LPN'S Supervising RNs'? How would you feel? - page 7

I would like to start out by saying that I do respect LPN's and I am in favor of advancing in everyones careers. I am an RN on a PCU. Our hosp changed the "directors" title to Clinical Care... Read More

  1. by   txspadequeenRN
    Some of the posters on here seem really surprised and offended that this kind of thing occurs. Even though this is not a hospital thing it is a everyday thing in LTC. To me it does not matter if it is a LVN or RN that is my supervisor but I expect that person to know that job in and out and be able to run things smoothly. All of my superviors have been LVN's (except for the DON) and these are nurses that have worked in the facility and know the floors , the procedures and policies. I would much rather have a experienced LVN than a new or inexperienced RN for a supervior anyday. To me this is all about letters behind the name and not about who can carry out the job duties.
  2. by   Alexsys
    Quote from Marie_LPN
    I know of at least one school that is. I've never seen so many arrogant, naive, self-entitled, prissy people in life as i have coming from one particular school. I've overheard their clinical instructor say "Concentrate on paperwork. That's what BSN nurses do, non BSN nurses are the floor nurses, you're their superiors, you hold the higher degree." And the students act as such. And i can only imagine what kind of reality check these people will get when the come to the real world, thinking that their 'floor nursing' job' is nothing but paperwork.

    I'm sure it's not an isolated attitude. There's probably more out there just like it.
    Hmm, not entirely true. When I went to ADN school respecting the nurse that you work with, (LPN/LVN's too) was enforced. I was paired up with an LPN and I actually enjoyed that clinical experience and I learned alot in that one day than I did the entire semester and she made it fun. I am now in a BSN crossover program and honestly, I HATE paperwork, but if I ever want to be a CRNA someday, I have to make a pit stop at my BSN first. I already have 6 years of crit care, but that one day I spent with that LPN was one I will never forget
  3. by   Alexsys
    Sorry..double post...
  4. by   Marie_LPN, RN
    Quote from Alexsys
    Hmm, not entirely true.
    I was speaking about that particular school only, not all of them.
  5. by   Sandi0302
    Quote from banditrn
    Yes, education is important - up to a point. After that, experience takes over. I don't care as much about the # of letters after a name as I do about a nurse's proficiency in what they are doing.
    I agree. I am an LPN and work in an assisted living facility. I was in one situation with two RN SUPERVISORS who are very experienced (20-30 yrs each and i respect them both) where we were required to do CPR. I was an aide in an ER for four yrs. I was ready to go, they both looked like they were scared to death and hesitated to get going.
    When i was only an aid in the ER, I was bringing a pt back from triage once and questioned where the pt was being put (critical side vs non). I brought it up to the Dr...he agreed with me. The nurse was worng. Everyone is human, yes, but nursing is also about guts, instinct and talent also, not just book smarts. No matter what title you have, it doesnt mean you are better/not better than someone else.
  6. by   Alexsys
    Quote from Marie_LPN

    I'm sure it's not an isolated attitude. There's probably more out there just like it.
    Oh, sorry. This sentence threw me off a bit..
    Last edit by Alexsys on Oct 15, '06
  7. by   sheilagh
    i have worked as a unit mgr ( I am an LPN ) where I had RN's on my unit and therefore under my direction. The distinction here in florida is that the LPN can supervise the unit and make assingments etc...she/he is responsible as supervisor to coordinate any ER's and manage all daily functioning of the floor and the nurses, however in specific clinical instances the RN cannot differ to the LPN for clinical judgement and she/he is responsible for her scope of practice. I have had to orient many new RN's to the floor,facility, and with new grads to nursing in general, but wherever the scopes of practice differ an RN had to orient them.
    Perfect example: 3-11 shift, I am unit supervisor and an RN with 4 years experience comes running to me to say pt is unresponsive. I run and do assessment and knowing she is diabetic first check glucose which is 14 ! pt had central line so I follow our protocol and get the push Dextrose from E-kit and hand it to RN. She looks at me and says " what do I do? You give it!" my response....LOL " I can't only an RN can push and thats you and your pt !" I stood beside her and had to talk her thru it as she seemed scared and unsure. The pt came around and we followed out the rest of protocol. Afterwards everyone said I shouldn't have told her what to do as clinically the RN was my superior...all I saw was that I had no other RN's immediately available and a pt in crisis. The RN was counseled after and chose to leave bedside nursing.
  8. by   PANurseRN1
    I guess the people around you thought it would have been better to just let the pt. code.

    Maybe that nurse didn't have experience with central lines. Then she's supervised by someone who is not licensed to administer meds through a central line.

    This is one example why having an LPN "supervise" an RN is a bad idea. No matter what the LPN's title is, at the end of the day the RN has a higher level of accountability. So there should be someone there for the RN to defer to for advice/assistance with unfamiliar procedures.

    It's also incumbent on the facility to make sure that staff are oriented properly. It's not necessarily the RN's fault she didn't know how to give a push med through a central line; maybe she never worked with central lines before. It is the facility's responsibility that she wasn't properly oriented.

    And a new grad should be oriented by someone with equivalent licensure, period. How on earth does a new RN learn how to be an RN when she's being oriented by LPNs?

    I'm sure I'll get flamed and labeled anti-LPN. Nothing could be further from the truth. I've worked with many LPNs who were excellent nurses. But having an LPN in a supervisory relationship over an RN is just a set up for a myriad of problems.
  9. by   PANurseRN1
    Quote from sheilagh
    i have worked as a unit mgr ( I am an LPN ) where I had RN's on my unit and therefore under my direction. The distinction here in florida is that the LPN can supervise the unit and make assingments etc...she/he is responsible as supervisor to coordinate any ER's and manage all daily functioning of the floor and the nurses, however in specific clinical instances the RN cannot differ to the LPN for clinical judgement and she/he is responsible for her scope of practice. I have had to orient many new RN's to the floor,facility, and with new grads to nursing in general, but wherever the scopes of practice differ an RN had to orient them.
    Perfect example: 3-11 shift, I am unit supervisor and an RN with 4 years experience comes running to me to say pt is unresponsive. I run and do assessment and knowing she is diabetic first check glucose which is 14 ! pt had central line so I follow our protocol and get the push Dextrose from E-kit and hand it to RN. She looks at me and says " what do I do? You give it!" my response....LOL " I can't only an RN can push and thats you and your pt !" I stood beside her and had to talk her thru it as she seemed scared and unsure. The pt came around and we followed out the rest of protocol. Afterwards everyone said I shouldn't have told her what to do as clinically the RN was my superior...all I saw was that I had no other RN's immediately available and a pt in crisis. The RN was counseled after and chose to leave bedside nursing.
    This situation would certainly qualify for "nurse eating," BTW. If it indeed really happened that way. I hope that RN found a job where she was able to be properly precepeted and supervised.
  10. by   Alexsys
    That was not a competent nurse that you worked with IMO. But you should be commended for at least helping a fellow nurse out of a bad situation.

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