How are Schools getting away with pumping out so many new graduates for no jobs? - page 6
Question: How are Schools getting away with pumping out so many new graduates for no jobs? Thoughts: My first thought on this is that there is a lack of education or better yet lack of... Read More
Jan 10, '13Quote from dirtyhippiegirl*** But nursing _IS_ different. There are not employers of history majors out there lobbying state and federal governments to use tax payer money to vasty increase the number of history grads. There is not a lot of history major employers who see their profits cut as a result of having to treat and pay their history majors decently. There is nobody putting false and self serving "hisory major" shortage propaganda out there.Meh. When my sister didn't get into the x-ray tech school that she applied to, her college career counselor convinced her that she would be able to get a job as a museum curator with a Bachelor's in History. She'll be lucky if she gets a job at a gas station with that degree, but don't tell her that.
Yes, the people who run and work for colleges and universities have a vested interest in enrolling students for potentially useless degrees - including students like my sister who would better benefit from a more practical education.
It's not just nursing.
And, honestly, like someone mentioned earlier -- I feel worse for the people who graduate with law school-sized debt and can't find a job.
Jan 10, '13I'm a nursing student who resides in Chicago, now unless my city is exempt from the areas where job opportunities are scarce in nursing, I have to say that just from my observation, everyone that I know that has graduated in 2012 alone have already gained employment. I know a lot of people that has graduated in the past few years that are employed in the field. I am changing careers I'm a licensed hairstylist of eight years and I now have found the time to go to school to pursue my dream of working in the medical field. I have plenty of clients that are RN's even my Mother-in-Law is one. Not to mention the good amount of cousins I have that are RN's as well. All of them are actively employed. So is it safe to say that Chicago may not be one of those cities?
Jan 11, '13Quote from PMFB-RNYou're looking at what is happening to nursing education from a narrow perspective. What is happening in nursing education is merely a small part of a broken educational system, fostered by a general attitude among the middle and upper middle class that you need a university education - preferably a four year degree - to "succeed." Yes, mainstream media, nursing recruiters, etc. are pushing a false nursing job shortage out there. (Although, honestly, I haven't heard nearly as much about it over the last year in the media?) But I don't see how that is any different from the same outlets also stating that a four year degree is necessary for a basic, entry level position or any different from my sister's career counselor telling her something that is blatantly false.*** But nursing _IS_ different. There are not employers of history majors out there lobbying state and federal governments to use tax payer money to vasty increase the number of history grads. There is not a lot of history major employers who see their profits cut as a result of having to treat and pay their history majors decently. There is nobody putting false and self serving "hisory major" shortage propaganda out there.
This isn't about history majors or nursing majors. It's about all majors. There's a ton of money tied up in government incentives to churn out grads of all stripes. Back to work/retraining programs are also big in the hospitality and technology industries, which have also suffered major downturns in the poor economy. For-profit colleges churn out plenty of grads with useless degrees in IT, teaching, and legal-type areas. Community college graduates - esp. those with technology-related degrees - are finding that a bachelor's degree is required for entry level positions.
All employers reduce profit when they treat and pay their employers decently, obviously.
Jan 11, '13"All employers reduce profit when they treat and pay their employers decently, obviously."
This is not true, some employers have found treating and paying their employees decently attracts better employees which results in higher profits through either (or both) more productive employees (in any of several ways) or avoiding the costs associated with crappy employees.
I agree with the rest of your post. It is like cosmetics, home ownership, and band in grade school.
Cosmetics (all types, including teeth whitening and hair coloring) make people look better compared to people who who don't do them. But once everyone is doing them, we have the same range of attractiveness that we had when no one was doing them except now we are spending billions of dollars per year and umpteen hours.
Home ownership and band in elementary school and college educations are associated with many benefits but the politicians and educators often forget that many of those benefits are the result of the traits that lead to them as much or probably more than anything else about them.Last edit by Saysfaa on Jan 11, '13
Jan 18, '13I think publicly funded(perhaps just community colleges?) actually do have to answer for the number of nurses they're training, at least in Texas.
I was speaking to our DON about the job crunch and the flood of nurses and she told me every year they have to evaluate how many of their students actually attained jobs in the field and adjust the number of seats based on the findings. My program was prepared to cut seats (we have 40 spots per year) but found that almost all students who were actively looking were employed within a year. Fewer and fewer are finding employment in hospitals (we're an ADN program) but the employment is still there.
I will say this: nursing is stupid. Looking around at other health professions like PT/PTAs, RT, MD who tightly control the market (limiting spots in programs/hospitalsto keep demand high), they are so much better off. I don't know how our boards let this chaos happen, but now us newbies are paying the price for greed and panic. The powers that be could have put CONTROLLED effort into upping interest in the nursing field and avoided this free-for-all. Say what you want, but there should be NO Everest or Devry RN programs. There should be no clinical spots available for unaccredited programs which would, of course, make them non-existent. Programs shouldn't be opening in this environment where clinical time is almost impossible to secure. Students are doing clinicals in every place BUT hospitals due to there being too many programs with too many students.
Our profession is better than that.
And I didn't read responses, so sorry for any redundancyLast edit by Stephalump on Jan 18, '13
Jan 27, '13i look at it this way:
1)You have those who want to go into nursing no matter what: shortage or no shortage, this is my dream job, this is what I want to do-dam what anyone else says, media says
2) Nursing is ok, Id rather much study anthropogly because I find people and culture fascinating, however I know the odds of finding a job in anthrolopgy (without going for a masters) are slim to none so I will go with the "safe" major-nursing. (Don't mean to pick on anthro majors, just using that as an example)
3) The days where one could get hired right out of college regardless of degree (because the employer was willing to train the grad) seem to be less. Yes maybe your cousin with the Socioloy degree who graduated in early 2000s, late 90s got hired for some office/business/cubical type job and he is doing a fine job (because again employers are willing to train)-that is no longer the case. The employer can now be picky, why waste resources training when I can just hire one of the many accounting, business, finance grads etc...? So as in case 2 why take a chance in majoring in something else, I will just for Nursing because that is where the jobs are
And of course you have the media hyping nursing like there is no tomrrow (though that shift may change to IT soon) adds to the influx of nursing and prenursing students. There is no doubt it is bloody tough out there for most college grads (regardless of major) entry level postions require 2-3 years of expereince, even getting unpaid internships is incredibly diffcult and working that job you had in high school, post college seems to be the norm- hence many are going to nursing because it is the closest thing they can see to "guarnteed" employment