LPN to RN through testing? - page 3

I just feel that I'm going to get a lot of flak on this, but here goes...Since there's such a nursing shortage, why not let LPN's take the RN test with some parameters? I just thought of a few: 5... Read More

  1. by   RazorbackRN
    Quote from ocankhe
    No, I don't think this is a good idea. In addition to many good points mentioned above, in some states LPN training has zero clinical time in a hospital setting. Albeit not all RN jobs are in the hospital and at the bedside but it still needs to be part of your basic education in the profession.
    Really? I've never heard of a program not having ANY hospital clinicals. I'm an RN, but still I just can't believe that they wouldn't at least spend some time in the hospital arena.
  2. by   PANurseRN1
    Quote from JohnBearPA
    Zero clinical time in a hospital setting? Are you kidding me? Look into this, and I'm sure you'll see that ANY LPN program has to meet standards as set by the State BON. Also, from my own personal experience, both as a student and as an LPN on several floors that had RN students from several local colleges, LPN programs generally (at least in my home state) have MORE clinical hours than the RN programs.
    I've also found that the PN students I've had on my floors not only knew much more at clinicals than their RN counterparts, but were more apt to ask to help with or witness procedures. That may be because the PN students seemed a bit older and may have had families to support, and took school very seriously. I'm not knocking the RN students, but as a whole, to my experience, they seemed younger and talked about "going out partying" and "what mom made for dinner last night", while the PN students didn't chit chat, they seemed very intent on learning.
    Again, this may be why they chose the PN program, as many in my class worked full time while attending school from 8-3 everyday and also had families at home to cook, clean, and spend time with. I myself chose the PN program as a jumping off spot, planning on going for my RN in the future when I have more time, more money, and the ability to put much more time into the studying I'll need to do. The PN program gave me marketable skills, for the shortest, tho most intense, period of time.
    As for my PN program, we had clinicals from week 2, to the week of graduation a year and 3 months later. We attended clinical 3 days a week, from 6am to 3pm, and had classroom from 8am to 3pm on the other two days a week. It's true we had off for the summer, but additional classes in Pharm were offerred, and most of us took them. Our clinicals ranged from med-surg, OB/GYN, NICU, Ped's, Ortho, MH/MR, Tele, OR, and had several observations in drug/alcohol dependency, emotionally and learning challenged children, School for the Deaf, etc.
    From my understanding, and from what my RN friends have told me, they never had an 8 hour day, either in the classroom or on the floor. That may vary by geographic area, and I'm only speaking for the area I went to school in.
    Not knocking anyone, but PN programs offer as many clinical hours "on the hospital floor" as the State BON says they have to, and I've NEVER heard of a program that offerred few or none!
    The original poster probably didn't mean it, but this reeks of bringing up the RN vs LPN thread, which has already been beat to death. We all need to work together, accept our provisions of licensure, and get the education we can or need to make ourselves happy in our working positions. Go back to school for a bridge program, as I planm to soon, or stay as a PN, but just be happy at your work, and do the best job you know how to do, and be the best NURSE you can be, whether it's PN or RN.
    If you didn't want this to be an "RN v. LPN" thread, then why did you spend 75% of your post putting down students in RN programs?
  3. by   JohnBearPA
    Quote from mc3
    no, you are correct johnbearpa. i absolutely do not want to make this an rn-vs-lpn post! just thinking of ways to help fill a need...i will admit, as i originally said, i do not like the idea of overseas nurses coming here to take jobs that could be filled by u.s. citizens - qualified, competent ones, that is...
    i must agree with you on that. it seems to be a trend in a few metropolitan areas to pay for overseas nurses to come into local facilities and staff them. i'm all for providing work for people that want it, but i think it's a responsibility to provide jobs for qualified professionals in the us before importing people from other countries. i can see the problem, but i can't grasp a solution to that one.
    maybe more active recruitment, better working conditions, and benefits, treating nurses as the professionals we are, and above all else, pay us what we deserve. also, work together, quit the back-biting i've witnessed at some facilities, and let's prove the old "nurses eat their young" adage wrong. these are some reasons i went to agency nursing, as i no longer get pulled into some of these disputes. other than that, and i believe i've just scratched the surface, what can we do to retain qualified nurses and recruit new ones into our wonderful profession?
    i personally love what i do and couldn't imagine doing anything else with my life, but how do we get that idea out to the next generation?
    there's way too many problems here, whether they be financial on the part of hospitals and ltc facilities, management issues, training lower-paying staff positions to do our skilled jobs, etc. where do we even begin?
  4. by   txspadequeenRN
    Yes I agree.... Thats exactly what I need......

    Quote from Gods child
    There is a weekend LPN-RN program at a Community College a few hours from me (they are in class all day, I think its from 8-5 or 9-4). I think more programs like that would benefit some LPN's wishing to become RN's.
  5. by   vonxojn
    I agree with you MC3. I have been nursing for almost 6 years now. Most co-workers who work with me don't know that I'm an LPN until they see my badge. They assume I'm an RN simply because of the way I Nurse. I also see a lot of LPN's that have the skill and the knowledge to practice :spin: but not the title. I would love to be able to sit down and take the test based on my knowledge without the schooling if possible. The idea is a far fetch idea for now. Oh Well....
  6. by   rgroyer1RNBSN
    Quote from TazziRN
    Question: do LVNs who graduate from a community college come out with an AS degree?

    Actually Tazzi I do know a couple of community college LPN programs where you can pick you can either choose an LPN diploma or an AAS in practical nursing
    :gandalf: happy halloween all!
  7. by   rgroyer1RNBSN
    A nurse is a Nurse is a nurse whether it be PN or RN, and yes the LPN stdents have tons of hospital clinical time infact I have alot of friends that are LPN's I work with in the er.
  8. by   Sandi0302
    My LPN course had MOST of the clinicals in the hospital, and , like i said in my previous post, we learned a lot more that we are actually able to practice. Nothing out of our scope of practice, but in NJ, it seems hospitals are phasing out LPNs and not letting us use our skills.
  9. by   dream'n
    I'm an LPN and think I could probably pass the RN boards, but I would be terrified to jump into the RN role without the training. I see their job and wouldn't want to do it without formal RN training. LPNs are rigorously trained as are RNs, but my program didn't cover IVs at all. We also didn't train to triage or have the assessment skills of an RN. Yes many LPNs have learned these skills by working with RNs and on-the-job, but the formal training is still necessary.
  10. by   Laught3r
    Quote from TazziRN
    Question: do LVNs who graduate from a community college come out with an AS degree?
    I am an LPN and I graduated from North Dakota State College of Science and I have and AAS (Associate in Applied Science) degree.
  11. by   caroladybelle
    Quote from mc3
    If they didn't pass, well, do what the other students do and try, try again.
    You're not going to pass the test if you're not up on the latest information, and it would happen whether or not you were an RN or LPN or BSN or MSN for that matter!

    I just think it makes sense in light of the nursing shortage. There won't be a tremendously long wait to get into an LPN-RN school. It would make a hugh difference in patient care. It would also help to keep jobs from being filled from overseas workers. We really should try to hire citizens first, anyway. It seems the RN organizations would be diametrically opposed, but I don't understand why. After all, they are the ones that are crying the most about a nursing shortage and demanding action.
    And, BTW, why don't state nursing organizations allow LPN's to joint?? They are nurses, right???


    Just a thought..
    mc3
    Kind of simplistic, I know, but I've always wondered about it...
    And while we are at it, since there is such a shortage of family practitioners/surgeons/internists, and many positions are being filled by foreign MDs, why don't we let paramedics/RNs with certain qualifications/experience test to be MDs - after all, that why we could give more jobs to Americans and solve the healthcare deficit????

    Sorry but your arguments do not hold water.

    Rn is not merely a matter of experience or ability at tasks, it is the education and knowledge behind it. And RN schools teach with a different focus.

    The other issue is THERE IS NO SHORTAGE OF NURSES, merely a shortage of those that will put up with the poor conditions under which we work. When will hospitals address the issues of poor conditions.
    Last edit by caroladybelle on Oct 30, '06
  12. by   mc3
    caroladybelle,
    Thanks for your input, but I don't honestly feel I deserved the sarcasm. I'm only asking about LPN's taking the test, that's all. Yes, you can extrapolate to all levels, but that wasn't my question. And, as far as the nursing shortage goes, I agree, there's a shortage of nurses because no one wants to do the job....More nurses = more help = less stress.
    And, no, I am not trying start an RN vs LPN thing.
    Just trying to think of a somewhat simple solution that, bottom line, will affect all of us in the very near future.
  13. by   onlylatina
    I totally agree with every word you had to say. I know of way too many LVN's who do a just as much or a much better job in some places than some RN's I have seen. I'm sure i am not the only one who thinks this way.Those of you who take offense ...look again at what the person had to say....it's not about LVN's vs. RN's its about patient care,staffing demands and quality of nursing.
    Quote from mc3
    I just feel that I'm going to get a lot of flak on this, but here goes...Since there's such a nursing shortage, why not let LPN's take the RN test with some parameters? I just thought of a few:
    5 years minimum experience
    letter of recommendation from supervisor
    must be IV certified ahead of time
    More?
    They would take the same test, study from the same study guides that are available. If someone felt especially weak in say, med conversions, they could take an algebra review or brush upon on what they learned in school beforehand.
    If they didn't pass, well, do what the other students do and try, try again.
    You're not going to pass the test if you're not up on the latest information, and it would happen whether or not you were an RN or LPN or BSN or MSN for that matter!

    I just think it makes sense in light of the nursing shortage. There won't be a tremendously long wait to get into an LPN-RN school. It would make a hugh difference in patient care. It would also help to keep jobs from being filled from overseas workers. We really should try to hire citizens first, anyway. It seems the RN organizations would be diametrically opposed, but I don't understand why. After all, they are the ones that are crying the most about a nursing shortage and demanding action.
    And, BTW, why don't state nursing organizations allow LPN's to joint?? They are nurses, right???


    Just a thought..
    mc3
    Kind of simplistic, I know, but I've always wondered about it...

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