ok i dont really know where to start so i will try to make this short and sweet. i was terminated after nine years on the job on thursday due to "excessive absenteeism". mind you i have not called off work since october of 2007.
when all of this started i was pulled into the managers office and given a paper to sign that basically said that if i called in again i was terminated. she just happened to skip the offical protocol and i was never given a verbal or written warning.
i signed it and went on about my business. i asked her SEVERAL times for a copy and was never given one. that is just how she is, will tell you what you want to hear and then never give you what you asked for.
in january (i had been off for a while due to surgery) i was called into her office again. she and her "asst" basically bereated me and accused me of refusing to discharge a patient, among other things. she used the "f" word several times screaming in my face telling me she wished she could fire me then, and that all of my co-workers hated me. i ended up in the hospital for chest pain and svt that night. i was to work the next day and i used my "personal" (safe) day for that.
after that i reported her to our hr department and had written about 14 pages in response to her one. i had had enough of her and a few others bullying ways, constant comments about me personally, heavy assignments, etc.
after that i just put it all behind me. went to work my two days and shut my mouth. after a while things seemed to be going ok......
about a month ago she told me she wanted me to do our facilitys program which had to do with extra education and things to get a pay raise, and also to be on the unit leadership committee and pain resource nurse. i really felt that things were looking up and getting better. she also wanted me to take the pccn exam also. when she approached me with this i asked her about the absenteeism issues and if they would hold me back from doing the ladder program (you cannot be in any disiplinary probation to do it). she flat at looked at me and told me NO that that was over with and i was out of that. about two weeks ago i asked her for copies of those dates that i had missed. she said again that I DIDNT NEED TO WORRY ABOUT IT.
well, this week i got very sick very suddenly. tonsils the size of golf balls, fever of 102. would you go to work? this was wednesday that i called off.
on thursday at 3pm i got a call from her and she said sorry to tell you this but i have to terminate you. heres the number to hr if you have any questions.
i point blank asked her why she told me i had nothing to worry about and she FLAT OUT DENIED
HR should have any information that you requested from your manager and did not recieve. All of my former places of employment hr had copies of everything. My advice would be to only give HR's telephone number when applying to a new job. In many states a new employer is limited to the information that they can ask from prev employers, but this does include wether or not you are in hireable or non- hireable status, and if am not not mistake they can report on your absentee record. All the best wishes for you in your journey to find a job.
Agreed...Tracy has the facts right. My oldest brother has been in management for years. He told me over a decade ago that there are only two questions that he asked...
1) Did this person work for this company?
2) Is this person eligible for rehire?
If the person was not eligible for rehire, but really 'wowed' him during an interview, he would schedule a second interview with other managers to get thier impression. One of them would be asking the question of about separation with the prior employer.
Know your strengths and talents. Be ready to provide good professional, yet personal references. Most importantly, keep your cool.
But for the next couple days...just be good to yourself:redbeathe.
Your HR should have a formal appeal process in place for times when you feel a termination was done wrongfully. Got to them. Even if you choose never to go back and do get another job, they may owe you back pay.
You are better off not working there, but you have to understand, that your battle began after you were excessively absent versus what happened since they told you that you would be terminated if you missed again.
You were better off showing up to work and having THEM send you home.
I'm not saying your previous absences were not valid, but I have worked with people that always seemed to be gone. They had to take an entire day off to do maintenance on a car, or had to accompany 4 other family members to take "mom" to the doctor, or would call in if they got up and sneezed in the mornings.
Just because a company gives you X amount of days per year, doesn't mean you can take every one of them and still keep your job. Most companies offer rewards programs for time not used or pay it out to you in cash at the end of the year.
I know you are angry, and how they handled the situation wasn't right, however, you need to take a very objective view of how things were in the last few year and ask yourself: Did I really, really need every day off that I asked for?
This is exactly what I was thinking. Absenteeism bothers me so much that, unless my child is endangered or I am too sick to stand up I will not call in to work.
I've called in to work twice in the 8 yrs. I've been employed as a nurse. I'm not putting myself on a pedestal but knowing what a bind it puts your co-workers in when you call out, you would be better off at least showing up and let them decide if they think you are too sick to work.
I work with a nurse who seems to have more than her fair share of call-ins. I work 3-11 and she is regularly late for her 11-7 shift because she didn't wake up in time or she flat out calls in for work because she has a fever of 101, coughing...you might could understand it once in awhile but when you get to expect it to happen maybe something is wrong.
I think I take work attendance more seriously than anything else when it comes to my job. Maybe I shouldn't be that way but I think it says a lot when an employee thinks enough of their job and co-workers to show up, even when they feel sick, and at least say, "here I am." I don't think many employers would be unreasonable enough to expect you to work if you are truly too sick to do so.
My best friend is in management for a large bicoastal company. She says when checking references that there are only 2 questions they have to ask, just as the previous poster said- did they work there & would you rehire. They don't HAVE to elaborate on the yes or no answers, but most of the time they will when asked, and she has found that to be invaluable. Many times a person will interview well & she is ready to hire, but she ALWAYS checks references- this has saved her from a lot of potential problems; and excessive absenteeism is a big reason a person is not eligible for rehire, and a big reason people 'job hop'. She has told me there are certain 'red flags' to look for, one is short term employment history- never staying long at a job- this is a sign of a person who may be unreliable.
This is exactly what I was thinking. Absenteeism bothers me so much that, unless my child is endangered or I am too sick to stand up I will not call in to work.
I've called in to work twice in the 8 yrs. I've been employed as a nurse. I'm not putting myself on a pedestal but knowing what a bind it puts your co-workers in when you call out, you would be better off at least showing up and let them decide if they think you are too sick to work.
I work with a nurse who seems to have more than her fair share of call-ins. I work 3-11 and she is regularly late for her 11-7 shift because she didn't wake up in time or she flat out calls in for work because she has a fever of 101, coughing...you might could understand it once in awhile but when you get to expect it to happen maybe something is wrong.
I think I take work attendance more seriously than anything else when it comes to my job. Maybe I shouldn't be that way but I think it says a lot when an employee thinks enough of their job and co-workers to show up, even when they feel sick, and at least say, "here I am." I don't think many employers would be unreasonable enough to expect you to work if you are truly too sick to do so.
Agree. I also think that in this day w/so many nurses vying for the few choice jobs out there, that good attendance is a plus. If you have a job you like & people you enjoy working with, and you want to be there for a long time, absenteeism goes against you- no matter how good or how skilled or experienced one is.
Agreed...Tracy has the facts right. My oldest brother has been in management for years. He told me over a decade ago that there are only two questions that he asked...
1) Did this person work for this company?
2) Is this person eligible for rehire?
.
What a COMPANY policy is and what the LAW states in regards to references it NOT the same thing.
You can say anything negative about an employee as long as it can be PROVEN, otherwise you will set yourself up for a lawsuit.
This is the biggest myth going around. People always say, "Oh, you can only do dates of employment in my state!"...however, I would love to see a concrete, legal source of that in ANY state.
Do you think if you got fired for stealing medications they can't disclose that to a future employer?
If you failed a drug test, do you think they can't tell a future employer?
If you abandoned a job, do you think they can't tell a future employer?
If you punched out a customer, you think they can't tell a future employer?
They can't give matters that are of opinion such as being a "bad" employee or that they "didn't like working with you", etc.
People that believe that myth need to look up the definitions of libel and slander. Any legal website will state that "the truth" will be an absolute defence to both. In other words...if you can prove it, you can say it.
Now, some companies CHOOSE to have a dates-only policy to prevent an individual in HR/manager inadvertantly saying something that they can be sued for...but this is not to be confused with being illegal.
May I suggest that you talk with an attorney who specializes in labor relations law. NOW!! Go and sign up for unemployment so that at least you have something until you find another job.
Been where you are!! ((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
What a COMPANY policy is and what the LAW states in regards to references it NOT the same thing.
You can say anything negative about an employee as long as it can be PROVEN, otherwise you will set yourself up for a lawsuit.
This is the biggest myth going around. People always say, "Oh, you can only do dates of employment in my state!"...however, I would love to see a concrete, legal source of that in ANY state.
Do you think if you got fired for stealing medications they can't disclose that to a future employer?
If you failed a drug test, do you think they can't tell a future employer?
If you abandoned a job, do you think they can't tell a future employer?
If you punched out a customer, you think they can't tell a future employer?
They can't give matters that are of opinion such as being a "bad" employee or that they "didn't like working with you", etc.
People that believe that myth need to look up the definitions of libel and slander. Any legal website will state that "the truth" will be an absolute defence to both. In other words...if you can prove it, you can say it.
Now, some companies CHOOSE to have a dates-only policy to prevent an individual in HR/manager inadvertantly saying something that they can be sued for...but this is not to be confused with being illegal.
Speaking as someone who has been fired more than once because of falsified disciplinary records, I can say that ITA with the dates/rehire only policy UNLESS there really is something to back it up like a police report.
I have heard of more than one pharmacist who wanted to move to the city where I used to live, but did not because they knew what potentially awaited them.
Speaking as someone who has been fired more than once because of falsified disciplinary records, I can say that ITA with the dates/rehire only policy UNLESS there really is something to back it up like a police report.
I have heard of more than one pharmacist who wanted to move to the city where I used to live, but did not because they knew what potentially awaited them.
:yldhdbng:
Which is exactly why I said that it can be proven.
Excessive absences can be proven.
Failed drug tests, can be proven.
Any action where you were written up and signed it, proves previous warnings.
Stealing anything, can be proven.
When employers disclose this information, it's because it's readily in the employee file.
The only question that is subject to opinion (and greatly misused by potential employers) is the question "will you rehire this individual?".
A "no" to that question doesn't automatically equal that you were a bad employee. Some companies have formal, written policies that if you ever worked for the competition, that it automatically makes you ineligible for rehire or other similar circumstances.
That is an assumption that HR people make and it's an incorrect one.
I was a new RN working my first job at a local Nursing Home and really enjoying it there, when some things just started happening. It started with the abrupt firing of the home's administrator, a man who I had come to respect and admire as a real "stand-up" guy who wasn't afraid to take action when action was called for, and to defend us from abusive family members. After he left, the DON turned his resignation in. He was a long-time friend, and a classmate of mine in RN school (he had 8 years experience there already as an LVN, that's how he got the DON spot). THe nurse that replaced him was, ironically, the DON who was thre when I was interviewed and hired, and then just before I reported for my first day of work, was suddenly no longer there. Now suddenly she was back. I was of course, nervous, but as things settled down...or so I thought, .....she seemed like a really nice person to work with and work for. A month into her term as DON, I was named Employee of the Month. I thought, OK, I have finally arrived, and life here is gonna be just fine. Oh boy did I not know what I was in for.
THew following week, several things happened at once. First the DON was fired........again. Seems that she and the new administrator didn't see eye to eye on a lot of issues, among them being the use of Medication Aides on the floors. The new administrator wanted no med aides in the afternoon shift, the DON said that would not work, so out she went. Also at this time, we went through several ADON's before two LVN's, one of whom had the same last name as the new administrator...they said they weren't releated, but the last name was so uncommon that nobody bought it.....came on board. Two bigger *@!$%^ I will never know in my life. Suddenly we were without med aides in the afternoon, and I had to scramble to get my work done, and do what had been previously done by the med aide.
The next day, I was called in to the ADON's ofice and summarily written up for failing to follow through on a request by a resident to call to verify an appointment. I had told him I would, but not right then as I was really struggling to get everything done, but he couldn't wait, so he called himself, and then reported me the next day. These two ADON's had the paperwork ready, I was told to sign, and told that I was negligent for failing to follow through on my "duty" to see to his immediqte need. I pointed out that my immediate need was to make sure that my patientsd had all their medications on time, as I was now without a med aide. I was then lectured on how SHE used to take care of a whole hallway of diabetic tube feeders, got all her meds out on time, AND did new admissions as well, all without any help from anybody and if I was that incapable of managing my time, I should copnsider going somewhere else. I wasn't allowed much of any defense, I was just told, you're guilty, siugn here, end of story, no asking if this is what happened, is he lying, is he exaggerating, what's the story.
Two nights later, I was working a double in a diferent hallway, and found a lab result that had not been filed yet. I faxed it to the MD's office with a note saying to pse call us back with orders in the morning. Two days later I was called in to the ADON's office to find myself written up again for failing to make a nursing note about the lab being noted. Seems that a nurse noted the lab and wondered why an antibiotic had not been ordered yet, and it was my fault because I didn't make a note about the lab. I pointed out that I had faxed the lab to the doctor for his review, and he could review and if he wanted an antibiotic, he would call back with orders, and when are we supposed to make a note about the lab? Again, sorry, no defense, sign on the doted line.
At this point, I am starting to feel like a target was painted on my backside. Stuff started happening fast and heavy now. The following day I was assigned to a different hallway, one that I absolutely dreaded because it was HELL without a med aide, in fact damn near impossible. One of the other nurses on duty didn't like the floor she was on either, and we decided to switch floors. Now previously, we were able to do this without any guff from the office, because as long a s a nurse was tehre, and received a report and accepted the floor, that was fine. Not this time. I got written up again because they said they wanted ME there in that hallway, if they wanted Sandy they would have put here there, andf I had no business changing without "proper permission". I asked what was the big deal about having me in that hallway, and they said that it was because they had decided that I needed a "change of scenery", and this would be good for me. I asked what would be good for me if they worked me to death, and demanded more than I could deliver. Again, I was told that if that's how I felt, I could always quit.
While this was going on, one of our long-time med aides was also being targeted. She was accused of "gossiping" and being absent from thejob too much (she had a bad cold and had to miss several days of work) THey also accused her of not accounting for several medications, which she was able to show by documentation that it was not her fault, but they stioll now had their eye on her, too. When she took a lunch break with a fellow med aide, and was called in and questioned on what they were talking about, she said that was their personal business and they had no right to know. She was told that she neded to tell what they discussed or they would write her up again. In disgust, she said that she would just make things easy for them by putting in her two weeks notice, at which she was told that she could jsut go now, which she did. When she wrote her resignation letter, she cited "hostile work environment" as a prime reason for resigning, and it was handed back toher as "unacceptable" She asked why, and said that it just woudn't fly and to just do as you're told. She was basically force to write a resignation letter that said "I resign effective today." with no reason given.
The day she left, I was assigned to the "hallway from hell" and of course had no med aide. I asked SAndy if she wanted to switch again, and we both went to the DONs to negotiate our trade, and were promptly told NO. Shortly afterward, I was told that I had THREE admissions coming in that evening. Now that hallway was bad enough but with not just one but three, it was more than any reasonable person could handle without some help. I asked the ADON's to please give me some help, and was told that this is my floor, I am being paid to be the nurse, that is my job, and sorry about that but I am just going to do my job. Of course, I was so far behind, it was ridiculous, particularly when dealing with an angry family member of one of the new patients who demanded that I detail one of my CNA's to sit with his mother and watch over her so she won't fall out of her chair. He didn't understand why I could not do that...I ecxplained that I have three CNA's to taker care of 36 patients, and that to take one to dedicate solely to one patiend would unfairly burden the remaining staff, but he didn't like it so he took his mother home. I was so far behind that it was past sheift change when I was finally getting to accuchecks and insulin shots, the incoming LVN had to help me get my work done. I went home that night and promptly wrote my resignation letter, came in on my day off and dropped a copy under the administator's and ADON's door. On my way out, I saw a couple of my compadres who asked me what I was doing and when I told them, they said "well it's about time you did!"
I of course had to wait two weeks to finish. Oh before I forget, I was also told that I could not have the vacation timer I had requested weeks before because there weren't enough nurses left. I had planned this vacation for months and was counting on it, so I would have quit anyways just to get the vacation time off.
I was one of three nurses who quit that week, all for basically the same reason, a suddenly hostile work environment. As time went on, it became apparent what was going on. Seems the two ADON's had worked together at other facilities ( and were both asked to LEAVE other facilities as well) and having arrived here at this facility were basically trying to do a favor to some of their friends who neede to make a change by basically making room for them here, and of course the onky way to do that was to run off some folks who were already here. Around two months later, a new DON was finally found (the facility had actually been without a DON for 2 months), the day she started work, the administrator was fired by the owner, the day after that, one of the two ADON's decided that she needed to jump ship, and announced that she would be starting a new job the following day. The new DON unfortunately didn't last but two months before having to resign due to health and family reasons, but a new one was found. This new DON was on duty two weeks when she called in the one remaining ADON who had helped run me off and told her to clear her desk and get out of her facility. So...what goes around comes around.
Point of all this is......when the workplace suddenly becomes hostile, and you are starting to experience harassment and start getting that feeling of "being a target" it really is time to move on, adios, hast la vista baby, bye, let's do this again sometime, don't call me I'll call you...just go. NObody needs to stay in tat kind of environment. We nurses are too valuable a commodity, and why be abused at one place when you can be used somewhre else. Their loss. There's a lot to be said for "choose your battles" but often it's just better to cut your losses and just go.
Oh and by the way, I took my vacation, came back and started a new job that I am still at, and hve no intention of leaving for a long time yet.
rph3664
1,714 Posts
And that's true no matter what line of work you're in.