So Mad I Could Just SCREAM.......

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Specializes in LTC, assisted living, med-surg, psych.

Well, what I've long suspected about the hospital in the town where I work is, in fact, true: DNR indeed does mean "Do Not Treat". The EMTs won't even transport someone to the ER if their advanced directive says "comfort measures only", even if they're in obvious DIScomfort. Why? Because some group of high-ranking muckety-mucks has decided that treating the sick is not a 'cost-effective' use of the hospital's services.:angryfire

I couldn't believe it when I read about this in the newspaper. Then I actually heard about it again from the paramedics I called today for a resident who was having severe back pain from an unknown cause. They were very sympathetic, but they told me the order had come down NOT to transport anyone to the ER unless they were, essentially, a full code and had one foot already in the grave. In other words, if a patient is elderly and/or has a DNR order, the hospital won't even 'treat 'em and street 'em' anymore. They won't even LOOK at them.

I am so angry right now I could spit nails.:devil: Naturally, I don't believe in using the ER as a primary care provider, but for crying out loud, when one of my residents is desperately ill or in pain and I don't know why---and their PCP isn't responsive to their needs---where else are we supposed to turn for help? And God help you if you're over 65 and on Medicaid.......you can't use the ER, but you also won't be able to find a PCP willing to take you anymore. :madface:

The thing that really burns me up is the fact that our Greatest Generation paid into the "system" literally for DECADES, and now when they need help, it's not there for them. In fact, the healthcare conglomerate here in our area treats them like parasites. Unfortunately, the organization is a monopoly, so it's the only game in town. And now it's turned every standard of decency I can think of on its ear: you're welcome to use the ER if you have private insurance and/or are young and 'productive', but if you're elderly, frail, and/or poor, the hell with you.

Yep, this really makes me look forward to old age..........when my body starts failing, I think I'll just walk way, way out into the wilderness and let nature do what it will, as our ancestors used to do when they sensed that their time was near. It beats the heck out of begging for some small share of mercy and being treated like a "useless eater", as one Adolf Hitler used to put it.:angryfire

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So sad,disturbing and frightening. This seems to be getting to be a repeated theme, even here on Allnurses, the devaluation of human life, especially if society deems that life unworthy because of age, life style ,chronic illness . I am continually shocked and dismayed when this type of thinking comes up and slaps one in the face.We really do need to look at ourselves as a society.

Truly does not bode well for the baby boomer generation, unless this attitude can be shunned by people of conscience and then changed by those in power. But nothing will change unless we get back to treating others with basic human decency. Doesn't seem to matter to those who are always screaming about their taxes, how long one has paid into the system. Once one is no longer a "useful" human, they turn into a fiscal burden.

Makes me want to change my avatar.

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Specializes in Medical Surgical.

Very sad and very terrible, but I think we have just begun to see the worst of sort of thing, especially as the Greatest Generation goes and it's the huge Baby Boomer cohort that needs the care. I am always amazed at the attitudes of some health care people. "Do Not Resuscitate" does NOT mean "Don't do anything at all."

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Specializes in ortho/neuro/general surgery.
the thing that really burns me up is the fact that our greatest generation paid into the "system" literally for decades, and now when they need help, it's not there for them. in fact, the healthcare conglomerate here in our area treats them like parasites. unfortunately, the organization is a monopoly, so it's the only game in town. and now it's turned every standard of decency i can think of on its ear: you're welcome to use the er if you have private insurance and/or are young and 'productive', but if you're elderly, frail, and/or poor, the hell with you.

yep, this really makes me look forward to old age..........when my body starts failing, i think i'll just walk way, way out into the wilderness and let nature do what it will, as our ancestors used to do when they sensed that their time was near. it beats the heck out of begging for some small share of mercy and being treated like a "useless eater", as one adolf hitler used to put it.:angryfire

doesn't all this bull violate emtala? can't something be done with regards to that? how will these corporate buttheads feel when their own actions bite them in the you know what? this makes me furious! i can't understand why these creeps get away with this? this is the united states, for crying out loud. refusing to provide care based on ability to pay/ age has got to be illegal. :angryfire:angryfire:angryfire:crying2::crying2:

just found this online at http://www.emtala.com/history

from arrington v. wong, 19 f. supp. 2d 1151 (d.hi. 1998):

""to provide emergency treatment to indigent and uninsured patients, congress enacted the emergency medical treatment and active labor act of 1986 (emtala), commonly known as the patient anti-dumping act, 42 u.s.c. º 1395dd, to prevent "hospitals . . . `dumping' [indigent ] patients . . . by either refusing to provide emergency medical treatment or transfer-ring patients before their conditions were stabilized." james v. sunrise hosp., 86 f.3d 885, 886 (9th cir. 1996) (quoting eberhardt v. city of los angeles, 62 f.3d 1253, 1255 (9th cir. 1995) (internal quotation marks omitted). see also gatewood v. washington healthcare corp., 933 f.2d 1037, 1039 (d.c. cir. 1991) (stating that emtala passed amid growing reports in the 1980's of hospitals denying emergency health care services to the poor and uninsured). the provisions of emtala are not limited to the indigent and uninsured, however. "because [emtala] is clear on its face, we have held `that the act applies to any and all patients, not just to patients with insufficient resources.' " james, 86 f.3d at 887 (quoting brooker v. desert hosp. corp., 947 f.2d 412, 414 (9th cir. 1991)). ""

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Specializes in med-surg.
So sad,disturbing and frightening. This seems to be getting to be a repeated theme, even here on Allnurses, the devaluation of human life, especially if society deems that life unworthy because of age, life style ,chronic illness . I am continually shocked and dismayed when this type of thinking comes up and slaps one in the face.We really do need to look at ourselves as a society.

Truly does not bode well for the baby boomer generation, unless this attitude can be shunned by people of conscience and then changed by those in power. But nothing will change unless we get back to treating others with basic human decency. Doesn't seem to matter to those who are always screaming about their taxes, how long one has paid into the system. Once one is no longer a "useful" human, they turn into a fiscal burden.

Makes me want to change my avatar.

Noooooo! Don't change! Humanity needs you! I need you and your optimism!:bow:

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"Durable Do Not Resuscitate Orders shall not authorize the withholding of other medical interventions, such as intravenous fluids, oxygen or other therapies deemed necessary to provide comfort care or to alleviate pain."

I think you should contact your state Ombudsman and EMS regulatory agency.

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Since we're dealing with the elderly here and it sounds as though this directive possibly originated from the hospital/ED:

http://www.cms.hhs.gov/center/ombudsman.asp

Get the Feds on their case ;)

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This sounds illegal . . . . I'd certainly check further.

steph

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Specializes in ED.

Here in NJ we have had alot of training on this subject. If a person has a DNR we DO NOT RESUSATATE, if we are called for anything else we sill work up like anyone else. A DNR is a DNR not a do not treat.

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Specializes in Case Management, Home Health, UM.
The thing that really burns me up is the fact that our Greatest Generation paid into the "system" literally for DECADES, and now when they need help, it's not there for them. In fact, the healthcare conglomerate here in our area treats them like parasites. Unfortunately, the organization is a monopoly, so it's the only game in town. And now it's turned every standard of decency I can think of on its ear: you're welcome to use the ER if you have private insurance and/or are young and 'productive', but if you're elderly, frail, and/or poor, the hell with you.

Sad, but true... :o

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Sounds like the media needs to get ahold of this.

I'd be calling my local TV stations and tell them what's going on.

Ask them to send someone to do an investigation into it.

It sounds illegal.

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Specializes in CNA, EMT.

They're not providing comfort measures if they're not givin' painkillers!

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