The private college cash grab

U.S.A. Florida

Published

Due to the high rejection rates by public colleges for nursing, Florida has become inundated by private schools. They promise a competitive education to the public schools and a chance to be a Registered Nurse. The reality is the majority of these schools are only after the 50 or 60 thousand dollars per student that they can steal.

While difficult, many schools only provide the illusion of an adequate education. The reality is a different picture. New nursing graduates completely unprepared for the NCLEX. By the time many find out they've been cheated its too late. They have a degree in nursing and tens of thousands of dollars in debt. Its a mystery to me how schools with consistently low first time pass rates are able to remain in operation.

I am one of the 50% of my graduating class that still hasn't passed. Many of us have made two or even three attempts. Student loan repayment has begun. We've tried the Hurst reviews and everything else available. All of us have jobs either as LPNs or other field's.

What are our options? Try for acceptance into a better public or private school? What about the loans?What about legal action?

I disagree -- the NCLEX is supposed to measure minimum knowledge/competency to safely enter practice, and nursing programs are supposed to be providing students with at least the minimum knowledge and competency they need to safely enter practice. My school prepared us v. well for the NCLEX, and I would consider that a basic expectation of nursing school. What is the point of putting the time, effort, and expense into a nursing program if you graduate unprepared for the licensure exam?

It is not my fault my BSN program did not adequately prepare me for NCLEX. I still was forced to complete it in order to get signatures on paperwork in order to take the NCLEX.

Students have been flocking to for-profit nursing schools for years and posting about it here on AN. What amazes me is the fact that so few older people - myself included - who might have a clue ever bothered to point some of these issues out The most frequent advice given on AN on the subject: take out a loan.

While I agree that a lot of due diligence got skipped over the years ... but we have no business getting thin in the nose about it, because we elders either didn't realize the issues ourselves or didn't bother to let the newbies in on the secret.

Really? I know I've seen and participated on a lot of threads about the evils and risks of the proprietary nursing "schools" -- sometimes I worry I'm starting to sound like a broken record. Maybe not a large proportion of the total number of threads on the site, but it has certainly had its fair share of discussion over time. It's true there are a lot of people (students or graduates of those programs) who chime in to defend the "schools," but, in my experience, there has been plenty of discussion and criticism of the various weaknesses of those programs, and plenty of discussion from us "old-timers" about the dangers of taking out large amounts of student loans (for any program, not just the proprietary "schools"). People don't want to seem to listen, though.

Many of the RN schools in Florida are very new. Even my former LPN instructors were unable to offer guidance regarding private colleges. The state keeps official pass rates for every nursing program. No one tried to assist me in my choices. I live in a fairly small town with one public college. The public college continued to alter and increase requirements for acceptance.

While my gpa wasn't the very highest, it was still well within the 3.x range. I did all prerequisites at the public school. I made huge commutes for the RN program. Many verbal promises were made throughout the time I attended. There wasn't a standardized curriculum and the school relied on ATI to teach you what they weren't. This was grossly insufficient. A class action lawsuit is what I've decided to start. I've been in contact with a few attorneys this morning.

Southwest Fl Tech Institute is one example of a school not teaching well. A pass rate of 33%

Specializes in Hospice.
Really? I know I've seen and participated on a lot of threads about the evils and risks of the proprietary nursing "schools" -- sometimes I worry I'm starting to sound like a broken record. Maybe not a large proportion of the total number of threads on the site, but it has certainly had its fair share of discussion over time. It's true there are a lot of people (students or graduates of those programs) who chime in to defend the "schools," but, in my experience, there has been plenty of discussion and criticism of the various weaknesses of those programs, and plenty of discussion from us "old-timers" about the dangers of taking out large amounts of student loans (for any program, not just the proprietary "schools"). People don't want to seem to listen, though.

I don't follow many student threads, so I have a very skewed vision of what's gone on. So I apologize for (inadvertently) misrepresenting what has been said over the years. And yes, I agree that you can write until your fingers fall off, if the reader doesn't want to see it, there's not much you can do except get out of the way of the train wreck.

I still don't buy the caveat emptor argument. Lies are lies, PR is PR. And PR is a highly developed science of convincing people to do things that might not necessarily be rational choices for them. If it improves the bottom line, then it's The American Way.

I believe in personal responsibility ... if I make a stupid decision because I want something for nothing - which is the core dynamic of any con - then I have to deal with the consequences.

However, I don't believe that personal responsibility means accepting the blame - or the cost - for a crook's thievery just because I couldn't see through his lies. If I misrepresent my product to you, thereby convincing you to give me big bucks for it, and that product proves to be both substandard and harmful to you, don't you deserve some restitution? True, dumb choices have consequences. So does deliberate fraud. Being a corporation rather than a biological human doesn't change that.

Many of the RN schools in Florida are very new. Even my former LPN instructors were unable to offer guidance regarding private colleges. The state keeps official pass rates for every nursing program. No one tried to assist me in my choices. I live in a fairly small town with one public college. The public college continued to alter and increase requirements for acceptance.

While my gpa wasn't the very highest, it was still well within the 3.x range. I did all prerequisites at the public school. I made huge commutes for the RN program. Many verbal promises were made throughout the time I attended. There wasn't a standardized curriculum and the school relied on ATI to teach you what they weren't. This was grossly insufficient. A class action lawsuit is what I've decided to start. I've been in contact with a few attorneys this morning.

Just out of curiosity, a class action lawsuit alleging what? The FL state legislature made a conscious decision to pass legislation relaxing the standards and requirements for nursing schools to operate in the state (hence, the abundance of new schools meeting only the newer, lower standards). Has your school violated any of the state laws/rules/regulations under which it operates? Lots of nursing schools are disorganized and many schools make statements to students that may be interpreted by some as "verbal promises" but aren't. That doesn't mean the program has done anything it can be sued for. Other than not being a good program, what has the "school" done wrong? You used the word "fraudulent" earlier; how do you feel the school has defrauded you? I agree that a 33% NCLEX pass rate is deplorable; as I asked earlier, does FL now allow schools with pass rates this low to keep operating? In most states, a school with a pass rate that low would be on probation and be required to develop and implement a plan to improve its pass rate, or the BON would shut it down. If it's okay with the state for schools to operate with those kinds of results, then it would be up to the individual prospective students to do the research and make smart choices about what school to attend.

I still don't buy the caveat emptor argument. Lies are lies, PR is PR. And PR is a highly developed science of convincing people to do things that might not necessarily be rational choices for them. If it improves the bottom line, then it's The American Way.

I believe in personal responsibility ... if I make a stupid decision because I want something for nothing - which is the core dynamic of any con - then I have to deal with the consequences.

However, I don't believe that personal responsibility means accepting the blame - or the cost - for a crook's thievery just because I couldn't see through his lies. If I misrepresent my product to you, thereby convincing you to give me big bucks for it, and that product proves to be both substandard and harmful to you, don't you deserve some restitution? True, dumb choices have consequences. So does deliberate fraud. Being a corporation rather than a biological human doesn't change that.

I generally agree with you, and have said many times here that I would love to see the proprietary "schools" banned entirely. However, no one in a position of authority seems much interested in doing that, and they are still free to operate. Yes, their advertising is extremely misleading, and they stay in business (and make big profits for their owners and shareholders, much-if-not-most of it taxpayer dollars, which kills me) by preying upon individuals who either don't know any better, or can't be bothered to find out any better. It's not like the negative information about these "schools" is hard to find ...

I hear what you're saying, but I do also have problems with someone who makes a decision to commit a lot of money and effort to a "school" on the basis of less research than s/he would do before buying a car or major appliance. IMO, there is responsibility on both "sides." 'Waaaayyy too many people come here to complain that, now that they're getting ready to graduate or have flunked the NCLEX, they realize that their school was a terrible school and they've been ripped off. Really? There weren't any warning signs while you were in school? You kept attending and giving them large quantities of $$$ while you were having this awful experience? The same is true of the number of people who post here about how awful their graduate program is and how it isn't prepared them for boards and practice. Really?? Then why on earth are you still attending and paying them tuition money? Why not leave there and find a good program?

These "schools" stay in business because there are plenty of people willing to enroll and pay them a lot of money. If their supply of students/victims dried up, they would have to either make changes or shut down.

OP, we all feel for you, but I think you are looking at this incorrectly. Unfortunately these schools are allowed to exists for whatever reason, but the bottom line is that they promised if you did the work and passed the tests you would get your BSN and you got it. They were unethical perhaps, but they weren't dishonest and weren't making promises that they couldn't keep. NCLEX pass rates are public knowledge. You could have checked for the information before ever enrolling and found out that their pass rate is dismal and chosen not to go. I don't see where a lawyer is going to be any help-I don't see where you have a legal case at all. What you do have is a degree that is not going to be very valuable if you don't pass NCLEX, so I suggest a remedial course and possibly a private tutor so you can pass it. Instead of wasting resources on legal help that will get you no closer becoming an RN, try taking those positive steps so you can pass.

As for the weird reasons mentioned why the BONs don't close these places down, something needs to change that! Pass rates that low should shut them down. There may be some students who have to start over elsewhere, but that's better in the long run than them having to complete a course that is not preparing them well enough to become nurses.

Specializes in hospice.

That's what happens when you live in a republican utopia like FL

Really? It's sad you feel justified insulting half your colleagues and the readers of this board, basically saying crappy schools are the fault of your political opponents.

Really? It's sad you feel justified insulting half your colleagues and the readers of this board, basically saying crappy schools are the fault of your political opponents.

Well, they're responsible for not only opening the flood gates but also allowing these schools to flourish. That's not insulting anyone. It's calling a spade a spade.

Specializes in Hospice.

What we are saying is that many, if not most, for-profit schools lie and steal in order to maximize revenue derived from publicly funded programs for students. That business plan is as old as the GI Bill. Anyone here remember the trucking school ads in the backs of pulp magazines? Not a new phenomenon at all.

The thieves are significantly protected and abetted in this by carefully crafted legislation and regulatory policies.

Now it's claimed that stating this is an insult to Republicans? If a republican is insulted by that connection, doesn't that suggest that they know it's wrong? If they know it's wrong, then why do it? The Republican free-market, conservative platform is fairly well known. The short form: what's good for business is good for America.

From where I sit, it's pure corporate nanny state through and through.

The OP has to accept some responsibility for his own role as victim, here. But so do the schools, politicians and corporations that did the stealing. Especially the corporation. After all they are people, right?

I agree that a class action lawsuit seems an unlikely and very expensive way to approach the problem, at least right now.

For one thing, smart lawyers might be reluctant to take on the financial industry, and that includes the feds. Goldman Sachs was, and probably still is, a major player in the for-profit education industry. They have a very comfortable relationship with the federal government that goes back roughly a hundred years.

Gonna be some bloody noses over this one.

The OP has to accept some responsibility for his own role as victim, here. But so do the schools, politicians and corporations that did the stealing. Especially the corporation. After all they are people, right?

Strongly agree.

Yes, public schools are the most difficult to get in. However, there are also great prestigious universities if you are willing to relocate. I mean it probably won't give you your dream job, but you know that school has a decent reputation which can probably still get you a job. When I was applying to nursing school, my friends advice was to check the NCLEX pass rate of each school and my anatomy teacher advised me to attend a decent nursing school and not a for-profit school. she has been invited to teach at these schools, but declined.

I'm sorry, but there are a bunch of people who just don't have the academic chops to enter nursing school. Nearly everyone at my community college calls themselves nursing majors, but not many make it into nursing school.

Because of what I've read here about nursing in Florida, I decided to decline the school I was accepted in.

A surplus of new grads? I think for-profit schools are partly to blame. They virtually allow EVERYONE into the program. Hell, when I started talking to a representative from ---- University, I started getting so many calls I had to block their number. Taking the bus I see an ad from ----- College, which is new and disorganized. Basically, these for-profit schools target people who do not have the academic chops to get in nor the financial ability to afford such an expensive education. So then these students turn to private loans with a high interest rate, perhaps, for their second degree. and when they can't find a job or pass the NCLEX they try to point fingers. they can't pay back their loans and are drowned in debt. they think becoming a nurse will be fast and good money, but as my father always said, there is no free lunch.

I am also very thankful that others here have been very helpful in my application process and I had many in my life who advised me as well. Pursuing nursing as a second career, at times I felt lost, and I am sorry that OP is in the situation he is in today.

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