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dnsonthego's Latest Activity

  1. May I ask what school in NYC has 75% of the graduates working? I teach in NYC and I have colleagues all over. Everyone is seeing very few openings for new nurses. NYC is undergoing a serious change. Hospitals are merging, units consolidating and a push for more out patient care. Plus, NYC is glutted with nurses---both American and foreign trained.
  2. I teach fundamentals and M/S clinical in NYC. I have a mix students in my class. My current group of 10 students are all young adults working on their first degree. The students have spoken with the unit nurses and have been informed about the competitive environment nurses must navigate to get a job and to progress up the career ladder. The students have expressed shock about the job market as they believe that we are still in a nursing shortage. When they asked me, I told them that new nurses are having a difficult time getting positions and that it is their responsibility as adults to investigate potential careers opportunities. The students expressed that they were told that their are jobs for everyone upon graduation and that hospitals are begging for nurses. I told them that was a while ago, for now hospitals and other employers are being selective about who they hire. The college usually discusses how to search for a job towards the last semester as part of their leadership class. My question is how do other educators or schools handle student unease with the current job market for nurses?
  3. Another new group of nurses are soon to graduate in the next few weeks. These graduates are entering a tight job market, a very tight job market. Where I work, we are receiving numerous unsolicited resumes. I wish the nursing schools would be honest with the soon to be graduates. NYC and the immediate vicinity is saturated with nurses. It is so tight, that even being able to intern or volunteer for free is not easy. I wish the schools would work to develop "practice ready" nurses. If the schools did a better job training nurses for entry level practice, employers might be more willing to take on a new nurse. The schools of nursing need to explain to their students that the jobs available to them are not hospital based but community based (clinics, LTC, HH, etc.) It is sad to see so many disillusioned new nurses but the facts are the facts...positions are not opening up as before. Even positions in LTC are hard to get. If you have any advise or ideas, please share.
  4. dnsonthego

    why so many negatives about nursing?

    It is not negativity but a feeling of despair that is present. Nursing is a very difficult field. Too much work to do. Poor staffing, back stabbing, lack of supplies, lack of support staff etc. are what nurses deal with everyday. Nurses come to the field for many reason. The reality of practice as a bedside nurse is brutal. while some nurses have a roll with the punches mentality, the reality of what nursing is overwhelms some. Nursing will exhaust you physically and emotionally. Employers are concerned about getting the work done. You are expected to give and give more. Standing on your feet for 12 to 13 hours at a time is not fun. Dealing with rude doctors, nasty patients, unrealistic family members is not fun. This is day after day, year after year. Add to this is the boss who add more paper work to satisfy some new regulatory regulation. Making this drama even worse is that their is very little opportunity to advance out of nursing. You can become a manager but you are on call 24/7 without 24/7 pay or the resources to get the job done. You could go into case management but if you don't meet LOS goals you will be let go. Or better yet you could be a NP. While you are not pushing a med cart, you are still a junior member of the healthcare team plus you are now under the direction of a physician who has billing targets and productivity metrics. Before you start your nursing education, work as an aide in a hospital or a nursing home. See what nurses do. Nursing education is expensive and time consuming. Before you jump in, see first hand what you are getting yourself into. By the way...nursing is not a versatile as you have been told. And now experienced and new nurses are having a hard time finding work. Look before you leap!
  5. dnsonthego

    Do you need all those degrees?

    Where I work, we have a trend of nurses obtaining multiple degrees after obtaining basic nursing training and their RN license. At a management meeting this issue came up about why nurses are going for all these degrees (MSN, MPH, MBA, MPA, MHA, DNP, JD, Dr.P.H. etc.). I have colleagues that have two or three graduate degrees. I frequently see these degreed nurses working in staff, charge or lower level non clinical work (case management/discharge planning). The degree(s) did not get them far from the bedside. An attending physician made a point that being a manager or charge nurse does not require an MBA degree. Another doctor stated that his son works at a Fortune 100 company in a significant job with a bachelor level education. The impression I got is that the attendees saw this degree mania in nursing as silly and wasteful. The word wasteful was used as the facility provides tuition reimbursement. Another comment was made that these degrees are mostly online degrees or from low standard/open enrollment schools. There appears to be true to this statement. A department head then said why can't nurses be happy to be a nurse. If they want to be managers or executive, move on so that nurses who want to nurse can be at the bedside. He then discussed a nurse colleague who has two management degrees who is a bedside nurse and a nursing supervisor who has four graduate degrees (she has a master's in nursing to be an adult health nurse practitioner, a master's in public health, a master's in business and a master's in community health). The sad part is that the 4 graduate degree nursing supervisor could not prepare a report detailing an major event that occurred when she was on duty (she asked me to rewrite what she had written so as to not be embarrassed by her poor language skills--English is her second language). About twenty years ago I worked with a nurse who went to school to get a master's degree in journalism. She wanted out of nursing and saw journalism as her ticket. Unfortunately, when she graduated she could not locate a job that paid. She did not investigate the need to pay her dues in the competitive field of journalism. End result, she ended up staying in nursing. The impression we had of her then was she was a nice lady who was misguided and did not investigate what awaits graduates of her program. I hope by now she had paid off her student loans. Back to the discussion...I did not respond about this issue during the meeting as I myself have mixed feelings about getting degrees especially since I do not see the degree holder having benefited from the education. Writing skills are still poor, professional presentation and presence is lacking and analytic skills are weak. When I interact with my degreed colleagues, I think to myself, what has all this schooling taught you? In my day, you entered nursing via a diploma or associated degree and learned your trade on the floor. A degree (BSN or MSN)was needed to be a nursing director or nursing professor. I really never understood why nurses undertook going for these degrees since they stayed in nursing anyway. I know a few nurses over the years who thought that an MBA/MPH would get them into corporate America/government position only to be heartbroken that the degree got them nowhere. Having an MBA in marketing or Finance really isn't applicable to nursing even at the highest levels. Adding to this is the fact that if you do not practice these fields or specialty areas, you are not competent but rather have a degree as a trophy. As for the DNP, I understand the logic of wanting to be like pharmacy and physical therapy, but even with a clinical doctorate degree, they are still a pharmacist or a physical therapist. If it hasn't elevated these other professions, what makes us think it will elevate us? Where I work, the culture of not calling these degree holders "doctor" prevails. Anyway, I wanted to hear what other nurses think about the degree proliferation in nursing. Do you think this is a good trend or is this just breeding more discontented nurses who will continue to dream about careers they will never have?
  6. dnsonthego

    Fired from my first nursing job, before one year

    I have a few question for you----Did you make it to your first anniversary? If not how many months were you employed there? Are you a male nurse? Are you under 30? Additionally, what city are you in? The reason I ask these questions is that I work in NYC. We do not hire nurses who left their first job prior to their second anniversary. The union contract we have requires that a nurse must be employed at least one full year before becoming a union member. Nurses that are let go just prior or in the vicinity of a year of service are nurses that are not going to make it----it is not fair but that is the system. When a resume comes in and the nurse has been in a facility for a year or less, we just delete the resume. Other hospitals may be different but this is the way it is in NYC now. I am sad for you but you really have a problem. In a different era, someone would have grabbed you up as you have been trained as a bedside nurse and have spent some time on the floor. Today, is different. Too many nurses out there--new and experienced. No need to take a chance on "damage goods". My best advice is to sign up with an agency. Working for an agency is tough... not enough work, being called off, being canceled when you show up at a job, being floated, odd shifts, weekends/holidays and nights, etc. But a least you are working. As for the other comments about your posting, you really need to reflect on your behavior and how you come across. Humble pie is hard to eat. Learn from your mistakes and play nice as an agency nurse. A manager may take a liking to you and offer you a job. Remember as an agency nurse, any drama and you are gone that minute. Good luck. PS...keep your plans and dreams to yourself. You are there to work. Save your EMT training, etc. for your family/friends.
  7. As a seasoned nurse who has advanced in the profession, I would like to offer some suggestions. Nursing is not a field you go into for a paycheck. You will work very hard for your money. Additionally, the salary you go in does not go up as much as other professionals. In NYC, a new nurse can start out at 70K base but guess what...25 years out, your base salary is 85K. People on the outside looking in do not understand what salary compression is and how it works. Once you are in nursing, you will clearly understand. Next, nurses has opportunities but those opportunities usually do not come with additional pay. The salary of a nurse takes into consideration having to work holidays, nights, evening and weekends, etc. Once you move away from the 24/7 of bedside nursing, you will see how the salary stagnate or decrease as convenience of working M-F 8-4 is factored into pay rates. As for societal expectations, a lot of well meaning people will encourage young woman to go into nursing. My advice is to think about it seriously. Standing on your feet for 12 to 13 hours three to fours days a week is not fun. Caring for high acuity patients without the needed support and supplies is not fun, being on call or being expected to take call is not fun. My advice is not to go into nursing because you love science. You need a few basic science classes up front as part of the pre-nursing sequence but nursing is not a science based field, it is a hands on human service endeavor. If your heart and mind is telling you to go after a science field, investigate the options available to you. Be glad you have options available to you----a significant number of students in nursing are not so lucky. Having taught nursing in my career, I can not tell you the number of students who entered into nursing for the pay check believing they are too good for nursing and that the bedside care would be done by an aide. They are seriously mistaken. Don't be fooled into believing that a high pay, high prestige job awaits you once you "do you time on the floor". A lot of nurses are told that they can go into administration or informatics or NP etc. The competition for these jobs is intense, hours are brutal and you will never get paid what your worth. Investigate and think for your self. If you are a science whiz, math wiz or whatever wiz try to think what options you have academically. Nursing education is too cumbersome, too costly and too vocationally oriented to be spent trying to find your place in the world. Additionally, being a nurse does not open doors as many believe. If you have serious ability or skill in science and math etc., try to explore what is available to you. Nursing can be a great career choice for those who want to be a nurse. If you want to do more or be more or explore more, think before going into nursing.
  8. I was asked to conduct courtesy interviews for several new nurses who were not able to obtain a job as a nurse. These nurses had graduated in 2009, 2010 and 2011. It was interesting to speak with them as they were hopeful that a job would come their way. What did concern me was that these nurses did not understand that they are not practice ready. By practice ready, I mean being able to go on the floor, get report and get to work as either a staff or charge nurse. The nurses I spoke with had their degree and a license to practice but no paid experience. Volunteer experience is a great way to make contacts but it is not the backbone of a resume. I explained to the nurses how tight positions for nurses are and that more belt tightening will be occurring in healthcare in the region (NYC). All the nurses were under the impression that once they got their RN they could do what they wanted professionally. The expectations they have about the nursing profession are very inflated. The changes over the last several years are having a cumulative effect...schools are graduating too many nurses for too few positions. As new nurses are graduated, the previous years graduates become more unlikely to get a nursing job. Skills fade when not used plus employers would rather take a new nurse straight out of school rather than a nurse who has been on the side lines. Nursing schools base their educational program on the assumption that their graduates will be employed in a hospital. The hospital will prepare the graduate nurse to function as a staff nurse via new nurse orientation programs and preceptor programs. Due to the problems in the economy which has been effecting facilities since the 2007 recession, positions have been reduce or eliminated, turnover is down, fiscal issues are becoming a priority effecting everyone in healthcare. New nurses are expensive to train and orient. My personal feelings is that if the schools did a better job preparing students to practice, the graduates would have a better chance to secure gainful employment. We all know of nurses who got a job as a nurse in a hospital, went through a lengthy & costly orientation only to realize nursing is not for them. Some of these nurse will bounce from job to job hoping their next employer will be different. It sad to say but it is the same everywhere...just different characters. In the era of a nursing shortage, new nurses could do this, today it is a different ball game. I told the nurses the standard advice: keep applying, volunteer, get a BSN or other training, etc. The sad fact is if these woman need to be working not on the sidelines hoping that jobs will be opening up in the next few months. I firmly believe if the schools had prepared the nurses for practice, the nurses would have a better chance in the job market. I also firmly believe that nursing schools need to prepare nurses for the future of nursing practice...community health, home health, LTC, public health and outpatient and clinic practices. Schools don't play up these areas but these are the areas that nurses in the future will be working. Hospitals will become leaner with more treat and street services. Anyway, this is my thoughts on this subject. I welcome comments.
  9. dnsonthego

    Nursing Jobs in NYC

    My facility received a call from a local nursing program. The coordinator wanted to know if we could host her graduates for the summer as nursing interns. When our clinical educator followed up to ask how many students did the school wish to place as interns, the schools coordinator said as many as you can handle. I was asked to speak with the schools placement coordinator and I was troubled by what I heard. The program is about to graduate over 70 associate degree nurses and is looking to place them in an internship so that the students are not facing the immediate reality of the local job market. Unfortunately, this year we will not be able to host more than a few interns. Budget cuts have reduced the staff hours that can be used orient and supervise these graduates. What is really sad is that this is not the only school that approached us. Our facility has stopped hiring new grads due to the fact that we can easily pick experienced nurses to fill an open position. We have had a significant drop in our nursing staff turnover and we have closed units and services due to budget cuts and strategic realignment. I am writing this today so that students are aware of how difficult it is to get a job as a nurse in the NYC area. Experienced nurses with certification are having a rough time. Making the situation worse is the backlog of nurse who graduated over the last several years but are not able to find RN jobs. NYC area has had hospital closing and downsizing of units and services. More hospitals are expected to merge facilities and to downsize units. All of these changes makes it more difficult for the new nurse to get their first job. I should add that this problem of reducing beds and mergers has effected everyone in healthcare. Our facility continues to host MPH and MPA students who were doing internships and administrative residency programs. These students are new to healthcare and most do not have any clinical background. The placement of these students has not be successful as the market is just saturated with qualified, credentialed and experienced managers. Management jobs are not being created as belt tightening is the rule of the day. My final take is that these students, both the nursing students and those studying management should be told the truth by the schools. The nursing shortage is over and realistically will not be back for a long time. Nursing education needs to be followed by the new nurse entering the nursing workforce so as to learn the skills of being a nurse. While the delay in entering the workforce is involuntary for these new nurses, the longer they are out of nursing, the value of their education diminishes. I know that schools are now recommending a nurse refresher class for nurses who have graduated and have not found a job as a nurse with 2 to 3 years of graduation. Nursing students need to research what is going on. Nursing education is time consuming, costly and demanding. Having a degree and an license is great but without a job to practice so as to learn your profession, you have seriously wasted a lot of money and time. Good luck to all the new nurses out there. Lets hope the job market for nurses rebounds.
  10. dnsonthego

    Jobless in the land of Medicine

    Try looking for a job in a nursing home. I would think they would love to have a nursr with so much hospital experience. You could be a staff nurse in the sub acute or rehab unit or a manager/supervisor for the long term care units. Nursing homes are tough places to work, too many patients/ residents to care for and not enough staff. You will be busy and you will be on your feet all day so pace yourself.
  11. dnsonthego

    Job Fair Hints

    I recently co-hosted a booth for my employer at a large nursing and healthcare worker job fair. I wanted to share some observations: Many of the attendees did not have a resume with them. Many of the attendees were not dressed in proper business attire. Many of the attendees did not know how to approach prospective employers in a professional manner. There are too many unemployed nurses, social workers, therapist etc in the NYC area. The unemployed are not just new grads but those with experience and credentials. To see so many people representing so many disciplines makes me wonder what is really going on? Are we producing too many health care workers or are the facilities downsizing/eliminating jobs too rapidly? While I enjoyed hosting a booth and spoke with many interesting people, I have to comment about the lack of professional decorum among some attendees. I am old school so hear me out. If you are going to a job fair shouldn't you be dressed in your "Sunday finest" and have numerous copies of your resume to hand out to the representatives and HR recruiters? First impressions do count. What saddened me about the day was to see so many unemployed nurses. NYC is very tight now. I was asked what advice I could offer and I really could not say anything new expect to volunteer, keep applying and continue to seek out opportunities. The job market for experienced nurses is tight so the new grads really have a hard road ahead of them. I have been in nursing a long time and I have seen the highs and lows but the lack of opportunity out there for the new grads is something to worry about. A nurse out of school for more than two or three years who has not worked is in a very difficult place. With so many new grads, employers will take the latest grads from from school and clinical training if jobs should open up. I do wonder what will happen when it gets out that nursing is over subscribed especially in NYC. To those who are looking for work, good luck. You are in my prayers.
  12. dnsonthego

    Advice for a potential second career male nurse?

    Please listen to what is being said because it is real. Nursing is being squeezed hard due to money concerns. Nursing is a hard career for the young and it is extra hard for the more seasoned adult. If nursing is your dream then go for it but if you are seeking security and stable income/benefits, please reconsider. Nursing education is difficult with clinical training and the cost of tuition, books etc adds up fast. You do not want to go through the hassle of getting a nursing license only to not find a job. There are many new grads including second career nurses in the NYC area who are unemployed but have to pay off major school debt. My advice is to investigate what your local nursing job market is doing. Talk with nurses currently working in the areas you wish to work. Time spent upfront may say you heartache later.
  13. dnsonthego

    New Grad RN still no job

    Greetings, It is very tough for new nurses...it is tough for all nurses! The advice given should be taken-volunter, volunter and volunter. Look at nursing homes...they are always looking for volunters. Once you show your interested maybe someone will offer you paid work or a tip on a job opening. Today, budgets are tight with time and money to train and orient staff (especially a new nurse) just is not going to happen. Think about transporting, C.N.A. jobs (especially evening, nights and weekend) and voluntering on the weekend. Good Luck!

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