The Line b/t Respecting Wishes of Victim, Privacy, & Reporting

[SunnyPupRN]

I'm quite in shock, fumbling for words, as my fifth grader just had a sleepover with another girl last weekend and I was surprised that she had blocked all her phone calls. When I asked, she hemmed and hawed, and finally said that the girl had attempted to kiss her, "asked to have sex," wanted her to take her pants off, and that my child had to physically push her off. All of this while I was in the next room!

There's no doubt that there was some odd behaviour, but I never would have guessed this. When I went to wake them up in the morning, sure enough, they were in the same bed, even though there were two beds.

I asked my daughter why she didn't come to me, and she said she was in shock, and the girl never got "far." As a parent and nurse I want to advocate for her and protect her, but she insists she does not want the matter pursued. I feel torn between a duty and respecting my child's wishes and keeping her trust.

The primal part of my brain wants to go kick that kid's ass, but obviously that is not the answer. My child says she just does not want to keep talking about it or thinking about it, especially with investigators.

I don't want to make her feel like she doesn't have control or can't trust me. I feel gutted.

[Horseshoe, BSN, RN]

It is sad. I don't deny that something probably happened to screw up this child. But can you see how I am torn between respecting my child's privacy and confidence in me? What good does it do to take away what little control she has left over the situation? Yes, the girl told my child she had sex with her own cousin so something is awry. But forcing my child to be interviewed, isn't that more traumatization?

Children often want things that are not in their best interest. Or they don't want to do things which ARE in their best interest. That's because they are children-they don't know any better. You, as the adult in her life, are tasked with making sure she gets what she needs whether or not she realizes it or wants it. Kids typically don't want vaccinations, medical treatments, or healthy diets, and that doesn't stop us from giving them what they need even as it might be unpleasant at the time or make them upset with us. This is no different. If you as a nurse would advise another mother in this position to get her child some help, then you know also that this is probably what's best for your kid as well. Lots of educated, well trained individuals are advising you that you are not trained to handle this situation on your own, and even if you were, it's not appropriate to treat your own child. It may turn out that since your D put a stop to this before it got very far, that she hasn't been traumatized as much as you fear. But don't you think a professional should find that out in case this is bigger than you are prepared to handle?

[JustBeachyNurse, LPN]

Can you report it AND refuse to let investigators meet with or talk to your child. Can you report it to an anonymous child abuse hotline, that you suspect the other child may be abused?

Bad idea. The interviewing of her child by a qualified investigator is more likely to be therapeutic than traumatic

[JustBeachyNurse, LPN]

By reporting this, and let your child know you are legally obligated to and she can do it with you, you are teaching your daughter to not be ashamed, that it's okay to stand up and speak out in turn getting an investigation started that will help her peer and in turn prevent others from becoming victims. Her peer is a victim. The longer you wait the more likely the child will escalate and you are putting your own nursing license at risk.

The longer you wait the stronger message you are sending to your child that it's okey to be an embarrassed silent victim and you prevent your child from accessing the counseling that she likely needs to work this out. Now it may be a few sessions. A few years from now it could haunt her. By reporting the other child you are not just helping the other child-victim, possibly preventing future victims but also empowering your child to speak out and get the help she needs.

[SunnyPupRN]

As a nurse you're also a mandated reporter--acting out sexually is a HUGE red flag that she has been a victim herself. If she doesn't get help, she will probably continue. Also, not all decisions are a 10-11 yr old child's to make. Your daughter did nothing wrong, and she has nothing to be ashamed of. If she were in college instead of fifth grade, would you agree that shame is a good reason to keep quiet? Granted at that point it would be her decision to make, but would you ever counsel someone not to report because they are ashamed?

In any case, I am sorry for what happened to your daughter. That had to have been scary for her.

No no no...I never said that shame was a reason to keep quiet. I said she has a right to privacy. And I maintain that. As for being a mandated reporter - she is not my *patient*

she is my child. However, I spoke to her today and with her permission I reported. I will post that update below.

-

[SunnyPupRN]

I spoke with my child this morning who reluctantly and sadly agreed to to the report, with the stipulation that she not be there. So I went to the police station, explained what happened, the officer went to his sergeant, came back and said that with the lack of detailed information the most it would amount to is a case of battery. They didn't make a report and weren't really interested. I explained about that the girl had told my child about having sex with her cousin, and going on to have sex with a fourth grader...all they said was I could go to the child advocacy center and if THEY wanted a police report someone could meet me out there. So I went to the child advocacy center, told the whole story over again, they more more compassionate, but just ended up giving me a phone number to pass the buck onto the next place, where they said someone would follow up and interview my child and the other child. At this point I am waiting for her to get home from day camp to let her know, and see what she wants. I know she doesn't want to talk to anyone, and I have done due diligence in reporting. Two agencies have passed the buck. If she wants to continue, we will.

[SunnyPupRN]

By reporting this, and let your child know you are legally obligated to and she can do it with you, you are teaching your daughter to not be ashamed, that it's okay to stand up and speak out in turn getting an investigation started that will help her peer and in turn prevent others from becoming victims. Her peer is a victim. The longer you wait the more likely the child will escalate and you are putting your own nursing license at risk.

The longer you wait the stronger message you are sending to your child that it's okey to be an embarrassed silent victim and you prevent your child from accessing the counseling that she likely needs to work this out. Now it may be a few sessions. A few years from now it could haunt her. By reporting the other child you are not just helping the other child-victim, possibly preventing future victims but also empowering your child to speak out and get the help she needs.

Respectfully, I disagree. You are assuming she is ashamed. She held her ground and said 'no,' and told me what happened. Shame is silent. She simply wants privacy. Not everyone needs or wants western style therapy and psycho-analysis. Some people are empowered by making their own choices and and working things out on their own terms. I agree with you that the other child probably needs help. I am doing what I can. See below.

[SunnyPupRN]

It must be very difficult to be in your position, and I understand that your first concern is for your child. Of course it is, you're a parent. Others have already addressed being a mandated reporter and all of that, so I won't. I just want to add in a different perspective and say that I wish someone had spoken up for me, instead of looking the other way. I never attacked another child, but maybe I wouldn't be quite so... "broken" still in my late 20s if someone had given a damn.

That little girl might not have anyone to help her.

I'm sorry for this. Thank you for sharing. You are not alone.

[NotAllWhoWandeRN, ASN, RN]

This child needs help. With what you know, you need to report it. Otherwise, you become complicit in the crimes committed against her. How would you feel if it were your daughter whose cousin was using her for sex, her friend's mother knew, and never told anyone?

What the other child did was wrong, but it's not ok to avoid having your own daughter interviewed so that another girl can avoid being raped.

Edit: thank you for doing the difficult thing and reporting. You're right, you have no power if other agencies refuse to investigate.

[JustBeachyNurse, LPN]

I wouldn't have went to the police but called the state child abuse hotline. Without an actual battery committed the police have nothing to act upon. They were not wrong to redirect you. The state child protection and advocacy center would have initiated the investigation and if it met criminal level then would have involved the police with the evidence collected.

The state child abuse hotline is who you needed to contact not the police (unless the other child was successful in violating your daughter then it should have been call the police on the way to the ED to meet a SANE nurse)

It doesn't matter if someone is your patient, when you have knowledge of child or elder abuse in any manner you are legally obligated to report. Whether the child is your patient or mot

[NotAllWhoWandeRN, ASN, RN]

Respectfully, I disagree. You are assuming she is ashamed. She held her ground and said 'no,' and told me what happened. Shame is silent. She simply wants privacy. Not everyone needs or wants western style therapy and psycho-analysis. Some people are empowered by making their own choices and and working things out on their own terms.

My interview about the abuse was uncomfortable. My abuse was traumatic. There's a difference.

Be angry at the other girl all you want, keep her away from your daughter, sure. But it's kind of rough that you say you "don't give a damn" that a fifth grader has been raped - not kissed, raped.

[SunnyPupRN]

I wouldn't have went to the police but called the state child abuse hotline. Without an actual battery committed the police have nothing to act upon. They were not wrong to redirect you. The state child protection and advocacy center would have initiated the investigation and if it met criminal level then would have involved the police with the evidence collected.

The state child abuse hotline is who you needed to contact not the police (unless the other child was successful in violating your daughter then it should have been call the police on the way to the ED to meet a SANE nurse)

It doesn't matter if someone is your patient, when you have knowledge of child or elder abuse in any manner you are legally obligated to report. Whether the child is your patient or mot

I understand why it may be confusing. In our state, what happened meets the standard for criminal battery, according to the police. Yes, I agree there is an moral obligation to report. The problem is that I also feel a moral obligation toward my child, who has emphatically stated she does not want to talk to anyone. I looked up the statute, and I don't want to get caught up in this part, but it states that medical personnel involved in the care of a minor are mandated reporters, meaning they have to give their name, as opposed to anonymous reporters. I understand that the point is that reporting is the moral standard. I hope you can understand the cry for privacy and desire not to have exposure, and fear of retribution that my child has.

Do I have an obligation to dig into what is happening to the other child? How far does one go? The fact is...maybe nothing is happening. Maybe she saw something on TV. Maybe she's lying about her cousin. I don't know and I do not feel compelled to come to anyone's aid but my child's.

I will make one more report for a paper trail. I know some crappy things might be happening. I can't save the world, but I can keep the trust of the one person who counts on me.

Thank you all for your words of wisdom.

[SunnyPupRN]

My interview about the abuse was uncomfortable. My abuse was traumatic. There's a difference.

Be angry at the other girl all you want, keep her away from your daughter, sure. But it's kind of rough that you say you "don't give a damn" that a fifth grader has been raped - not kissed, raped.[/quote

Wow- I looked back and I didn't even remember typing that. But its been an emotional couple of days so I'm not surprised. First, I was not specifically saying I didn't give a damn about what happened to her. I was saying I didn't give a damn about her with respect to my own child, the big picture. If I sit and seperate the incidents, of course I can sympathize. But I'm not there yet.

As far as interviews ... I'm very glad yours was not traumatic. I think it's important to remember that everyone processes these things differently and while I won't walk on eggshells, I will respectfully be mindful of how she wants this to play out. I truly believe that there isn't just one way. I was also abused. For me, counseling just kept confirming that the world is scary and ****** and court was a whole new trauma. I think she's doing ok. She's not hiding in her room....she's playing her cello, not withdrawn except when I approach this subject...and I've told her the door is open if she wants to change her mind on talking.