Physician Bullying of Nurses Reaching Epidemic Levels

Jules A, MSN · May 19, 2015

Oh, good lord.
There isn't a band of bullying and arrogant doctors out there running rampant abusing and disrespecting our nursing profession. This kind of abuse and injustice isn't tolerated in most places. And yes, anger management classes are used.
You're a little over the top there . . . I don't know where you're finding all of these bulling, arrogant, abusive and degrading doctors but I can assure you that out "beautiful and blessed profession" is not "like a horse stable" and that no one is "trampling our rights" or "degrading our profession" "whenever they feel like doing so." This sort of negative behavior is simply not happening all that widely in our profession. Period.

I agree and imo the general whining not only degrades our profession as poor, helpless females who tolerate extreme maltreatment and minimizes the experiences of those who have been subjected to true harassment.

Overall I am a big fan of physicians. I have learned more from their knowledge and generosity than from fellow NPs. Thankfully I have not been subjected to this type of extreme behavior, nor have I witnessed it to others, or I would have attempted to address it swiftly myself and then report to the proper chain of command if that didn't work. Perhaps I have been blessed because although I have been snapped at by physicians, even physicians who I love, I believe that is part of the stress of our field and a far cry from some of the horror stories that people have added here as legitimate instances of harassment. The truth is that sometimes when I was snapped at I was asking or doing something stupid and there have also been times when I was asking or doing something stupid and the dear physicians I have been fortunate to work with were actually kind and helpful when I might have deserved a snark.

calivianya, BSN, RN · May 19, 2015

Oh now please don't generalize about rural hospitals. Maybe YOUR rural hospital was that way but that doesn't mean there is even a tendency for rural hospital to be that way.[/quote']
True, I did stereotype. Sorry about that. I do really believe that any hospital that has a lot of trouble attracting medical staff, for whatever reason, is a lot more likely to put up with abusive behavior from physicians, regardless of whether the hospital is urban or rural. Rural was just the first thing that came to my mind because that is where I first experienced a hospital that could not keep talented physicians.

icuRNmaggie, BSN, RN · May 20, 2015

The author has lost some credibility by basing her book exclusively on the experiences of four NYC ED nurses. That small sample is hardly representative of the profession as a whole. There are also extreme differences in working conditions in different regions. I was hoping she would explain what it is like for a nurse in LTC to pass meds and do treatments for forty to sixty patients or more for twelve hours, or the new grad thrown to the wolves with ten acutely ill Med Surg patients and no resource such as a Charge Nurse. The reality of practicing nursing in 2015 can be horrifying enough without playing up wornout sterotypes like physician abuse and bullying.

Hospitals have changed a lot over the past ten years and the issues facing the profession are extremely complex due to working in a profit driven healthcare system with powerful political interests. We as nurses witness unethical behavior and are expected to provide the illusion of healthcare rather than quality. Nurses in some regions are compelled to use customer service scripts rather than communicate in an open and honest manner. ICU nurses are being told that the standard in the industry is a three to one ratio. God help any nurse who attempts to lead a union effort in a Mid Atlantic or Southern State. Filing a workers compensation claim for an injury is, in most cases a nightmare of being discredited and forced out of a job. Retirement benefits are non existent for many nurses. Our own nursing leaders have been projecting a dire nursing shortage for 15 years. This fallacy has produced an over supply of unemployed new grads and an opportunity for employers to terminate the experienced nurses who have the knowledge to advocate for safe competent care.

Though I believe her intention to be an advocate for the profession is genuine, the articles that I have read are clearly written by a lay person with limited understanding of healthcare.

allnurses Guide · May 20, 2015

The author has lost some credibility by basing her book exclusively on the experiences of four NYC ED nurses. That small sample is hardly representative of the profession as a whole. .

I "Liked" your entire post but when I read this I immediately thought of a book I've mentioned here before.

A good friend was involved in the making of the book as was another old high school acquaintance. It is a great book about a lot of nurses in every possible nursing job you can think of. There is now a documentary about it. The photographer who did the book is a famous one at that who wrote about how much she realized she didn't know about nurses.

I have the book - given to me by my friend. It is very good.

The American Nurse Project

LadyFree28, BSN, LPN, RN · May 21, 2015

I "Liked" your entire post but when I read this I immediately thought of a book I've mentioned here before.
A good friend was involved in the making of the book as was another old high school acquaintance. It is a great book about a lot of nurses in every possible nursing job you can think of. There is now a documentary about it. The photographer who did the book is a famous one at that who wrote about how much she realized she didn't know about nurses.
I have the book - given to me by my friend. It is very good.
The American Nurse Project

^ I definitely will be getting this book ASAP.

I wanted to support the author who actually came on this site to elicit information about nurses; I'm still curious about what is entailed in the book-it may be beneficial to the layperson, less so to us than The American Nurse.

I'll wait...and see... :yes:

Wrench Party · May 23, 2015

Sorry, I don't believe the hype. I did clinicals as a student at multiple teaching hospitals, in the community, and at small rural hospitals and have worked at several different places at this point, and cannot recall ever really being "bullied" by a doctor.

I did have one ED doc fuss me out for sitting in "his" chair and charting, but even that got swiftly shut down by a veteran ED nurse who made him apologize. He had to lance a labial boil and a pilonidal cyst shortly thereafter, so karmically I felt vindicated.

allnurses Guide · May 23, 2015

I'm not sure people truly understand the difference between bullying and simple stressful episodes at work when people are tired or worried and sad.

I worked ER and L&D in a small rural hospital for 9 years. 0245 - 1515. Sometimes you'd have no OB coverage and you'd be the ER nurse. Sometimes the delivery would be a scary shoulder dystocia and the doc would yell out "McRoberts, NOW!" because the baby's heart tones were showing scary decals and we couldn't get that kid out.

I wasn't offended at all. That was one of the scariest births I'd been in up to that point. The doc apologized afterwards and I told him he had nothing to apologize for . . . and I meant it.

I work as a school district nurse now (and hospice). The ZERO TOLERANCE movement has just about ruined kids . . . they can't even do simple horseplay without getting a BULLYING REFERRAL.

And that takes away from real bullying.

(Someone asked me to explain McRoberts).

The McRoberts maneuver is named after William A. McRoberts, Jr. It is employed in case of shoulder dystocia during childbirth and involves hyperflexing the mother's legs tightly to her abdomen. It is effective due to the increased mobility at the sacroiliac joint during pregnancy, allowing rotation of the pelvis and facilitating the release of the fetal shoulder.

Loribabble · May 23, 2015

No bullying from physicians here... have had some wonderful experiences though. Had a nightmare 3 hour "Code Grey" (out of control pt) on my birthday no less! My pt was becoming more and more delusional and her roommate had borderline personality disorder... was NOT a good mix! My favorite doc actually came and sat with my patient to keep her distracted and safe while we worked on getting her a private room while I was also dealing with a rapid response with another of my pts. Once things returned to a state of calm... she went down to the cafeteria and bought me ice cream. It was such a crazy frazzled day and it meant so much to me that she made the time to be in the trenches with us.

On the other hand.... when I was working overseas, my RN supervisor who was also from the US, was a true bully. Oh the stories I could tell about her! I was just one of a long list of those who were run off by her and the board that oversees her refuses to address it and thinks she is just the bees knees.

FurBabyMom, MSN, RN · May 23, 2015

I have seen and experienced this behavior, at previous jobs. I will say that this behavior seems to be "tolerated" in some instances secondary to the attitude of the facility. I have experienced disruptive behavior at my current facility - and it has been dealt with swiftly (surgeons have been sent for counseling/anger management and even lost block time secondary to poor behavior).

This type of stuff makes me immeasurably grateful for the physician coworkers I am privileged to work with every day. They are wonderful, and my entire group of coworkers work so well together. One of the attendings I work with promptly dealt with a medical student who tried to assure me they knew more than I did because I was just a nurse. It was kind of funny how it happened, I didn't even have a chance to defend myself before it was handled by the attending (though, to be honest, they probably handled it more tactfully than I would have, cause I was beyond angry). :)

Kooky Korky, BSN, RN · May 23, 2015

I, too, tire of the frequent 'nurses as victims' themes here on AN. And, physicians are having a lot of struggles in my neck of the woods with a health care system that is squeezing the joy and life blood out of them. They are sometimes being unceremoniously shown the door if they aren't productive enough, or don't kiss up well enough.

Gee, kind of like nurses, huh? Sorry, I don't feel sorry for doctors. I've always worked every bit as hard as any doctor I've ever known, for a whole lot less pay and respect. It's good for them to know how it feels. And I don't care about their debt. They just chose to go into Medicine at a bad time, if they're hoping to get rich.

Kooky Korky, BSN, RN · May 23, 2015

There's a doc I work with that'll walk in and say, "Hi girls!" It makes me want to kick him in the shins.

If just one time you greet him with, "Hi, Boy", he might sit up and take notice.

Or just tell him you are a grown woman or your name is Ms. Nurse or you don't like being called a girl because.... whatever your reason and you would appreciate it if he'd call you.... What is your reason, by the way?

He might not be aware. He might have no idea he's offending you.

allnurses Guide · May 23, 2015

Just have to say again, I have no problem being called a girl. :yes: