for some quasi-specific remedy, and we were allowed to make what we had available.

The very concept that as nurses we could not, if we chose to do so, do similarly for a coworker, friend, or even a visitor w/r/t OTCs is ludicrous at best, and ridiculous, that is, worthy of ridicule, is the mildest term I can conceive for a prohibition on medicating my own child.

As a student, I would not tell that instructor either to get bent or to pound sand, but I can guarantee that s/he would never make a statement in class that I would believe without independent verification, ever again.

SMH with facepalm

Bill

When I worked on the medical team at the NYC marathon, only the nurses, resident physicians, physician assistants, nurse practitioners and physicians were allowed to distribute APAP, ibuprofen and the like. The team was comprised of many specialties including the above mentioned as well as EMTs, paramedics, ATCs, podiatric students and residents, PTs, and LMTs.

Only the licensed staff was allowed to document treatment and release as well.

[Bobjohnny]

I can see danger for the nurse in doing the pulse ox. I think doing so could be construed to indicate that the nurse is establishing a nurse-patient relationship, with all of the responsibilities attendant thereof.

The post prior to the one that you quoted stated that the person they would be checking the pulse ox on was a patient. So I must agree, not checking a pulse ox on a patient (if you think that you need one), is less than prudent.

[Kooky Korky, BSN, RN]

The post prior to the one that you quoted stated that the person they would be checking the pulse ox on was a patient. So I must agree, not checking a pulse ox on a patient (if you think that you need one), is less than prudent.

Sorry, I misunderstood the situation. I agree that a prudent nurse would do the pulse ox on a patient. Thanks, Bobjohnny.

[CrunchRN, ADN, RN]

I have a bottle of Ibuprofen in my office and employees come in all the time and help themselves. I also occasionally hand out bandaids. These are cognitively intact adults and I have no issue with doing this. I check BP's etc too. Even the occasional 02 sat. If anything is abnormal I tell them to call their MD. I am a nurse who was taught critical thinking and if you use that skill and common sense then everything is fine. This is a university setting.

[Dacatster, ADN]

I say you give us her email and bombard her her for being so stupid and trying scare tactics. Then I say you give us the dean and president email so we bombard them for hiring a fool to teach something as important as nursing. I am sick of this crap from instructors. I dealt with it too many years ago.