RNs tell your hospitals to hire new grads

did i not have anything positive to say about them? if you read my posts you would see that i do have positive things to say about htem. but not every 60+ year old nurse is like your 60+ year old nurses. so great for them if they can still do the lifting and what is required of them...but if they cannot do it, then its time to leave.

i don't care if your 20 years old. if you can't do it, then its not the job for you!! the only time i find it acceptable is the nurses who are pregnant, because its temporary. even then sometimes i think its a little ridiculous...like "you can't push a wheelchair? really?" but hey, i understand! but it's not fair to the people who can do it because we are then required to pick up the extra workload for them. i have enough to deal with, i don't need to be doing everything for another nurses patients as well. our hospital goes by "every patient is your patient"-- yes i know that, but i can't take care of every patient in my unit.

i walk with a limp sue to a severe orthopedic injury, so i am not as fast as you youngsters, but i do keep up. i just can't run. i guess in your world, like a horse, i would be taken out back and shot. hey! the upside is it frees up a spot for a new grad! oh, no, wait it doesn't. you need two years exp. to get on my unit. bummer.

What I find most disturbing about this thread is the attitude that only evaluates an older nurse based on her value as a pack animal or something. Nobody talks about the far more important years of experience, spirit, respect, history etc. It's all about whether or not you can still perform as a beast of burden. How sad.

i walk with a limp sue to a severe orthopedic injury, so i am not as fast as you youngsters, but i do keep up. i just can't run. i guess in your world, like a horse, i would be taken out back and shot. hey! the upside is it frees up a spot for a new grad! oh, no, wait it doesn't. you need two years exp. to get on my unit. bummer.

i'm not expecting them to run, and i could care less if you walk with a limp. im missing my left thumb, i lost it in an accident when i was 17. you think its easy for me to do easy tasks such as drawing up insulin? or drawing up medications for an iv push?? try holding the insulin without your thumb next time. but i can still do it...it just takes me a few seconds longer, the accident is still fairly new (within a few years) so im still trying to learn to do things without it, it's not as easy doing things without a thumb. but what i'm saying is i can still complete the task. unlike these nurses who can't do the task at all. now if i were missing my whole left hand, and everytime i needed to do something that required 2 hands, i would have to ask the help of a pct or another rn, then maybe i need to do something else with my degree. not saying i can't be an rn, but use it somewhere else.

so just because you walk with a limp doesnt mean that you would be "shot out back" on our unit, of course not.

you can still complete the task. and other than a patient coding, why on earth would you have to run?? it's not like i go taking off running when i see a call light go on. i walk like any normal person would. so i have really no idea what your getting at thinking my unit would take you out back and shoot you. they havent shot me yet with my missing thumb.

and yes, alot of units require a 2 year experience, and in my first post on this thread- i agree that is totally fine! some units i think experience is a must. it's up to us as new grads to work our way up to that point. my dream and i mean, my whole life i have wanted to be a flight nurse. would they take me as a new grad? um...no! and i was fine with that, but what can i do in the mean time to work up to that point?? that's what im working on. i was blessed to find someone to give me an opportunity to learn on a floor and gain experience. was it my dream job? nope...but im learning. and i'm learning from the experienced nurses on the floor. so i'm in no way saying that old nurses should back down and give jobs to new grads. because they earned their spot on the floor and earned their job. so yes, i agree its up to us to find them and do things that make us stand out from the experienced nurses.

i do get where others are coming from. it is frustrating when you can't even apply for a job that has experience required. all we are asking is to just look at our application. some new grads can really surprise you at what they have done.

You retire her, give her a good package deal and bennies, and call it a day.

In what fantasy world is that? Some of the state employees - for now - are getting that deal but it's rapidly coming to an end.

At my hospital they kick in $75/month to a 401(k) and that's that.

They'll have to drag me out kicking and screaming...

BTW....I'm curious Jenni811, what's the deal about offering a nurse "bennies." Is that supposed to be cute? I don't get it?

bennies??

I never said anything about that. You got the wrong person my dear.

Also seems it's needed to point out to CNAs that nobody will see you as anything but a CNA who, is to do the duties of a CNA while employed as a CNA. You will never whine someone into doing your job for you. Nobody cares what your appraisal is unless it is related to you and your own job performance.

Same goes for RNs, NPs, MDs.

Yep, and nobody cares if you're "more educated than half the nurses" as backatit mentioned....he/she is a CNA at their job. I am an RN at my job and nobody gives a rat's behind that I was a lawyer for eight years before nursing school, nor do I expect them to defer to me on anything because I am "more educated than them."

This is so typical of the worse of nursing and the most self harmful. Here we are all arguing amongst ourselves when the real issue is this:

That after years of dedicated service and after screwing up their backs the older nurses are just tossed away like garbage. What should happen is that they be trained for jobs like IV teams, Case management, Precepting......

things they can do well that are not as physically demanding.

However, the reality is that if you hurt your back on the job and cannot perform well enough due to that or getting older the hospital will toss you out on your keester.

It is really naive thinking that the hospital will offer a retirement deal or any type of accommodations.

That is the sad reality until nurses quit chewing on each other and band together and demand change from a position of strength.

I never expect to see that day, but maybe these young social networking new fresh nurses will do this. I hope so. Just remember that your fellow nurse is not your enemy, but that it is the corporate owners that are dividing and conquering and laughing all the way to the bank.

this is so typical of the worse of nursing and the most self harmful. here we are all arguing amongst ourselves when the real issue is this:

that after years of dedicated service and after screwing up their backs the older nurses are just tossed away like garbage. what should happen is that they be trained for jobs like iv teams, case management, precepting......

things they can do well that are not as physically demanding.

however, the reality is that if you hurt your back on the job and cannot perform well enough due to that or getting older the hospital will toss you out on your keester.

it is really naive thinking that the hospital will offer a retirement deal or any type of accommodations.

that is the sad reality until nurses quit chewing on each other and band together and demand change from a position of strength.

i never expect to see that day, but maybe these young social networking new fresh nurses will do this. i hope so. just remember that your fellow nurse is not your enemy, but that it is the corporate owners that are dividing and conquering and laughing all the way to the bank.

i agree with you on this. but i think people are not reading what im saying, they are being selective at certain things. i did say that i do not think these nurses should be fired, or forgotten about. i said that these nurses need to go to another job that is more suited for them, and leave the physical demanding work to the nurses who can do it, which will in turn open up some jobs. all im sayin...

I agree with that, but there needs to be some kind of training for new less physical jobs for nurses that have ruined there backs through work. Otherwise they do not have a dream of getting those types of jobs and are stuck at the bedside causing more of a burden for the rest.

Of course, there are a small percentage of nurses of every age that are just laaaaaaaaaazy. But that is a whole nother subject......

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you might want to encourage your hospital to give new grads a chance instead of requiring experience for every job posting they have. maybe be a little more enthusiastic about helping to train them.

this thread is actually pretty comical. it starts out with a very sincere request from a new grad asking established nurses to encourage their hospitals to invest the time and resources to help train them. but then it takes a detour and becomes a thread suggesting that older nurses with diminished physical strength should move out of the way. the overriding theme from the younger nurses seems to be "nope, we're not going out of our way to cover for you if you can't pull your own weight 100%".

it seems like the younger nurses are, understandably, asking for someone to please give them a break. but they don't seem quite so willing to do the same.

i learned a long time ago that score keeping in life and making sure everyone does their fair share will generally make you pretty miserable and crazy. life is not an instant tit-for-tat. the goal is not to start and end each day with a zero balance. at different times and in different situations i will possess the talent or strength needed for the task at hand; other times i will rely on another's unique abilities.

This is a touchy subject for me right now...

Please no flames...

We just had a mass exodus of nurses with an average of 10+ years of experience several months ago. All were replaced by new grads. And it sucks. The best preceptors left, newbies are not getting a good enough orientation, and it has been overall a recipe for disaster. I'm on a busy tele floor, and it's just not the place for a passel of new grads to work. One of my co-workers commented the other night that it's to the point that he's just happy none of his pts have been killed by anyone yet. Having just had a rapid response that should have ended with transfer to higher level of care (but we were out of beds) that was the direct result of a stupid mistake by a rookie nurse, I couldn't really disagree.

Yes, we have a couple of new grads who are outstanding that I'm glad to have on our team. But for the love of Pete, replacing any significant number of "old" nurses with all new grads is SO not the way to go.

It's making it worse for our techs as well, since the new grads are so lacking in time management skills (in gemeral). Most can barely manage to complete their nursing responsibilities in a minimally competent manner, much less have time to help with the more mundane pt care tasks.

So there is no way, even if I had any kind of influence to use, that I would recommend the wholesale replacement of experienced nurses with new grads. There needs to be a balance...like one new grad hired for every three open positions.

I remember what it was like to be a new grad and be applying for any and all positions I could find. Ended up in a job I hated, but which gave me the connections I needed to eventually get the job I love. (Because even with all the crap going on on my floor now, I still love it.)

Old Timer, it's interesting that you made your observation regarding the direction of this thread. I was thinking the same thing. How you can begin by asking senior nurses for a favour, only to later turn around and essentially write them off is unbelievable, and, yes, comical. With that kind of strategy and mindset, it's no wonder some new grads have a challenging time finding work. Hiring managers are very good at picking up on these kinds of inconsistencies during an interview, too.

mama d, very similar happened to me at a previous job. The hospital ran off all of the experienced nurses, especially the experienced RNs, (who of course cost a bit more money) and only hired new grad LPNs. Now thankfully we still had a few of the experienced LPNs there who were mostly amazing, but the new grad LPNs came from a new program that was HORRIBLE. The hospital would staff with just one RN who had her own load of patients and was charge for the floor, with everyone else being LPNs. As long as they had enough RNs to do charge, they were happy. One night I was the only RN on 2 med/surg floors with over 50 patients, I had my own full load of patients, had to do all the admissions, and had to oversee a bunch of new grads who barely knew what they were doing. There was one night that they put a new grad RN in charge with the new grad LPNs, nobody understood why, but it had been specifically assigned by management even though there were 2 experienced RNs on the floor with the experienced RN charge that all had volunteered to drop their assignment and go over there. I remember vividly at 11pm saying, "I guarantee there will be a code down there before 3am." The announcement went overhead at 1am. I finally left before I lost my license, because it was ridiculous.

I'd rather do the heavy lifting and work with people that know what they're doing. Especially since it's rare you meet a nurse with a bad back that got that bad back somewhere other than nursing. New grads, that will likely be YOU with the bad back in a few short years, no matter how careful you think you are.

I agree with that, but there needs to be some kind of training for new less physical jobs for nurses that have ruined there backs through work. Otherwise they do not have a dream of getting those types of jobs and are stuck at the bedside causing more of a burden for the rest.

Of course, there are a small percentage of nurses of every age that are just laaaaaaaaaazy. But that is a whole nother subject......

With some sort of fortitude, the "older nurses" would have gone back to school for MSN or beyond and be away from the bedside as a masters prepared nurse or better yet, AT the bedside.

Not for nothing but, if I had a dime for every ADN nurse who refused to go back to school and just wanted to work forever and collect a check without acknowledging that nursing is like every other vertical I'd be a bazillionaire. Sometimes, getting a BSN, MSN etc will protect your job, keep you relevant etc. Would someone with a BS in Accounting or Finance rest on their laurels? no. Why would a nurse stop at an associates degree.

Things change...evidence based practice didn't exist 30 yrs ago....why would a 30 yr "veteran" nurse not want to adapt. This is NOT directed at those that have...however floor nursing isnt something that is meant to be for people in their 60s/70s. Realistically, like it or not - expecting....heck, feeling entitled to work into your 60s/70s is a massive assumption.

With some sort of fortitude, the "older nurses" would have gone back to school for MSN or beyond and be away from the bedside as a masters prepared nurse or better yet, AT the bedside.

Not for nothing but, if I had a dime for every ADN nurse who refused to go back to school and just wanted to work forever and collect a check without acknowledging that nursing is like every other vertical I'd be a bazillionaire. Sometimes, getting a BSN, MSN etc will protect your job, keep you relevant etc. Would someone with a BS in Accounting or Finance rest on their laurels? no. Why would a nurse stop at an associates degree.

Things change...evidence based practice didn't exist 30 yrs ago....why would a 30 yr "veteran" nurse not want to adapt. This is NOT directed at those that have...however floor nursing isnt something that is meant to be for people in their 60s/70s. Realistically, like it or not - expecting....heck, feeling entitled to work into your 60s/70s is a massive assumption.

IMO, feeling that competent, capable nurses aren't entitled to work into their 60s/70s, and that floor nursing "isn't meant to be for" them is the "massive assumption." Some of the best (and most up-to-date) bedside nurses I've known were in that age group, and running circles around the younger, less experienced nurses. If you're qualified and competent at your job, what is wrong with "working forever and collecting a check"? If employers have a problem with that, rest assured that they will make that clear to their employees! My observation over the years has been that most healthcare employers provide v. little incentive or reward for furthering one's education, so why would anyone expect large numbers of employees to pursue that beyond what is necessary for the job they want?

And where did you get the idea that EBP "didn't exist 30 years ago"? It certainly did when I was in nursing school at that time. We didn't call it "evidence-based practice" -- the buzzword hadn't been invented yet; neither had "critical thinking" (the term) -- but we certainly did both.

I'd really like to understand where some of the "younger" posters get off telling us what type of work we should be doing, or for that matter whether or not we should be working. I don't recall asking whether or not I had anyone's permission to do my job, much less someone younger than my kids.

Just a warning - the more I hear of this, the more I plan on continuing to work way past the age most of you deem appropriate - just so I can be a total pain in the neck and a terror to all the smart aleck youngsters out there! And since I'm a travel nurse, I could show up anywhere - beware!

RN7776 The more you post, the more you reveal that you lack even a rudimentary understanding of nursing in general. (not talking clinical, just the job market) Several of us have corrected your misperceptions already in this thread, and yet you plow doggedly on with blinders intact, instead of contemplating the input given by people who would be most likely to know - those people who actually do the job.

With some sort of fortitude, the "older nurses" would have gone back to school for MSN or beyond and be away from the bedside as a masters prepared nurse or better yet, AT the bedside.

Sure, it would be great if everyone planned ahead like that, however - I would encourage you to do some research about what the word "training" means, and what specific education is needed for every non-bedside working career possibility available to nurses with 30 years on the job.

Can you explain to me with specifics your reasoning that a nurse with a masters AT the bedside would be superior to any other RN at the bedside?

Not for nothing but, if I had a dime for every ADN nurse who refused to go back to school and just wanted to work forever and collect a check without acknowledging that nursing is like every other vertical I'd be a bazillionaire.

Well, since a refusal demands a question and you seem to be so amazingly informed about what goes on in other nurse's heads I'll assume you cruised your workplace nabbing ADNs to ask if they just expected to work forever and continue collecting their checks or get their BSN sorry If you asked me that question I would refuse to go back to school even if I had just secretly finished my DNP and graduation was on Saturday. Not because you're not a good person, just that you would be an irritating person.

Sometimes, getting a BSN, MSN etc will protect your job, keep you relevant etc. Would someone with a BS in Accounting or Finance rest on their laurels? no. Why would a nurse stop at an associates degree.

A degree does not "keep you relevant" YOU keep you relevant. The longer time away from graduation, the more similar the demands between the degrees as things move fast and getting faster every day.

Things change...evidence based practice didn't exist 30 yrs ago....why would a 30 yr "veteran" nurse not want to adapt. This is NOT directed at those that have...however floor nursing isnt something that is meant to be for people in their 60s/70s. Realistically, like it or not - expecting....heck, feeling entitled to work into your 60s/70s is a massive assumption.

It's a massive assumption for you think there is anything appropriate about getting into the business between an employer and an employee. It's a massive assumption that evidence based practice didn't exist 30 yrs ago. Inventing a new buzz-phrase doesn't mean inventing a new thing. That statement only reinforces my thought that your opinion lacks the basic foundational knowledge about the subject matter you need to have before proceeding to make a declaration of fact. :)

Always like new grads, but don't get too smart with those that are experienced. Remember , eventually you will get a job in a hospital. Then you will be reliant upon those of us who have experience. I've seen my share of " deer in the head light new grads". There are good things and bad things about hiring new grads. Hospitals are very short staffed, that means most of us don't have time to teach basics once an rn is on their own . Believe me, if you are a new grad you have a lot to learn !!!! I guess to make a long story short, I want everyone to have a job , but the more new grads they hire, the more difficult my job is. Love to work with a few on the unit but not too many. Experience is the key on a busy short staffed unit. Hospitals know this.

In response to the "massive assumption" about nurses working into their 60s and 70s....it is not for anyone here to decide or judge when people should retire. Or what advanced schooling nurses should have. These are personal choices. Aside from where I currently work, when I was a student, I had a placement in the OR. We had a 69 year old nurse working part time in there who was amazing.

For all you people so quick to judge these older nurses...remember that many of them paved the way.