Unrealistic nursing students

[dnsonthego]

Our facility was asked to host a group of soon to be graduated nursing students.

The students are taking a class in nursing leadership so they were assigned to spend the day with the nursing department's leadership. The students were provided a breakfast reception and were allowed to shadow the departments nursing managers. The chief of nursing gave a talk to the students to welcome them to the profession.

The students did not come prepared to meet potential hiring managers. Unprofessional clothes/demeanor, playing with cell phones/texting, asking about vacant positions etc.

I was asked to tour them around the facility so that they understand the complexities of the hospital. I had the opportunity to talk with them as we walked through the facility.

I was shocked how many of them were second degree nursing students had completed graduate school prior to entering nursing school. I was troubled as they did not understand that nursing positions for new grads are very difficult to obtain. They were all under the impression that if they had a BSN, the jobs they wishes for would be there for them.

I was taken aback at how these soon to be graduates did not understand what nursing was about and what the role of the nurse is.

One of the students has a degree in English and a graduate degree in Communications. She stated that she was a Journalist and a freelance writer but she could not get work so she entered nursing so that she could become a medical writer.

Another student stated that he had an undergraduate degree in Public Policy and a Law degree but could not obtain work so he went into nursing to develop knowledge about healthcare. He saw himself a the hospital's attorney.

Three other students had undergrad degrees in Business but did not find work in their field so they took nursing hoping to be a hospital manager. The other students in the group were less vocal about their backgrounds and future plans. I know it is more common today to see second career nurses but my concern is that these students really do not understand what nursing is all about.

I really could not see any of these students working as a staff nurse. Nursing is hard work and you are standing on your feet for 12-13 hours trying to complete your assigned tasks.

I know that times are tough for everywhere but I wish that the nursing schools would be more honest to the students about what nurses do. If this students came into nursing with a desire to work as a nurse, I would be excited. What I sense is that these students tried something else, did not succeed and now see nursing as a quick way to a check. Making the situation more difficult is the fact that in our area (NYC) clinical jobs are few and that management jobs are very hard to attain.

Who put the idea into our nursing student/attorney head that he will walk out of school and obtain a legal job in the hospital because he has a nursing degree? Who told the writer that a nursing degree would now make her a medical writer after she failed to succeed in her previous attempts at being a writer/journalist?

I feel bad because the school they go to charges over 80K for a 15 month accelerated BSN. That is a lot of money and these students have to put out. You would have thought they would have researched nursing before they signed up....I am shocked at how misguided these students are.

To sum up, I smiled as they spoke and gently told them that nursing positions today are competitive especially in NYC as their is presently a surplus of nurses. Do you think I did the right thing or should I have addressed their unrealistic expectations?

[Emergent, RN]

I did. But, she doesn't know how unrealistic necessarily their goals are. It doesn't matter how unrealistic their goals are anyway. It's their life. Why do we need to judge these people for their choices? Or care why they got nursing degrees?

People just get a little annoyed when encountering a cocky nursing student, that's all. The OP wanted to share.

All I can say is, I'm glad I'm not a student anymore. I recall that when I was doing my prerequisites I told a nurse that "I'm going to go for my RN because I don't want to deal with much poop". I guess I was going to have my minions do that!

[liketheairport]

People just get a little annoyed when encountering a cocky nursing student, that's all. The OP wanted to share.

All I can say is, I'm glad I'm not a student anymore. I recall that when I was doing my prerequisites I told a nurse that "I'm going to go for my RN because I don't want to deal with much poop". I guess I was going to have my minions do that!

There are those in ALL academia. It's really fun in criminal justice. "They're criminals, they deserve nothing." Or "all those people should have the death penalty anyway, they're just criminals." Wow. That's a lot of compassion there. But, that's a whole different can of worms.

[Emergent, RN]

There are those in ALL academia. It's really fun in criminal justice. "They're criminals, they deserve nothing." Or "all those people should have the death penalty anyway, they're just criminals." Wow. That's a lot of compassion there. But, that's a whole different can of worms.

Those whipper snappers. If they'd had had some good lickings when they were young, they'd be a lot more respectful of their wise elders.

[NuGuyNurse2b]

LOL the chair of our department told us even in orientation that it's going to be a long road with no guarantee of a job market. We were told there were 90 of us, statistically, half of us wouldn't be there by the end of the program, and of the ones who are graduating, we're competing with each other as well as every other nursing program, whether it's RN or BSN, that are releasing its horde of graduates in the spring. And because we're a 2-year program, it is strongly implied that the BSN's will get the prime spots because that's what hospitals want now. So we're pretty much aware of the situation, and we're still going for it!

[NuGuyNurse2b]

I did. But, she doesn't know how unrealistic necessarily their goals are. It doesn't matter how unrealistic their goals are anyway. It's their life. Why do we need to judge these people for their choices? Or care why they got nursing degrees?

I agree. the whole texting thing is rude, I understand that. But ambition should not be frowned upon. I felt it was unnecessary for the OP to judge those people on that aspect of their behavior. People go into nursing for different reasons - some people want a career change, some people want the higher income, some people actually have always wanted to go to nursing school but for whatever reason never had that opportunity and now they're finally pursuing it, etc. Asking about vacancies is not unprofessional; those people saw an opportunity to get feedback from people who may have the information that they inquired about. It's their livelihood we're talking about, of course they'll be hungry for any bit of advantage.

[PMFB-RN, RN]

I did. But, she doesn't know how unrealistic necessarily their goals are. It doesn't matter how unrealistic their goals are anyway. It's their life. Why do we need to judge these people for their choices? Or care why they got nursing degrees?

It's simple. We do so in the hope that others who contemplating making life changing decisions based on unrealistic expectations may learn. Those of us who have been in health care a long time are in a position to know how unrealistic the expectation expressed in the OP are.

I didn't notice any judging going on in this discussion so far.

[sneeds]

Where is nursing purgatory Sing Song? I really don't get the whole second degree, 10th degree... who gives a #$#. A person is a nurse is a nurse. So what? Kids in college can choose nursing for money or passion and person at 70 can choose it for money or passion. What matters is that people get the opportunity to see nursing as it really is. I remember asking nurses on the floor prior to becoming a nurse (family scene) They were like, " oh, yeah it's awesome". Now I know that a nurse can get called out if they complain about working conditions. Ex. Patient X states that nurse Z could not fill their water because too much going on... So, now I know why those nurses told me that. And no nurse wants to seem like they can't handle their job. SOOOOO... do you tell the nurses to be how it really is? It's a no win situation. Even if you tell mgt that you have too much to do... "Oh, so you're saying you don't have the time mgt. skills to do your job?" You can't win.

[AZ_LPN_8_26_13]

And some of us did...

So what?

Mine was even worse in the minds of many... I was a DEMSN...I had all that, too, but I ended up in nursing purgatory for my first three years. If I'd known that's where I'd have ended up, I may not have done nursing. I certainly questioned myself a number of times.

Finally, though, things did break my way... and my only regret about nursing is that I didn't do it 20 years earlier (which would mean that I'd be starting to eye retirement instead of trying to figure out how to milk another 20 years out of this gig)

Straight up: I came looking for a secure job, that I wouldn't hate, which paid good money... check, check, and check.

Actually that's my only real regret - that I never thought of or considered doing this 20 or 30 years ago. Back then a medical career in a hospital just wasn't on my radar - not even a little bit. I never really spent much time in or near hospitals, doctors or nurses in my younger years. I did have a few older aunts who were nurses back like in the 1950's and 60's and they got out of it to do something else - my take from them was that nurses back then weren't treated very well and not respected, especially by doctors. And there's nothing wrong with second-degree nurses. I had a bachelor's degree in management before I started back to nursing school.

[HInurse2b]

Ok, so this one brought me out of lurkdom (a lurkdom so long, I forgot my account info and had to create a new one - but I digress...)

Who are you to determine whether someone's ambitions are "realistic" or not? I am a second career, post graduate nursing student. For many, if not most of us - we've already had full careers in other occupations, and are simply looking for something new. (I'm retired military, and collect full retirement pay, so I'm not desperate for a nursing paycheck by any stretch.) Nursing is, and has been a personal goal of mine for quite a while.

I'm sorry those new grads didn't come across as sufficiently humble enough for you, but truth is - they already have bachelor's and masters degrees (as well as experience) in other fields. All of their eggs are NOT in the nursing basket, so if the bottom falls out, they're qualified to do something else. There's a certain level of confidence that comes in knowing that. Their dreams and goals are just that - THEIR'S. It has nothing to do with you, or what you think is feasible or appropriate.

[iPink, BSN, RN]

I'm a second career changer. When I was in my ABSN program, majority of us had plans to only do 1-2 years on the floor and then move on to grad school to become NPs, with some wanting to become CRNAs or move into Administration. Fast forward, some student got jobs through great connections within 1-2 months after graduation, while others had to struggle like many other graduate nurses and submit resume after resume until we landed our jobs 6-12 months after. Then when we finally start working on the floor, we reflect back on our "plans." What was I thinking? There is such a gap between nursing school and real life nursing. I still touch base with some of my classmates and grad school is not even a thought at this point.

I now cringe when I hear new nurses say they're going to grad school a year after being on the floor. The first year, you're just scratching the surface.

[JustKeepDriving]

When I started taking college seriously I was going to independently save the freaking world!

Goals change though - however I'm still going to save the damn world... maybe next year.

I'm totally with the OP in that it's always best to act and dress professionally when meeting employers. However - I disagree with the idea of trying to crush someone's dreams. Even if they aren't entirely unrealistic.

Like, When I was 6 I wanted to be a unicorn. I would still kind of like to be a unicorn... but I know that it isn't going to happen. Not realistic.

However, these individuals dreams aren't unrealistic. They can be accomplished. They might take time and experience, but eventually they can be done. If they really expect that they're going to be hospital lawyers, medical writers, nurse managers - right off the bat without some flexibility then they might be in a bit of a shock. However, there is nothing unrealistic about having those goals to work themselves up to.

Another thing - goals change. ALL THE TIME. My goals when I started college, even my goals right before graduating nursing school... are wayyyy different now. Experience changes everything - but everyone has to start somewhere and striving to be superman is much better than reserving oneself to be peon #199004821.

My goals have ranged from wanting to be a semi-homeless beat poet type self exploring drifter "student" (soooo much Absinthe) to getting Ph.D in Psychology and doing research my whole life. There is also part of a holistic medicine degree that I never quite finished up in Canada.... I also got accepted for graduate school for social work - one for medical social work and one for forensic social work... I turned down both and finished my prerequisites and went for an ABSN instead (It fit my personal goals of saving the world better).

I have also wanted to be various types of nurse... and nurse-psych-criminology-pubic health type hybrid thing.

SO MUCH CHOICE!

However, the job market does dictate things so forensic psychiatric nurse it is! And some days I LOVE IT... others well... I flip flop between thinking the PA, PMHNP, FNP might be an even more awesome way to save the world.....

The fun part about life isn't necessarily being there... it's getting there.

Maybe it's the fact that I've spent so much of my time in school that I've become desensitized by the lofty dreams of college students - or I truly understand that sometimes... Individuals with big dreams - Sometimes accomplish them. And those dreams - especially those that want to save the freaking world... can do a whole lot of good for a whole lot of people. Sometimes all it culminates in is a really good coping skill to get through a not so great day at work... but motivation is never a bad thing.

[jadelpn, LPN, EMT-B]

OP, the students you encountered are undergrad, grad and now nursing students, at least one degree of which is to the tune of $80K. If you stay in school, then student loans can be deferred. There are some nursing positions one can find that you can get student loan forgiveness for working in certain areas. Most of these students have been in school for 6 years or so. Sounds like professional students to me. Especially if they think appropriate to be playing on their cell phones, and being generally disrespectful. This group will be rather interesting in clinicals.....