Sick employees in the workplace

[KDSkyy44]

Hello all

I had a question regarding others experiences with their facilities and what is considered appropriate and the norm for nurses and CNAs in healthcare.

6 days ago I came down sick. It started as an irritated cough in my throat. The next morning I was god awfully sick with severe jaw and neck pain that turned into headaches shoulder aches occasionally on and off body aches/joint pain. The cough continued, dry, sometimes productive sometimes not. I eventually almost lost my voice it would come and go or be deep and raspy. I walked into work with a low grade fever. They gave me Tylenol and sent me to work. It is a LTC facility so we are always short staffed and I know I can't call out. I only have once. I got chewed out for even requesting to leave at 10 pm that night if my assignment was done since we usually are sitting around for the last hour anyway. The nurse ended up having to send me home early at 9 that night because she said I looked too sick. I went in the next day with no voice and then mustered through my busy weekend. It's now 6 days later and my days are better but the nights I'm up coughing really bad, in such severe pain I can't sleep, and running fevers runny nose and sometimes green; It was 8 hours of torture. I'm apparently ill enough that I shouldn't be working. I am weak so I tell the aides I need assistance with allllll my transfers so I don't put anyone at risk.

With that said, I was wondering what then constitutes a sick day. How does it work in your facility?

Your insight is appreciated.

[loriangel14, RN]

Where I work you would be sent home pronto with those symptoms.

[BellionRN]

No, I'm saying it because several years ago I wound up getting very ill because someone came in to work febrile, hacking and snotting all over the place. I wound up in the hospital, and the damage I had from the subsequent respiratory infection caused permanent harm. So yeah, I really mean it.

In my experience, people who come in to work that sick aren't doing the rest of us any favors. They're dragging around and need the rest of us to pick up their slack. Just stay home, get better and come back able to work.

Um, yep... totally agree with you. Which is why I pointed out that when I'm sick, I stay home. :) Not disagreeing. Just ranting.

[Been there,done that, ASN, RN]

As is typical in nursing... you are taking care of everyone and everything but yourself. Your symtoms are much concerning. See medical attention and take care of YOURSELf ahead of others.

[BellionRN]

Oh, wait now... I think I see where there may have been offense taken w my post (& I thought I was so careful!!). I mostly meant "higher ups", management, HR, etc when I made the comment about how "everyone always says stay home but what they really mean is..."

[KDSkyy44]

Ok maybe I came off wrong. I am not asking if I should see a doctor nor mentioned if I had or hadn't because my personal condition wasn't the focus of this discussion. All of us in health care don't have to state the obvious of the risk a sick employee is to the rest of the staff and patients.

What I WAS asking was what your PLACE of EMPLOYMENT's policy was or how they handled sick individuals and what they constituted suitable to work or not. At my facility you call in then they determine if you are to come in to be seen by the nurse or the type of sick that should or should not work. They in this case said here's Tylenol go to work. That's their policy. I disagree with this for the obvious above mentioned reasons. Which is why I am irate and asking if this is a common practice in other facilities. I love this facility otherwise so I would hate to leave it if I am going to find myself in the same situation everywhere.

So to rephrase.

What is the call out policy at your facility? Are they generally understanding of their employees taking sick days? How many sick days are you allowed on probationary period? Has your job been or felt threatened for having to call out?

I have never had to call out I have only worked at this facility for 3 months and it goes against the common practice I am familiar with which is, fever = you go home. So I am Shocked, astonished, and upset at what little concern they have for appropriate Infection and disease control and their policy to have you come in regardless. I followed their instructions but I just can't wrap my head around how people can find this acceptable.

My previous career was in veterinary medicine so we didn't have these issues (at this volume nor did we care we wanted you home and if you werent we were mad a sent you home). which is why I thought I would attempt to see how a typical human healthcare institution manages sick employees. If this isn't typical practice I can assure you I will find an alternative....

[KDSkyy44]

Easier said then done to stay home.

While I agree that it's inappropriate to go to work sick & especially contagious, and everyone always says "don't come to work sick, you'll make everyone else sick", what they really mean is "I'm just saying that to sound good... come to work no matter how awful you feel because if you don't you'll be put on a disciplinary program EVEN THOUGH you have accumulated more than enough sick hours by working all the time and are entitled to use them. In addition, we'll ***** & moan & be judgmental about your sick call".

This drives me nuts. We accumulate sick hours based on how many hours we work (like vacation). However, you're only allowed to use 40 hours in a year if you're 50% PPT and 80 hours in a year if you're Full-Time, because "that's the average". Doesn't matter if you're in a temporary full-time position or have a part-time position and work full-time hours, you're still expected to use only 40 hours or less in a year. If you use more than the "average" (not sure who came up with this average...) you get a letter about how you're an awful person for using the sick hours you have banked... and some units even put you in a program where you're not allowed to pick up any OT if you've been sick however much. Now that rule I understand to a certain extent because I've seen some nurses abuse it, for example calling in sick for their scheduled shifts (which they get paid for), and then coming in for a booked OT shift and getting paid the OT rate. However, if you're sick you're sick, you have these hours available to you for a reason. If you don't want them used, why are you allowing us to accumulate & bank them?

I got one of these "bad girl" letters because I had the flu 4 times in a year and I had a back flare-up... I used 70 hours in a year. I was in a temp full-time position for 6 months of this, and the other 6 months I was in my part-time picking up full-time hours... so really I should have been allowed the 80 hours, but no, of course not, that would make sense. When you think about it, even 80 hours in a year isn't very much. Our full-time rotations are 48 hours in 4 days... so if you get the flu (the kind that knocks you on your butt for a week), that's one stretch wrote-off right there.

Anyway! I'm the type that if I'm sick I stay home, because of the reasons mentioned above; I worked in an ICU and didn't want to put my already compromised patients at risk. Now I work in Emerge so I don't feel as bad (jk). I just hate the BS that goes along with calling in sick for your shift... it's annoying and gives me more stress on top of being sick and feeling bad that I'm leaving my co-workers short.

Haha sorry that turned into a rant. Rant over. Proceed.

PS: OP, I hope you're feeling better! Sounds like a miserable time you've been having!

I'm glad you understand. My issue is I'm on probationary period because I new so I'm not allowed to call call out without potentially loosing my job. They sure do say ' don't come sick ' but then you call in sick and they order you in for proof of a fever they see a fever they get more angry. Like wait a minute. I thought I'm not supposed to be here How can I loose my job for getting sick!!!! I can't help that!!!!!

In my other job I was the manager so I didn't have to call out to someone. This was an extremely stressful and awakening event for me. Honestly I can say from this point on I won't let anyone else make that decision for me. I'm with you. If I'm sick I'm sick I'm not going in I certainly did everything in my power to prevent contaminating others. I wore masks always gloves gowns if needed notified the other nurses and aides that I was likely contagious and we managed it the best we could without me having to leave. But to me that's not enough. At particles leak. My performance is poor. It just isn't right.

[lindseylpn]

I've worked places that have downright begged or threatened you when you try to call in sick, they don't care if you're on your deathbed. One place even called in a Coworker when she was on her maternity leave! I miss when I'm sick, maybe once it twice a year but, I'm so nervous when I have to call in. Places shouldn't make you feel like that, especially nursing facilities.

[Racer15, BSN, RN]

I work in the ER. I came in so sick one day that the doc took one look at me and told me he was ordering meds for me. Yet I was not allowed to go home. I've had coworkers come in with the flu, running high fevers, because the were too scared to call in. And at my facility, you have to have 80 hours of sick time built up, so the one time I did call in because I was too weak to get out of bed and had no voice, I had to use a vacation day.

[jadelpn, LPN, EMT-B]

I have never heard of a policy where you go into work, no matter how sick, and another nurse decides if you are too sick to work or not. And gives meds based on that assumption.

In my facility, if you are sick, you call out. You can call the employee health nurse to advise what your symptoms--this is not required, but if one is contagious, if others were contagious, it helps to pre-warn other employees. This nurse doesn't see, diagnose nor treat the illness--you are required to either go to the ER, or see your PCP. If you are out more than three days, you need to get a note from your PCP as to why you were out, and that is OK for you to return to work.

So your facility policy puts an interesting spin on things, as if the nurse who decides it is ok for you to work, gives you a med, and off you go--and something occurs in the facility to you because you are so ill, I would think it a HUGE liability to them. Not to mention the nurse who is making these decisions. Or the patients who are exposed.

If you are a union facility, I would take this to them. Otherwise, I would take it to the DON regarding the safety of this practice, and some ideas on how to make the policy safer and more effective.

[HeatherGurl84]

My philosophy is if you have contagious symptoms (fever, diarrhea) then it is best to stay home. I went to work following a massive sinus surgery and got sent home due to passing out You don't want it to come to that. You and your patients are top priority...

[kbrn2002, ADN, RN]

I complain about my employers pretty much all the time, about pretty much everything but apparently in this at least they are not so bad. I can't believe some of the ridiculous policies I am reading about here! We have a no fault call in policy, which means that I can call in for any reason or no reason and not get questioned about it. The supervisor taking the call isn't allowed to ask why you are calling in, though most people volunteer the information anyway. Sick pay isn't an issue as long as you have it to use, and if not then the day isn't paid. Nobody is expected to work ill, and in fact if you are running a fever, vomiting or admit to diarrhea you are not allowed to work. If you are on an abx you are allowed to return to work 48 hours after your initial dose if you are symptom free. I do know of many instances where the policy wasn't followed, but it has always been because the staff hasn't admitted to being on an abx or having not so obvious symptoms of illness if they didn't have sick time to use and didn't want to miss a day without pay. There is supposedly a policy in place for termination after so many write ups for absences but I don't know of anybody that ever lost their job for call ins.

[Mandychelle79, ASN, RN]

I have worked for companies that if you call off during your first 90 days for ANY reason, including a car accident on your way to work, could lead to your dismissal. People went to work ill all the time. The rule of thumb was if you were sick enough to call off, you better be in the hospital, cause you know doctors will write work excuses for the most minor of illnesses. BUT if you went to work sick and your supervisor sent you home, it wouldnt be counted against you.