Apparently per the EEOC's guidelines employers (not just healthcare related) can mandate vaccination of workers. The exception is a "sincerely held religious belief" or a covered disability. Just found out this morning that a chain of for profit LTC/SNF's are rolling out a Covid vaccine mandate for all direct care staff or face indefinite unpaid administrative leave. I am a heavy supporter of vaccination and of the new COVID vaccine and in fact am due to get one in early January. But I am doing so of my own volition. My facility encouraged all workers to sign up for a vaccine and provided information sessions and it's been really effective at getting people to sign up.
Even though I would disagree with someone's choice to not vaccinate, I don't believe they should be mandated at this point.
And that's the debate in a nutshell, pun intended!
Educated, science driven people and you bring up guns. How do you get to guns from Covid?
And do you guys still have guns? I thought LA Pierre stole all your money and spent it on yachts and fake tans etc ????
I am not an NRA member. Guns come up because they are the last line of defense against a totalitarian governments that seek to mandate things like Covid shots or interment camps. They are part of the essence that has maintained freedom in these here to fore United States.
I am not an NRA member. Guns come up because they are the last line of defense against a totalitarian governments that seek to mandate things like Covid shots or interment camps. They are part of the essence that has maintained freedom in these here to fore United States.
Really? We want to regulate guns and give people back their freedoms by allowing everyone to vote and creating equal rights for all, but apparently you think we harbor thoughts of interning you in camps and doing what?
Does Gandhi instigate violence? Or, Does Hitler?
You have to stop dealing in headlines in your head and evaluate what actually makes sense. You're ICU, ER, right? Which of those patient's population are likely to present more of a violent outburst? Who is more likely to own a gun and shoot you, Sarah Palin or AOC?
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
22 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
It was meant to be a joke. The implication was that anyone willing to even "talk" to someone like me is probably not representative of the overall body of health professionals even at the facility that I am referencing. Therefore the data may be of limited value.
Keep in mind you will need lots of guns to get us there since many of us are quite well armed. and will not go without a fight. Honestly, at this point I just wish that Texas, Florida and a few others states that mostly see it from a liberty perspective could just leave the union and let those who wish to live under authoritarian rule do so. We could do it our way and you could do it your way. I would even be happy to not leave the state.
Why do you want to break our republic rather than vaccinate against a deadly disease that has killed more than half a million of your fellow countrymen?
Really? We want to regulate guns and give people back their freedoms by allowing everyone to vote and creating equal rights for all, but apparently you think we harbor thoughts of interning you in camps and doing what?
Does Gandhi instigate violence? Or, Does Hitler?
You have to stop dealing in headlines in your head and evaluate what actually makes sense. You're ICU, ER, right? Which of those patient's population are likely to present more of a violent outburst? Who is more likely to own a gun and shoot you, Sarah Palin or AOC?
Are you getting what I am saying?
No, the vast majority of gun owners are law abiding. I don't think either Sarah Palin or AOC would be a threat. Guns are also highly regulated. Even though I've been through at least five courses in Florida the process of getting the proper pictures taken and then getting the fingerprint cards at the Sheriff's Office is more than enough to keep me from having a permit to carry. Even my OCD SO doesn't want to use her days off to get the picture's taken and visit the Sheriff's office (or elsewhere) for the finger prints and we are people who have NP licenses in four states and RN licenses in at least six states,, and run a business.
It was meant to be a joke. The implication was that anyone willing to even "talk" to someone like me is probably not representative of the overall body of health professionals even at the facility that I am referencing. Therefore the data may be of limited value.
Keep in mind you will need lots of guns to get us there since many of us are quite well armed. and will not go without a fight. Honestly, at this point I just wish that Texas, Florida and a few others states that mostly see it from a liberty perspective could just leave the union and let those who wish to live under authoritarian rule do so. We could do it our way and you could do it your way. I would even be happy to not leave the state.
Personally I would vote for that. I feel I have little in common with Trumpistas and voter suppressionists, evangelicals and irresponsible gun owners etc. Anyone who doesn't embrace science and worships hypocrisy should have their own country IMO. Because you people scare me.
What happens when God tells you to kill the abortionists and the LGBTQ people or non white people etc? Let's see if Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio pass the European white muster?
5 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
No, the vast majority of gun owners are law abiding. I don't think either Sarah Palin or AOC would be a threat. Guns are also highly regulated. Even though I've been through at least five courses in Florida the process of getting the proper pictures taken and then getting the fingerprint cards at the Sheriff's Office is more than enough to keep me from having a permit to carry. Even my OCD SO doesn't want to use her days off to get the picture's taken and visit the Sheriff's office (or elsewhere) for the finger prints and we are people who have NP licenses in four states and RN licenses in at least six states,, and run a business.
Wonder if all the mass shooters go through the same checks?
Why do you want to break our republic rather than vaccinate against a deadly disease that has killed more than half a million of your fellow countrymen?
Bottom line I don't want to take the vaccine. I remember arguing after 911 with conservative friends who supported the Patriot Act. I argued that I would rather see a 911 event in every city in the United States over giving up more of our privacy to the government. Even if this virus killed 10% of the population rather than the much smaller than 1% that have perished I would still be opposed to mandatory vaccines. Look at the millions of lives that were lost to oppose tyranny? We literally took the world to the brink of nuclear destruction during the Cuban missile crisis rather than succumb to Soviet threats and control. There is nothing more precious than liberty.
Personally I would vote for that. I feel I have little in common with Trumpistas and voter suppressionists, evangelicals and irresponsible gun owners etc. Anyone who doesn't embrace science and worships hypocrisy should have their own country IMO. Because you people scare me.
What happens when God tells you to kill the abortionists and the LGBTQ people or non white people etc? Let's see if Ted Cruz and Marco Rubio pass the European white muster?
Wonder if all the mass shooters go through the same checks?
Most mass shooters did go though checks. Background checks don't work. Evil exists and bad people do bad things. More people however die from falls every year and knife attacks than die from rifles. At least we agree on one thing. You live how and where you want to live and I will live how and where I want to live. You can have California and Oregon and I will take Texas and Florida.
Most mass shooters did go though checks. Background checks don't work. Evil exists and bad people do bad things. More people however die from falls every year and knife attacks than die from rifles. At least we agree on one thing. You live how and where you want to live and I will live how and where I want to live. You can have California and Oregon and I will take Texas and Florida.
I disagree. When I work, we practically have no incidents. Because, I take the time to assess the potential trouble makers or the distressed and get on the PRN's early or make the necessary changes to ensure that potential problems are handled.
Most violent people are easily identified! Our country is all about the money which is why lobbyists mould the laws through the legislators regardless of the consequences.
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
47 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
Bottom line I don't want to take the vaccine. I remember arguing after 911 with conservative friends who supported the Patriot Act. I argued that I would rather see a 911 event in every city in the United States over giving up more of our privacy to the government. Even if this virus killed 10% of the population rather than the much smaller than 1% that have perished I would still be opposed to mandatory vaccines. Look at the millions of lives that were lost to oppose tyranny? We literally took the world to the brink of nuclear destruction during the Cuban missile crisis rather than succumb to Soviet threats and control. There is nothing more precious than liberty.
You didn't answer my question, you ranted about unrelated issues.
Who would you break our republic because of a life saving vaccine that is unlikely to be mandated by the republic?
Specializes in NICU, PICU, Transport, L&D, Hospice.
51 minutes ago, myoglobin said:
Most mass shooters did go though checks. Background checks don't work. Evil exists and bad people do bad things. More people however die from falls every year and knife attacks than die from rifles. At least we agree on one thing. You live how and where you want to live and I will live how and where I want to live. You can have California and Oregon and I will take Texas and Florida.
I noticed that your claim narrows firearm deaths to rifles only while also providing exactly zero data or citation to support it's position. A similar attempt made by a Florida state senator also didn't go over well.
Our society takes steps to make our public places as safe as possible from fall risk.
Take a deep breath.
These vaccines are going to speed the end of this pandemic, whether or not you personally accept the science or the patriotic duty to mitigate and vaccinate. That's how herd immunity works. It just takes longer and there's more suffering when there are lots of people pushing against the common good.
You didn't answer my question, you ranted about unrelated issues.
Who would you break our republic because of a life saving vaccine that is unlikely to be mandated by the republic?
No, not on that one issue alone. But I was having a call with a long time friend who is "left of center" and he literally racked off at least eight issues from guns, to covid passports, to abortion rights, to the voter ID's, anti school choice (and several others) and he was honestly astonished that I saw it different from him. So no if they stay voluntary I'm fine I might even ultimately get one as I did with the annual influenza shot when I worked ICU (I remember reading a study that looked at long term death rates being the same or lower which convinced me for those that take the flu shot). However, my point is that I think that the "chasm" between the "The Trumper's" (like myself I actually felt Trump was a bit further left than I would have liked) and the left of center has grown so wide that I'm not sure we can ever get along. If we had a really strong Federal system ( think, California could be California and Texas can be Texas) then maybe it could work. But you have major corporations (many if not most) pushing the left of center ideology to the point that I am not sure the Republic is sustainable. Honestly, I breaking up in to a Swiss style confederation were an option (where they cannot even convince the Cantons to join the EU) I would support that.
I noticed that your claim narrows firearm deaths to rifles only while also providing exactly zero data or citation to support it's position. A similar attempt made by a Florida state senator also didn't go over well.
Our society takes steps to make our public places as safe as possible from fall risk.
Take a deep breath.
These vaccines are going to speed the end of this pandemic, whether or not you personally accept the science or the patriotic duty to mitigate and vaccinate. That's how herd immunity works. It just takes longer and there's more suffering when there are lots of people pushing against the common good.
What you see as patriotic duty to mitigate and vaccinate I feel is the right to choose what you put in your body. Just as you probably don't see elective abortion as genocide against minorities (as I do) by left of center elites who seek to create a dystopian, Orwellian society. Different people different perspectives. II don't even say that your viewpoint is inferior or incorrect. Rather I propose it involves a different value set and analysis of a complex set of issues, values, mores and ethics. Just as I opposed The Patriot Act after 911 stating then that I would prefer every city being hit with a 911 style attack over the further erosion of privacy I would not support mandatory vaccination even if it meant 10% of the population perishing from Covid even if that include me and my family. Like the Jews of ancient Israel who took their lives on Masada rather than submit to their Roman opponent,
I would prefer to perish free than live in great wealth under the technocratic chains of a totalitarian society.
myoglobin, ASN, BSN, MSN
1,453 Posts
I am not an NRA member. Guns come up because they are the last line of defense against a totalitarian governments that seek to mandate things like Covid shots or interment camps. They are part of the essence that has maintained freedom in these here to fore United States.